Welsh-first road signs may become compulsory

ROAD SIGNS: Some councils have expressed concerns over proposals for Welsh to appear first on bilingual road signs.

ROAD SIGNS: Some councils have expressed concerns over proposals for Welsh to appear first on bilingual road signs.

First published in News
Last updated

AT LEAST three Gwent councils have expressed concerns over proposals for Welsh to appear first on bilingual road signs.

But, following a consultation, Welsh language commissioner Meri Huws is sticking to a list of proposed Welsh language standards for local authorities which cover websites, telephone services, public meetings and other council business.

Newport council had previously said it would be impossible to deliver telephone services equally in Welsh and English, citing the current financial situation and the region’s demographics..

It will be up to the National Assembly to pass the standards, but once passed, they would act as a menu for the commissioner to pick and choose which would legally apply to which authority.

Standards on road signs would likely only apply to new, replacement or temporary signs.

According to a report on the commissioner’s investigation into proposed standards, 12 out of 22 authorities said it would be unreasonable and disproportionate for them to comply with Welsh first on road signs.

Despite an Argus request yesterday, the commissioners’ office didn’t identify the 12. It has been established they include Newport, Caerphilly and Blaenau Gwent.

“The reasons noted for this included the fact there would be cost implications in having to change all the signs, as well as considering the demography of the areas they served,” the report on the investigation said.

The commissioner stuck by the standard, but clarified the Welsh text must be positioned so as to be read first on any new, replacement or temporary signs.

A Newport council spokeswoman said: “Data from the 2011 Census showed only 6.3 per cent of Newport’s population could write, read and speak Welsh.” She added that more than 100 languages were spoken in the city.

Newport City Council feels it would be disproportionate for Welsh to appear first on signage as it would not meet the needs of the vast majority of residents.”

Caerphilly council said it did not support any standard that would enforce either language over the other.

A Monmouthshire spokesman said they were fully in support of bilingual signs, but believe the order of Welsh and English should be a matter for local councils.

Comments (57)

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11:49am Fri 6 Jun 14

Nospin_1 says...

WE must lobby our AMs to vote this down, English is the majority language in Wales, especially in the Southh east

Nye Bevan foresaw this many years ago.
WE must lobby our AMs to vote this down, English is the majority language in Wales, especially in the Southh east Nye Bevan foresaw this many years ago. Nospin_1
  • Score: 51

11:53am Fri 6 Jun 14

Skully says...

Adverts promoting Wales for tourism.
Tourist arrive from foreign countries, with a grasp of English.
Can't understand road signs. Go home and tell others what a
confusing place to visit.
If everybody in Wales spoke Welsh I could understand this, as
most of the residents don't, surely this money could be spent
on something worth while, like fixing the roads, improving drainage
to stop the floods, schools e.t.c.
Welsh language board have to come up with these ideas I suppose,
have to prove they are doing something for Wales and what they are
paid for.
Adverts promoting Wales for tourism. Tourist arrive from foreign countries, with a grasp of English. Can't understand road signs. Go home and tell others what a confusing place to visit. If everybody in Wales spoke Welsh I could understand this, as most of the residents don't, surely this money could be spent on something worth while, like fixing the roads, improving drainage to stop the floods, schools e.t.c. Welsh language board have to come up with these ideas I suppose, have to prove they are doing something for Wales and what they are paid for. Skully
  • Score: 57

12:15pm Fri 6 Jun 14

gog1989 says...

10 counties covering 78% of Wales' surface area already have Welsh language first on signs this will simply standardize that over the whole country, it also won't cost an extra penny as they will only be changed when they need replacing.
10 counties covering 78% of Wales' surface area already have Welsh language first on signs this will simply standardize that over the whole country, it also won't cost an extra penny as they will only be changed when they need replacing. gog1989
  • Score: -55

12:16pm Fri 6 Jun 14

landyman3030 says...

This edict from above just bolsters my opinion that the WAG and Meris have no idea whatsoever of what is going on in Wales or the UK.
Public facilities can closed or be given away, the WAG can spend millions on failing businesses to stop them from closing ( Airport ) or to fund the new ones ( Racetrack ) because private financiers aren't interested, or funding archaic education programs that are failing our youth.
Welsh NHS = a joke if it wasn't so scary a reality that people are dying for lack of funding and beds.
Labour need to learn to stop acting like the three monkeys, open their eyes and listen to what is happening without wasting more money.
If we were private we would be bankrupt by now. 15 years of waste is enough.
This edict from above just bolsters my opinion that the WAG and Meris have no idea whatsoever of what is going on in Wales or the UK. Public facilities can closed or be given away, the WAG can spend millions on failing businesses to stop them from closing ( Airport ) or to fund the new ones ( Racetrack ) because private financiers aren't interested, or funding archaic education programs that are failing our youth. Welsh NHS = a joke if it wasn't so scary a reality that people are dying for lack of funding and beds. Labour need to learn to stop acting like the three monkeys, open their eyes and listen to what is happening without wasting more money. If we were private we would be bankrupt by now. 15 years of waste is enough. landyman3030
  • Score: 38

12:17pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Sing up for the amber boys says...

It can be confusing enough to spot road signs as it is, without the added confusion of them being in Welsh first. If it's in West Wales in a Welsh speaking area, I could understand it but epousing a one size fits all approach to the whole country is stupid. Stop this waste of money nonsense
It can be confusing enough to spot road signs as it is, without the added confusion of them being in Welsh first. If it's in West Wales in a Welsh speaking area, I could understand it but epousing a one size fits all approach to the whole country is stupid. Stop this waste of money nonsense Sing up for the amber boys
  • Score: 54

12:19pm Fri 6 Jun 14

KarloMarko says...

Who cares if Welsh is a minority of a minority language in S.E.Wales?

Our life mission and ALL we care about is the TOKENISM of "Welsh" first, no matter what the cost, no matter how little used! And no matter Jill Evans MEP Plaid was nearly out on her bum...

Now, be very quiet and eat up all your Cawl!
Who cares if Welsh is a minority of a minority language in S.E.Wales? Our life mission and ALL we care about is the TOKENISM of "Welsh" first, no matter what the cost, no matter how little used! And no matter Jill Evans MEP Plaid was nearly out on her bum... Now, be very quiet and eat up all your Cawl! KarloMarko
  • Score: -3

12:49pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Jiffy56 says...

I'm passionate about the language, so much so I've been learning it for 4 years or more, but when you're travelling outside your know areas to follow road signs with Welsh first would be more difficult, and dangerous keep English first. The same goes with bi-lingual forms, some forms are difficult enough to fill in without having to work around Welsh.
I'm passionate about the language, so much so I've been learning it for 4 years or more, but when you're travelling outside your know areas to follow road signs with Welsh first would be more difficult, and dangerous keep English first. The same goes with bi-lingual forms, some forms are difficult enough to fill in without having to work around Welsh. Jiffy56
  • Score: 40

12:51pm Fri 6 Jun 14

-trigg- says...

As I've argued before, the issue isn't how many people claim to be able to speak Welsh, but the amount of people who can speak Welsh _but not English_. These are the only people who would actually benefit from dual language signs, for anyone else, they are simply needless duplication and additional costs.
As I've argued before, the issue isn't how many people claim to be able to speak Welsh, but the amount of people who can speak Welsh _but not English_. These are the only people who would actually benefit from dual language signs, for anyone else, they are simply needless duplication and additional costs. -trigg-
  • Score: 39

1:05pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Sometimes says...

It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again?

Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why?
It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again? Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why? Sometimes
  • Score: 27

1:09pm Fri 6 Jun 14

westsi1983 says...

I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue.

Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name...
I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue. Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name... westsi1983
  • Score: -27

1:11pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Grüngemüse says...

There will be no satisfying the fanatics. Give in to this then the next demand will pop up.
The, then, Welsh Office abdicated responsibility early on by allowing councils to choose how to manage signs. Imagine if all road signs were locally managed, we'd have the amateurish mess as in the United States.
If we really have to have bilingual signs let's do it intelligently, like the Irish - English first then Gaelic in slightly smaller "Gaelic" font.
Sensible and charming.
There will be no satisfying the fanatics. Give in to this then the next demand will pop up. The, then, Welsh Office abdicated responsibility early on by allowing councils to choose how to manage signs. Imagine if all road signs were locally managed, we'd have the amateurish mess as in the United States. If we really have to have bilingual signs let's do it intelligently, like the Irish - English first then Gaelic in slightly smaller "Gaelic" font. Sensible and charming. Grüngemüse
  • Score: 22

1:11pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Javez says...

I'd agree with Welsh being first in any county or region, just as long as Welsh is the primary language in that county or region. If more people use English, it's logical to put English first.

This is especially true if we want to encourage tourism to Wales (which seems currently to eb the only growth industry).

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face....
I'd agree with Welsh being first in any county or region, just as long as Welsh is the primary language in that county or region. If more people use English, it's logical to put English first. This is especially true if we want to encourage tourism to Wales (which seems currently to eb the only growth industry). Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.... Javez
  • Score: 26

1:21pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Llanmartinangel says...

It never stops does it. Around 3% speak it, yet they have over £100 m a year spent on broadcasting virtually no-one accesses, kids of parents who would prefer their education time spent on more useful subjects have that choice removed by law and now this. You'd think the place was awash with money for which there was no better use. Idiots.
It never stops does it. Around 3% speak it, yet they have over £100 m a year spent on broadcasting virtually no-one accesses, kids of parents who would prefer their education time spent on more useful subjects have that choice removed by law and now this. You'd think the place was awash with money for which there was no better use. Idiots. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 33

1:45pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Walter Devereux says...

Sometimes wrote:
It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again?

Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why?
Don't call Monmouthshire "Gwent" as you've giving in to them!

Monmouthshire has a history quite distinct from Wales proper, and its about time the powers that be realised this.
[quote][p][bold]Sometimes[/bold] wrote: It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again? Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why?[/p][/quote]Don't call Monmouthshire "Gwent" as you've giving in to them! Monmouthshire has a history quite distinct from Wales proper, and its about time the powers that be realised this. Walter Devereux
  • Score: 13

1:57pm Fri 6 Jun 14

-trigg- says...

westsi1983 wrote:
I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue. Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name...
If we're going to use the original names for places, should we start calling Newport "Isca Augusta". After all, that's the name of the Roman settlement that it grew from.
[quote][p][bold]westsi1983[/bold] wrote: I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue. Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name...[/p][/quote]If we're going to use the original names for places, should we start calling Newport "Isca Augusta". After all, that's the name of the Roman settlement that it grew from. -trigg-
  • Score: 27

2:07pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Brynglas Tunneller says...

It's bad enough, as it is, for people who live here let alone tourists who, with the current signs dictat, think that there are twice as many places in the direction that are heading than there in fact are.
Let's just have the one name on the signs-in Welsh-and then see how helpful that is for everyone. And, while 'they' are at it, let's have all the motorway 'information' signs, 'don't drink and drive' 'It's raining' it's windy', 'poor driving conditions', 'sign under test' etc., just in Welsh. Thatt should be extremely helpful as it willl boost the number of people that can read Welsh and also mean that I don't have to risk almost certain death straining my eyes through the lashing rain to work out what the blasted waste-of-space signs are actually saying as I'll know that even If I could see them I won't know what earth they are telling me...
It's bad enough, as it is, for people who live here let alone tourists who, with the current signs dictat, think that there are twice as many places in the direction that are heading than there in fact are. Let's just have the one name on the signs-in Welsh-and then see how helpful that is for everyone. And, while 'they' are at it, let's have all the motorway 'information' signs, 'don't drink and drive' 'It's raining' it's windy', 'poor driving conditions', 'sign under test' etc., just in Welsh. Thatt should be extremely helpful as it willl boost the number of people that can read Welsh and also mean that I don't have to risk almost certain death straining my eyes through the lashing rain to work out what the blasted waste-of-space signs are actually saying as I'll know that even If I could see them I won't know what earth they are telling me... Brynglas Tunneller
  • Score: 19

2:07pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Granny Annie says...

These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh?
These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh? Granny Annie
  • Score: 25

2:24pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Cymro79 says...

I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!!
I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!! Cymro79
  • Score: -27

2:28pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Walter Devereux says...

The problem is self-evident to anyone without an agenda: Road signs are not a political tool they are supposed to be functional. Regardless of any massaged statistics, English is by far the dominant language and frankly always will be in Britain. Signs should reflect that.
The problem is self-evident to anyone without an agenda: Road signs are not a political tool they are supposed to be functional. Regardless of any massaged statistics, English is by far the dominant language and frankly always will be in Britain. Signs should reflect that. Walter Devereux
  • Score: 29

2:37pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Cymro79 says...

So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-)
So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-) Cymro79
  • Score: -28

2:42pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Walter Devereux says...

Cymro79 wrote:
So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-)
And here come the straw-man arguments! No-one has said anything about banning anything. This is about priorities. I have no problem with signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali or anything else so long as they are proportionate to the number of speakers; exactly the same argument as should be applied to Welsh.
[quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-)[/p][/quote]And here come the straw-man arguments! No-one has said anything about banning anything. This is about priorities. I have no problem with signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali or anything else so long as they are proportionate to the number of speakers; exactly the same argument as should be applied to Welsh. Walter Devereux
  • Score: 20

2:45pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Cymro79 says...

Wales should have both Welsh and English on its signs. The fact that people are moaning that Welsh should be first or Welsh should be first is stupid. We can all read in either one of these languages so who cares!
Wales should have both Welsh and English on its signs. The fact that people are moaning that Welsh should be first or Welsh should be first is stupid. We can all read in either one of these languages so who cares! Cymro79
  • Score: -21

2:50pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Llanmartinangel says...

Walter Devereux wrote:
The problem is self-evident to anyone without an agenda: Road signs are not a political tool they are supposed to be functional. Regardless of any massaged statistics, English is by far the dominant language and frankly always will be in Britain. Signs should reflect that.
Quite right. No-one ever called Usk 'Brynbuga'. Signs convey a locality of how a place is best known. That's all they need do.
[quote][p][bold]Walter Devereux[/bold] wrote: The problem is self-evident to anyone without an agenda: Road signs are not a political tool they are supposed to be functional. Regardless of any massaged statistics, English is by far the dominant language and frankly always will be in Britain. Signs should reflect that.[/p][/quote]Quite right. No-one ever called Usk 'Brynbuga'. Signs convey a locality of how a place is best known. That's all they need do. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 27

3:07pm Fri 6 Jun 14

KarloMarko says...

My grandfather put his head on the railway line so people could speak Welsh in Newport. His head bounced all the way to Severn Tunnel as he shouted, "Viva Shirley Bassey...Vote Plaid! "

The struggle continues.

Respect!
My grandfather put his head on the railway line so people could speak Welsh in Newport. His head bounced all the way to Severn Tunnel as he shouted, "Viva Shirley Bassey...Vote Plaid! " The struggle continues. Respect! KarloMarko
  • Score: -14

3:13pm Fri 6 Jun 14

landyman3030 says...

Cymro79 wrote:
I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!!
In a few more years Cymro79 says.....
How many years already has Welsh been mandatory in the schools in Wales at a cost of millions? Over a decade i believe. And the achievement is that for the vast majority it is NEVER used outside of the classroom in South East, North and along the Eastern border.
People will come on here and cite endless Ysgol Cymraeg who have after school clubs or meetings in Welsh. But that is not the majority who are in English medium schools.
Resources are not just limited, they are NON-EXISTENT in Education today in many subjects.
Don't cite that more will speak it in the south east when it is schoolboy language at best and never likely to progress.
What a waste of time and resources.
Yet again the WAG try and steam roller laws in to muddy the waters and pretend they are worth something when Welsh NHS lack of funding is KILLING people.
Vote for Labour because my father did? My arse.
[quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!![/p][/quote]In a few more years Cymro79 says..... How many years already has Welsh been mandatory in the schools in Wales at a cost of millions? Over a decade i believe. And the achievement is that for the vast majority it is NEVER used outside of the classroom in South East, North and along the Eastern border. People will come on here and cite endless Ysgol Cymraeg who have after school clubs or meetings in Welsh. But that is not the majority who are in English medium schools. Resources are not just limited, they are NON-EXISTENT in Education today in many subjects. Don't cite that more will speak it in the south east when it is schoolboy language at best and never likely to progress. What a waste of time and resources. Yet again the WAG try and steam roller laws in to muddy the waters and pretend they are worth something when Welsh NHS lack of funding is KILLING people. Vote for Labour because my father did? My arse. landyman3030
  • Score: 27

3:45pm Fri 6 Jun 14

welshmen says...

About time to, and just to make sure we all know where we are, print all benefit forms in Welsh only, encourage immigrants from Plaid Cymru's Immigration policy to go to England....
About time to, and just to make sure we all know where we are, print all benefit forms in Welsh only, encourage immigrants from Plaid Cymru's Immigration policy to go to England.... welshmen
  • Score: 0

4:11pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Owen Jackson says...

I live in Conwy Council in the North and have Welsh priority road signs and it's not such a big deal. Even though it's welsh priority it's barely noticeable so stop complaining.
I live in Conwy Council in the North and have Welsh priority road signs and it's not such a big deal. Even though it's welsh priority it's barely noticeable so stop complaining. Owen Jackson
  • Score: -13

4:32pm Fri 6 Jun 14

KarloMarko says...

The Argus ITSELF should be printed both in Welsh and English. Think of the increased sales in Ringland to our enthusiastic young harp players! Think how attractive we would be to tourists (and Nato) if we all wore top hats and carried a miners lamp. And thats just the kids.

Its a win win no brainer.
The Argus ITSELF should be printed both in Welsh and English. Think of the increased sales in Ringland to our enthusiastic young harp players! Think how attractive we would be to tourists (and Nato) if we all wore top hats and carried a miners lamp. And thats just the kids. Its a win win no brainer. KarloMarko
  • Score: 6

4:46pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Floppy backed says...

Of course there are financial implications - on replacing signs they will need to be bigger for start that pretty obvious.

Then you need to use someone to check the spelling and the correct grammer.

Extra lettering.

This is not an extra £10 from the sign company - obviously someone who says there's little cost doesnt run a business or have a clue - everything costs and its not an extra £1.

In a country that is on its knees, cut backs, more pot holes than I've ever seen and my childrens education poor. What a complete waste of my council tax and funds. As for tourism - toilets, being able to read the signs by the immense overgrowth of foliage covering sign boards would be an improvement, decent roads - talk about doing things backwards.

Anymore of this welsh language c@@p and we are moving over to England and taking our business there too as we are going backwards while England is moving forward!
Of course there are financial implications - on replacing signs they will need to be bigger for start that pretty obvious. Then you need to use someone to check the spelling and the correct grammer. Extra lettering. This is not an extra £10 from the sign company - obviously someone who says there's little cost doesnt run a business or have a clue - everything costs and its not an extra £1. In a country that is on its knees, cut backs, more pot holes than I've ever seen and my childrens education poor. What a complete waste of my council tax and funds. As for tourism - toilets, being able to read the signs by the immense overgrowth of foliage covering sign boards would be an improvement, decent roads - talk about doing things backwards. Anymore of this welsh language c@@p and we are moving over to England and taking our business there too as we are going backwards while England is moving forward! Floppy backed
  • Score: 14

9:46pm Fri 6 Jun 14

gingertom says...

WAG sort out the NHS that is your priority not this and carrier bags.
WAG sort out the NHS that is your priority not this and carrier bags. gingertom
  • Score: 10

11:51pm Fri 6 Jun 14

charlie, newport says...

Unfortunately until every road sign is in need of replacement we will have some with English first and some with Welsh first. Including a different language order for signs on the same road at different distances from the junction. How many years/decades will that go on for? Not very helpful for visitors or people who speak either language...
Unfortunately until every road sign is in need of replacement we will have some with English first and some with Welsh first. Including a different language order for signs on the same road at different distances from the junction. How many years/decades will that go on for? Not very helpful for visitors or people who speak either language... charlie, newport
  • Score: 4

1:18am Sat 7 Jun 14

Jane J says...

Granny Annie wrote:
These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh?
Do British people stray across the road every time they see a road sign abroad where the English is not at the top? No, of course they don't.
And besides, most road signs are pictures anyway.
Is seeing "Croeso i Gymru" before "Welcome to Wales" going to make you crash your car? If so, you shouldn't really be driving.
[quote][p][bold]Granny Annie[/bold] wrote: These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh?[/p][/quote]Do British people stray across the road every time they see a road sign abroad where the English is not at the top? No, of course they don't. And besides, most road signs are pictures anyway. Is seeing "Croeso i Gymru" before "Welcome to Wales" going to make you crash your car? If so, you shouldn't really be driving. Jane J
  • Score: -4

10:09am Sat 7 Jun 14

scraptheWAG says...

good god its no wonder wales is the poorest country in western europe and we are bottom of league going what alot of absolute nonsence
good god its no wonder wales is the poorest country in western europe and we are bottom of league going what alot of absolute nonsence scraptheWAG
  • Score: 11

10:51am Sat 7 Jun 14

varteg1 says...

Ms Hughes has a very substantial salary to justify.

Says it all ...yes?
Ms Hughes has a very substantial salary to justify. Says it all ...yes? varteg1
  • Score: 10

7:08pm Sat 7 Jun 14

Ollie254 says...

-trigg- wrote:
westsi1983 wrote:
I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue. Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name...
If we're going to use the original names for places, should we start calling Newport "Isca Augusta". After all, that's the name of the Roman settlement that it grew from.
Yes....I'd prefer to use Latin than welsh
[quote][p][bold]-trigg-[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]westsi1983[/bold] wrote: I would have issue with this for signs conveying instructions or safety related information. But directional information signs should be monolingual for the name of the place in the native tongue. Why should Welsh places have english names when they have always had and always will have a Welsh one? I can understand a common usage argument, but how can Welsh people celebrate the welsh heritage of their town when it is stripped of its Welsh identity - its name...[/p][/quote]If we're going to use the original names for places, should we start calling Newport "Isca Augusta". After all, that's the name of the Roman settlement that it grew from.[/p][/quote]Yes....I'd prefer to use Latin than welsh Ollie254
  • Score: 15

6:49pm Mon 9 Jun 14

Mervyn James says...

KarloMarko wrote:
The Argus ITSELF should be printed both in Welsh and English. Think of the increased sales in Ringland to our enthusiastic young harp players! Think how attractive we would be to tourists (and Nato) if we all wore top hats and carried a miners lamp. And thats just the kids.

Its a win win no brainer.
You might have a point, but from what we know they still struggle with English..... what they use now is a form of chavese' or something.
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: The Argus ITSELF should be printed both in Welsh and English. Think of the increased sales in Ringland to our enthusiastic young harp players! Think how attractive we would be to tourists (and Nato) if we all wore top hats and carried a miners lamp. And thats just the kids. Its a win win no brainer.[/p][/quote]You might have a point, but from what we know they still struggle with English..... what they use now is a form of chavese' or something. Mervyn James
  • Score: 2

4:46pm Tue 10 Jun 14

maryjj says...

Living in Wales is like living in a dictatorship where the welsh language is concerned. It is thrust upon us every where you turn whether we like it or not. Receptionist's are forced to say hello in Welsh even if they can't speak it, organisations have to have a welsh automated message, cash machines have to have the welsh language option, leaflets have to be in welsh etc., etc., etc.. Such a waste of resources.
School children are forced to take it as a compulsory subject up to GCSE level sometimes at the cost of other skills such as basic English and maths. The majority of children despise the lessons and struggle only to achieve a colossal fail in their exam. All those wasted hours. Even those who are good at it openly admit they couldn't use it outside of the classroom. On top of this they now have to study the Welsh baccalaureate right through A levels, without freedom of choice, when they should be focusing on excellence in order to get into an English university. What is the point of a welsh qualification when the students see no value?
I was born and bred in Wales and feel there is little to be proud of at the moment. We have a history of poverty and hardship which is nothing to celebrate and has never changed. Welsh bureaucrat's should sort out it's shortcomings and do something that will add value to actually being Welsh and living in Wales before harping on about token welsh gestures, that have absolutely no significance to our daily lives or happiness.
Living in Wales is like living in a dictatorship where the welsh language is concerned. It is thrust upon us every where you turn whether we like it or not. Receptionist's are forced to say hello in Welsh even if they can't speak it, organisations have to have a welsh automated message, cash machines have to have the welsh language option, leaflets have to be in welsh etc., etc., etc.. Such a waste of resources. School children are forced to take it as a compulsory subject up to GCSE level sometimes at the cost of other skills such as basic English and maths. The majority of children despise the lessons and struggle only to achieve a colossal fail in their exam. All those wasted hours. Even those who are good at it openly admit they couldn't use it outside of the classroom. On top of this they now have to study the Welsh baccalaureate right through A levels, without freedom of choice, when they should be focusing on excellence in order to get into an English university. What is the point of a welsh qualification when the students see no value? I was born and bred in Wales and feel there is little to be proud of at the moment. We have a history of poverty and hardship which is nothing to celebrate and has never changed. Welsh bureaucrat's should sort out it's shortcomings and do something that will add value to actually being Welsh and living in Wales before harping on about token welsh gestures, that have absolutely no significance to our daily lives or happiness. maryjj
  • Score: 12

4:58pm Tue 10 Jun 14

maryjj says...

Cymro79 wrote:
I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!!
The number of children who are forced to learn Welsh is on the up, Whether they can actually speak, write or understand it is another matter. For us older Welsh citizens - we are not ignorant. I was never taught the language in Wales and have never had the inclination, time or money to learn it as an adult. I also have never had the need to speak it for the last 40 years living in Wales. However, the French and German I learned in school stood me in good stead when I moved to Belgium!
[quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!![/p][/quote]The number of children who are forced to learn Welsh is on the up, Whether they can actually speak, write or understand it is another matter. For us older Welsh citizens - we are not ignorant. I was never taught the language in Wales and have never had the inclination, time or money to learn it as an adult. I also have never had the need to speak it for the last 40 years living in Wales. However, the French and German I learned in school stood me in good stead when I moved to Belgium! maryjj
  • Score: 13

11:00pm Tue 10 Jun 14

varteg1 says...

Jane J wrote:
Granny Annie wrote:
These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh?
Do British people stray across the road every time they see a road sign abroad where the English is not at the top? No, of course they don't.
And besides, most road signs are pictures anyway.
Is seeing "Croeso i Gymru" before "Welcome to Wales" going to make you crash your car? If so, you shouldn't really be driving.
As a regular continental driver, I agree with you in part. Where I differ is in this...when a Brit crosses the Channel he has two considerations, the first driving on the right, the second having to cope with, ( in my case) the French language.
This puts me on high alert, so I take extra care. However, the French language soon becomes familiar as most directions and instructions are comprised of words that have almost identical structure and spellings to their English equivalents.

Where it comes apart is when Continentals arrive here fully expecting to see signage in English then to be faced with not only having to drive on the left, but needing to come to terms with a language so alien to them they may well get confused, misdirected, and lose concentration.

In the regions of France where local languages are extant, the signage gives high predominance to French, with the secondary languages much less conspicuous.

Not only that, but much of our road signs are painted in large text on the surface of the road, again when in Cymraeg distinctly possible to mislead and confuse to someone who has never met the language, whereas most Continentals are relatively fluent in English so can easily adapt to signage in English
[quote][p][bold]Jane J[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Granny Annie[/bold] wrote: These road signs with Welsh first then English are dangerous! By the time you read to the bottom you may have strayed across the road and into the path of an oncoming vehicle. Yes I know we are in Wales but with the majority of people here only speaking English wouldn't it make more sense to keep the English first and then Welsh?[/p][/quote]Do British people stray across the road every time they see a road sign abroad where the English is not at the top? No, of course they don't. And besides, most road signs are pictures anyway. Is seeing "Croeso i Gymru" before "Welcome to Wales" going to make you crash your car? If so, you shouldn't really be driving.[/p][/quote]As a regular continental driver, I agree with you in part. Where I differ is in this...when a Brit crosses the Channel he has two considerations, the first driving on the right, the second having to cope with, ( in my case) the French language. This puts me on high alert, so I take extra care. However, the French language soon becomes familiar as most directions and instructions are comprised of words that have almost identical structure and spellings to their English equivalents. Where it comes apart is when Continentals arrive here fully expecting to see signage in English then to be faced with not only having to drive on the left, but needing to come to terms with a language so alien to them they may well get confused, misdirected, and lose concentration. In the regions of France where local languages are extant, the signage gives high predominance to French, with the secondary languages much less conspicuous. Not only that, but much of our road signs are painted in large text on the surface of the road, again when in Cymraeg distinctly possible to mislead and confuse to someone who has never met the language, whereas most Continentals are relatively fluent in English so can easily adapt to signage in English varteg1
  • Score: 12

11:24pm Tue 10 Jun 14

varteg1 says...

Walter Devereux wrote:
Sometimes wrote:
It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again?

Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why?
Don't call Monmouthshire "Gwent" as you've giving in to them!

Monmouthshire has a history quite distinct from Wales proper, and its about time the powers that be realised this.
If I am not mistaken, is Gwent not a diminution and contraction of Caerwent, (windy castle?) from the Latin Venta Silurum (+ camp. castle or settlement. hence Caer)

Contracted into the 'Kingdom of Gwent' which was basically a Silurian realm peopled by late Silures, not quite Cymro according to history. More derived from the so called 'Black Spanish' peoples who were Iron Age immigrants, ....supposedly.
[quote][p][bold]Walter Devereux[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Sometimes[/bold] wrote: It's about time we had a referendum on Gwent becoming independent from Wales, lets face it, they don't represent the vast majority of Gwent peoples views on any subject as they can't see past Cardiff. And don't forget that the WAG were only introduced with a majority of less than 1%, when are we to get another referendum on whether we still want the WAG, (not about more powers like the last one). When they kept losing the vote for a WAG they had a referendum every 15 years or so, so why not again? Being Welsh is not just about a dead language or for that fact about the last 150 years. It did exist long before the language and the industrial revolution existed, but some minorities within wales use these two areas as an excuse to bully the majority into doing things, they don't want or need. I would rather pay for health care for the elderly than road signs in welsh, ask any council and they will tell you that it costs more for signs in Wales than in England...I wonder why?[/p][/quote]Don't call Monmouthshire "Gwent" as you've giving in to them! Monmouthshire has a history quite distinct from Wales proper, and its about time the powers that be realised this.[/p][/quote]If I am not mistaken, is Gwent not a diminution and contraction of Caerwent, (windy castle?) from the Latin Venta Silurum (+ camp. castle or settlement. hence Caer) Contracted into the 'Kingdom of Gwent' which was basically a Silurian realm peopled by late Silures, not quite Cymro according to history. More derived from the so called 'Black Spanish' peoples who were Iron Age immigrants, ....supposedly. varteg1
  • Score: 3

11:35pm Tue 10 Jun 14

varteg1 says...

Floppy backed wrote:
Of course there are financial implications - on replacing signs they will need to be bigger for start that pretty obvious.

Then you need to use someone to check the spelling and the correct grammer.

Extra lettering.

This is not an extra £10 from the sign company - obviously someone who says there's little cost doesnt run a business or have a clue - everything costs and its not an extra £1.

In a country that is on its knees, cut backs, more pot holes than I've ever seen and my childrens education poor. What a complete waste of my council tax and funds. As for tourism - toilets, being able to read the signs by the immense overgrowth of foliage covering sign boards would be an improvement, decent roads - talk about doing things backwards.

Anymore of this welsh language c@@p and we are moving over to England and taking our business there too as we are going backwards while England is moving forward!
I reported some time ago re a sign on the M4.. A sign in England with approximately the same number of letters in it's message I discovered cost something in the order of 250Pounds at the time

A sign ion this side if the bridges was nearly four times that cost. and when I question why the information given to me was.. the sign has to be at least twice as big, maybe even larger according to the fact that translation often means far more letters in Cymraeg to say the samm in English.

Then comes the size of the supporting structure, which has to be more securely bedded in concrete, and with much larger framework all to ensure that the wind pressures can be contained,

I have mentioned this before elsewhere, and it soon shuts the language brigade up as that is one aspect of their demands that cannot be argued against....cost.
[quote][p][bold]Floppy backed[/bold] wrote: Of course there are financial implications - on replacing signs they will need to be bigger for start that pretty obvious. Then you need to use someone to check the spelling and the correct grammer. Extra lettering. This is not an extra £10 from the sign company - obviously someone who says there's little cost doesnt run a business or have a clue - everything costs and its not an extra £1. In a country that is on its knees, cut backs, more pot holes than I've ever seen and my childrens education poor. What a complete waste of my council tax and funds. As for tourism - toilets, being able to read the signs by the immense overgrowth of foliage covering sign boards would be an improvement, decent roads - talk about doing things backwards. Anymore of this welsh language c@@p and we are moving over to England and taking our business there too as we are going backwards while England is moving forward![/p][/quote]I reported some time ago re a sign on the M4.. A sign in England with approximately the same number of letters in it's message I discovered cost something in the order of 250Pounds at the time A sign ion this side if the bridges was nearly four times that cost. and when I question why the information given to me was.. the sign has to be at least twice as big, maybe even larger according to the fact that translation often means far more letters in Cymraeg to say the samm in English. Then comes the size of the supporting structure, which has to be more securely bedded in concrete, and with much larger framework all to ensure that the wind pressures can be contained, I have mentioned this before elsewhere, and it soon shuts the language brigade up as that is one aspect of their demands that cannot be argued against....cost. varteg1
  • Score: 13

9:09am Wed 11 Jun 14

-trigg- says...

the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner?
the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner? -trigg-
  • Score: 11

10:06am Wed 11 Jun 14

altom23 says...

I see that farteg1 O dear .. sorry varteg1 is on his hobby horse once again!
I see that farteg1 O dear .. sorry varteg1 is on his hobby horse once again! altom23
  • Score: -6

1:06pm Wed 11 Jun 14

mills191184 says...

-trigg- wrote:
the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner?
How do you explain the subsidy the BBC gets despite people having to pay a tv license, of the train operators despite travellers having to pay for tickets to travel.
[quote][p][bold]-trigg-[/bold] wrote: the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner?[/p][/quote]How do you explain the subsidy the BBC gets despite people having to pay a tv license, of the train operators despite travellers having to pay for tickets to travel. mills191184
  • Score: -2

1:09pm Wed 11 Jun 14

mills191184 says...

maryjj wrote:
Cymro79 wrote:
I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!!
The number of children who are forced to learn Welsh is on the up, Whether they can actually speak, write or understand it is another matter. For us older Welsh citizens - we are not ignorant. I was never taught the language in Wales and have never had the inclination, time or money to learn it as an adult. I also have never had the need to speak it for the last 40 years living in Wales. However, the French and German I learned in school stood me in good stead when I moved to Belgium!
Your an idiot, to be quite frank!

A child learns English is that child then forced to speak English or does this argument only apply to the Welsh language.

How did you know you would never use Welsh? You didn't nor did you know you'll move to Belgium
[quote][p][bold]maryjj[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!![/p][/quote]The number of children who are forced to learn Welsh is on the up, Whether they can actually speak, write or understand it is another matter. For us older Welsh citizens - we are not ignorant. I was never taught the language in Wales and have never had the inclination, time or money to learn it as an adult. I also have never had the need to speak it for the last 40 years living in Wales. However, the French and German I learned in school stood me in good stead when I moved to Belgium![/p][/quote]Your an idiot, to be quite frank! A child learns English is that child then forced to speak English or does this argument only apply to the Welsh language. How did you know you would never use Welsh? You didn't nor did you know you'll move to Belgium mills191184
  • Score: -13

3:50pm Wed 11 Jun 14

landyman3030 says...

altom23 wrote:
I see that farteg1 O dear .. sorry varteg1 is on his hobby horse once again!
So would you be of the pro welsh opinion or just the trolling with nothing useful to say persuasion?
[quote][p][bold]altom23[/bold] wrote: I see that farteg1 O dear .. sorry varteg1 is on his hobby horse once again![/p][/quote]So would you be of the pro welsh opinion or just the trolling with nothing useful to say persuasion? landyman3030
  • Score: 6

4:32pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Llanmartinangel says...

With less than 1% of people here accessing Welsh language broadcasting, less than 3% using the 'Welsh ' option on something as simple as bank machine, and only 107 customers in total using National Savings Welsh service (out of well over a million with postcodes in Wales), the case for having it as the preeminent language on anything, let alone road signs is laughable. More evidence of out of touch politicians.
With less than 1% of people here accessing Welsh language broadcasting, less than 3% using the 'Welsh ' option on something as simple as bank machine, and only 107 customers in total using National Savings Welsh service (out of well over a million with postcodes in Wales), the case for having it as the preeminent language on anything, let alone road signs is laughable. More evidence of out of touch politicians. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 14

4:51pm Wed 11 Jun 14

altom23 says...

Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course!
Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course! altom23
  • Score: -9

10:01pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Llanmartinangel says...

altom23 wrote:
Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course!
Care to refute any of my numbers? Or are you trolling? It's for debate here. Did you know that?
[quote][p][bold]altom23[/bold] wrote: Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course![/p][/quote]Care to refute any of my numbers? Or are you trolling? It's for debate here. Did you know that? Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 9

11:34pm Wed 11 Jun 14

landyman3030 says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
altom23 wrote:
Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course!
Care to refute any of my numbers? Or are you trolling? It's for debate here. Did you know that?
Now now Llanmartinangel. You, me and many other regulars know full well that altom23 doesn't concern himself with little things like facts or debating the issues at hand. Altom23 likes to just drop in with the sarcasm as the entertainment value in the postings section. We are never disappointed whenever the font of no knowledge spouts. Carry on altom23. Pure entertainment.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]altom23[/bold] wrote: Welcome back Llanmartinangel to the discussion Where have you been?. I have been waiting for your skewed facts and figures. This forum would not be the same without them and your contribution of course![/p][/quote]Care to refute any of my numbers? Or are you trolling? It's for debate here. Did you know that?[/p][/quote]Now now Llanmartinangel. You, me and many other regulars know full well that altom23 doesn't concern himself with little things like facts or debating the issues at hand. Altom23 likes to just drop in with the sarcasm as the entertainment value in the postings section. We are never disappointed whenever the font of no knowledge spouts. Carry on altom23. Pure entertainment. landyman3030
  • Score: 6

9:03am Thu 12 Jun 14

Walter Devereux says...

Your an idiot, to be quite frank!

mills191184, please look up "irony" in the dictionary (if you know what one is).
[quote]Your an idiot, to be quite frank![/quote] mills191184, please look up "irony" in the dictionary (if you know what one is). Walter Devereux
  • Score: 4

5:07pm Thu 12 Jun 14

Newport Sometimes says...

Cymro79 wrote:
I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!!
If you are a Spanish teacher, please do some reading in Spanish and speak to some people in Spain about the "wonderful" linguistic diversity. You are in for a BIG surprise. No tienes ni idea.
[quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: I don't see what the problem is. The signs will only be altered to Welsh first when the old ones need replacing so the cost will not be massive in the slightest. People cite that tourists will be confused. What utter rubbish! I speak welsh (having taught myself) as a Newportonian born and brought up in Pill and some may say that I would be biased and you may be right. However I am also a Spanish teacher and having visited Spain where linguistic diversity is far more widespread and where the local language (Catalan/Basque etc) is displayed first causes no problem whatsoever for tourists. So that argument is a nonsense! Within a few more years the numbers of children who speak Welsh in South East Wales will be so much greater so the idea that 'nobody' speaks Welsh or will speak Welsh here is also utter nonsense. Figures will go on increasing year on year. Welsh is on the rise after years of ignorance! 'O Bydded yr hen iaith' and all that!![/p][/quote]If you are a Spanish teacher, please do some reading in Spanish and speak to some people in Spain about the "wonderful" linguistic diversity. You are in for a BIG surprise. No tienes ni idea. Newport Sometimes
  • Score: 4

6:02pm Thu 12 Jun 14

Bobevans says...

gog1989 wrote:
10 counties covering 78% of Wales' surface area already have Welsh language first on signs this will simply standardize that over the whole country, it also won't cost an extra penny as they will only be changed when they need replacing.
Alost no one in South Wales uses Welsh. It is an extra expense and it compromises road safety as well as confusing for tourists
[quote][p][bold]gog1989[/bold] wrote: 10 counties covering 78% of Wales' surface area already have Welsh language first on signs this will simply standardize that over the whole country, it also won't cost an extra penny as they will only be changed when they need replacing.[/p][/quote]Alost no one in South Wales uses Welsh. It is an extra expense and it compromises road safety as well as confusing for tourists Bobevans
  • Score: 7

6:08pm Thu 12 Jun 14

Bobevans says...

Cymro79 wrote:
So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-)
If there are such road signs they are not legal signs
[quote][p][bold]Cymro79[/bold] wrote: So are you saying that all other languages in Britain should be banned on signs and notices? What about ethnic minority communities? I see signs in Urdu, Somali, Bengali etc etc. Should they be banned? Try telling that to people in Spain. There would be absolute carnage! :-)[/p][/quote]If there are such road signs they are not legal signs Bobevans
  • Score: 4

6:09pm Thu 12 Jun 14

Bobevans says...

mills191184 wrote:
-trigg- wrote:
the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner?
How do you explain the subsidy the BBC gets despite people having to pay a tv license, of the train operators despite travellers having to pay for tickets to travel.
What BBC subsidy?
[quote][p][bold]mills191184[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]-trigg-[/bold] wrote: the Welsh language brigade rarely bother to argue where cost is concerned, presumably because they are not concerned about costs. How else to explain the subsidy that S4C receives, or the obscene salaray paid to the language commissioner?[/p][/quote]How do you explain the subsidy the BBC gets despite people having to pay a tv license, of the train operators despite travellers having to pay for tickets to travel.[/p][/quote]What BBC subsidy? Bobevans
  • Score: 4

6:14pm Thu 12 Jun 14

Bobevans says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
With less than 1% of people here accessing Welsh language broadcasting, less than 3% using the 'Welsh ' option on something as simple as bank machine, and only 107 customers in total using National Savings Welsh service (out of well over a million with postcodes in Wales), the case for having it as the preeminent language on anything, let alone road signs is laughable. More evidence of out of touch politicians.
Still it makes Wales even less competitive

What next I wonder a demand that all newspapers that are sold In Wales have to be printed in Welsh and English. If that happened there would be only one result the papers would cease to be sold in Wales as no one would pay treble the price
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: With less than 1% of people here accessing Welsh language broadcasting, less than 3% using the 'Welsh ' option on something as simple as bank machine, and only 107 customers in total using National Savings Welsh service (out of well over a million with postcodes in Wales), the case for having it as the preeminent language on anything, let alone road signs is laughable. More evidence of out of touch politicians.[/p][/quote]Still it makes Wales even less competitive What next I wonder a demand that all newspapers that are sold In Wales have to be printed in Welsh and English. If that happened there would be only one result the papers would cease to be sold in Wales as no one would pay treble the price Bobevans
  • Score: 5

1:04am Fri 13 Jun 14

displayed says...

http://revealingerro
rs.com/autoresponder
_road_sign;
The English half of the sign is printed correctly and says, “No entry for heavy goods vehicles. Residential site only.” Clearly enough, the point of the sign is to prohibit truck drivers from entering a residential neighborhood.

Since the sign was posted in Swansea, Wales, the bottom half of the sign is written in Welsh. The translation of the Welsh is, “I am not in the office at the moment. Send any work to be translated.”

I therefore rest my case!
http://revealingerro rs.com/autoresponder _road_sign; The English half of the sign is printed correctly and says, “No entry for heavy goods vehicles. Residential site only.” Clearly enough, the point of the sign is to prohibit truck drivers from entering a residential neighborhood. Since the sign was posted in Swansea, Wales, the bottom half of the sign is written in Welsh. The translation of the Welsh is, “I am not in the office at the moment. Send any work to be translated.” I therefore rest my case! displayed
  • Score: 4

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