Newport councillors call for probe into SDR lorry crashes

9:12am Tuesday 12th March 2013 in News

Newport councillors call for probe into SDR lorry crashes Newport councillors call for probe into SDR lorry crashes

COUNCILLORS called for more investigations into ways to improve traffic management on the SDR following their concerns about lorries overturning on the road.

At a meeting of Newport’s Street Scene regeneration and safety scrutiny committee, councillors asked for contractors Morgan Vinci to look into linage on the road.

They also raised concerns about contingency plans for the future to reduce gridlock on the SDR when parts of the M4 are closed due to an incident.

The discussion came after members of the committee expressed their concerns about road safety issues on the SDR following recent accidents involving lorries overturning.

Adrian Glenn, of Morgan Vinci, attended a meeting to address the committee.

Mr Glenn said that following two incidents last summer when a heavy goods vehicle overturned, transport consultant Capita Symonds carried out investigations to see if there was any cause, but found nothing untoward.

But Mr Glenn said Morgan Vinci wanted to do something and worked with the Street Scene team to introduce adverse camber signs to try to slow lorries down.

Mr Glenn said although there are no adverse cambers, it can feel as though there are if you approach certain areas of the SDR at speed.

Chairman of the committee Cllr Roger Jeavons raised the issue of linage on the road, particularly near Nash Road, where two lanes of the road enter into three lanes and then merge back into two.

Mr Glenn said this original design, which the council adopted, had been based on the road operating at full capacity, which is around three to four times the level of traffic on the road now. He said there were therefore discussions as to whether it would now be sensible to eliminate lanes. Around 400,000 vehicles use the road every month.

With regard to reducing gridlock on the road when there is an incident on the M4, Mr Glenn said discussions were going on with the Welsh Government about what can be done, with suggested proposals including putting controlled traffic-lights along the road.

An update on the SDR will now be presented at the next meeting of the scrutiny committee.

ARGUS COMMENT: Traffic volume an issue for SDR

WE have speculated on more than one occasion in this column about the reasons behind the apparently high number of accidents involving lorries on Newport’s Southern Distributor Road.

Since the SDR opened in 2004 there have been at least 15 instances of lorries overturning or shedding their loads at roundabouts. There were three such accidents last year alone.

Nowthe city’s councillors are considering ways to make the road safer.

One of the options being considered by contractors Morgan Vinci is to install more traffic-lights along the SDR.Wefail to see howthis would improve road safety or reduce accidents involving heavy goods vehicles.

They might add to congestion but traffic-lights will not help if the accidents are being caused by faulty road design or poor driving.

Wedo agree with a proposal to reduce the number of lanes heading into and out of some roundabouts on the SDR. At least one roundabout, near Nash Road, creates confusion and regular near-misses due to three lanes merging into two. The biggest issue facing those responsible for the SDR, however, is the ever-increasing level of traffic using the road.

While the road is still handling three to four times belowthe amount of traffic for which it was designed that is a situation that will not last forever. And that is a problem that won’t be solved with lane closures or traffic-lights.

Comments(30)

pinpong says...
9:28am Tue 12 Mar 13

Its all the traffic going to spytty

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Woodgnome says...
9:35am Tue 12 Mar 13

pinpong wrote:
Its all the traffic going to spytty
Nearly right ping pong - actually it's the rush to leave Newport!!

Seriously, the reason for these numerous accidents does need looking into. With the M4 and SDR blocked so frequently it's ridiculous.

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Severn40 says...
9:49am Tue 12 Mar 13

Any design should be subject to regular road safety audits at periodic review points. I wonder if our esteemed councillors asked about these audits and for them to be readily published in the public domain?

This should provide further evidence about the failings of the design and should highlight the actions that Newport Council should be undertaking to force Morgan Vinci to improve safety.

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Meandog says...
10:16am Tue 12 Mar 13

Not saying its the main factor, but one of the factors is the speed of lorries when they are on the roundabouts. The roundabout near the Stats office is two lanes and when you're coming down the stretch of road, past the Stats office, round the roundabout and then exiting to carry on up the SDR, then you can maintain a fair amount of speed, if it's relatively traffic-free.

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despicableme says...
11:12am Tue 12 Mar 13

Never mind the SDR how about why have all the shops left the city centre!!! Labour, Conservative all as bad as one another, clueless.......

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ryanbrickell says...
12:37pm Tue 12 Mar 13

The roundabouts seem like they have been designed around cars and not HGV's. That combined with poor lane discipline by ALL drivers must be a big factor in why there are so many incidents.

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Owain Vaughan says...
12:57pm Tue 12 Mar 13

So the solution to excess provision of roundabouts is signs that LIE to motorists? Why not just eliminate the proliferation of roundabouts if you want to prevent HGVs tipping over on them?

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The Red Claw says...
12:59pm Tue 12 Mar 13

The lane markings approaching and on the roundabouts on the SDR are atrocious.

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Crazydad says...
1:10pm Tue 12 Mar 13

A quote from Mr Glenn - 'With regard to reducing gridlock on the road when there is an incident on the M4, discussions were going on with the Welsh Government about what can be done, with suggested proposals including putting controlled traffic-lights along the road'. Puuting up traffic lights on the SDR will increase grid look, a perfect example of this is at Tredegar Park. The traffic lights some days are not even on at rush hour I don't even think they are monitored to make adjustements to allow traffic to flow.
The traffic lights in Newport operate to increase gridlock so the Council and WAG can justify funding bus lanes and forcing people onto public transport (as the council have an interest in the buses).

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Big Bus Driver says...
2:00pm Tue 12 Mar 13

Hardly the first poorly designed road in Newslum is it? These road planners in Newslum do not have a good record just look at the Harlequin roundabout fiasco.

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Radio Wales says...
2:35pm Tue 12 Mar 13

Here we go again!

The amount of inquiries and reviews into the M4 and SDR are enough to make your head spin; and they all say the same thing. The roundabouts are simply not suitable for large goods vehicles or poor drivers either.

The amount of variance is so great that it is impossible to keep lane discipline even if drivers were to want to.

We must remove or remodel most of the roundabouts to make the SDR more like a ring road and less like an obstacle course and we might get somewhere; always remembering that all this fuss is caused by the refusal to acknowledge that the Southern M4 is an absolute necessity.

It will probably get built in the end but unfortunately it will be 40 years too late to be of any real use.

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Vauxfiat says...
3:35pm Tue 12 Mar 13

Could there not a speed restriction for Lorries/Buses etc using the roundabout . Even in a car it is quite nasty but lorries should have a restriction of say for example 20mph until they are clear of the roundabout.

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crosskeysgirl18 says...
4:11pm Tue 12 Mar 13

There should be a speed restriction of 15mph and get speed cameras there!

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crosskeysgirl18 says...
4:11pm Tue 12 Mar 13

...in ALL modes of transport whether its a car, bus or lorry!

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Robert Shillabeer says...
4:28pm Tue 12 Mar 13

despicableme wrote:
Never mind the SDR how about why have all the shops left the city centre!!! Labour, Conservative all as bad as one another, clueless.......
Because the shopping experience is so much better and easy parking and outweighs the crap experience in the City Centre. People vote with their feet.

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real comment says...
5:07pm Tue 12 Mar 13

THIS IS DUE TO THE B.I.B.L.D. BRITISH INSTITUTE OF BLIND LORRY DRIVERS. ALSO THEY ARE TRYING TO SEE IF THEY CAN WAKE UP THE POLICE. IF THERE ARE ANY ?

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lord iron of shumg says...
5:17pm Tue 12 Mar 13

Get rid of the roundabouts and just have lights

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Strider says...
5:20pm Tue 12 Mar 13

There's to many people with large ego's small brains and even smaller parts on the road.. Lorry's and Vans drive like first class **** because its not there vehicle the company has to pay the insurance for there bad driving!! Same with Chav's Mummy and Daddy pay for there car/insurance so they can rein-act 'Fast and the Furious'

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blackandamber says...
7:26pm Tue 12 Mar 13

Centrifugal force and badly designed and marked roundabouts

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dragonbear says...
8:57pm Tue 12 Mar 13

strider do you know that lorry drivers and bus drivers are the most trained drivers on the road who do regular training and medicals and we dont all drive like 1st class ...... as you said ,ok there are some cowboys on the road same as builders and plumbers when was the last time was your driving assessed since you passed your test ,Never i persume ????and as regards vans anyone who as passed there car test can drive one without training and up untill 1997 they could drive a truck up to 7.5 tonnes and without training the think they respond like cars when driving they dont accidents ready to happen.as regards the sdr road the are mamy problems such as roadabouts which are not round ,two lanes into three then back into two and my major gripe as a lorry driver myself the white lines on path around roundabouts which if you are not a local hgv driver form your nearside mirror looks like the gutter hence you think your have less room than you have clip the kerb and tip over in the worst case,

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dragonbear says...
8:57pm Tue 12 Mar 13

strider do you know that lorry drivers and bus drivers are the most trained drivers on the road who do regular training and medicals and we dont all drive like 1st class ...... as you said ,ok there are some cowboys on the road same as builders and plumbers when was the last time was your driving assessed since you passed your test ,Never i persume ????and as regards vans anyone who as passed there car test can drive one without training and up untill 1997 they could drive a truck up to 7.5 tonnes and without training the think they respond like cars when driving they dont accidents ready to happen.as regards the sdr road the are mamy problems such as roadabouts which are not round ,two lanes into three then back into two and my major gripe as a lorry driver myself the white lines on path around roundabouts which if you are not a local hgv driver form your nearside mirror looks like the gutter hence you think your have less room than you have clip the kerb and tip over in the worst case,

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Daz Mondeo says...
10:30pm Tue 12 Mar 13

I find driving on this road is mostly ok, but one thing I do find at night is that the white markings set back from the kerbstones on the pavements gives the impression that the road is wider than it actually is.

Just wonderring if the problem with overturned trucks is caused by them clipping the kerbs because the drivers are mistaking the white lines on the pavements for kerbstones, which are in fact a few inches behind where the actual kerbstones are. It definitely has some kind of optical illusion, and if you are not familiar with the markings, they may be a contributing factor - just a thought, what do others who drive on this road think?

Additionally, I think that the approaches to the roundabouts are allowing for too high a speed, whereas the roundabouts are quite small causing people who are not familiar with this road to have to decrease speed very quickly.

Generally, I would say the road is ok for those who are familiar with it's quirks, but may cause problems for those who are not, which may go some way to explain why lorries are overturning - after all, statistically, most car drivers who use this road will be local and familiar with this road, whereas truck drivers are likely not to be from this area, and may not actually be familiar with this roads quirks....

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Big Bus Driver says...
11:19pm Tue 12 Mar 13

some of you people need to get out more, put your anorak on and get some fresh air.

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jerymp says...
9:40am Wed 13 Mar 13

The actual roundabout looks too large and if some of it was removed opposite the Nash rd entries the sharp angle of entry and exit would be reduced for traffic along the SDR.
This tight manoeuvre seems to be the cause of lorries tipping over.
Check it out on google earth

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Loose-Cannon says...
10:07am Wed 13 Mar 13

I travel this road daily and of caution & common sense is used there is no problem, also the highway code shows you how to read a roundabout sign & tells you which lane you need to be in, so I don’t understand the confusion. Also if you look at the picture involved, it shows that where the lorry has overturned are chevrons, this is a dedicated lane to carry straight on over the roundabout, without the need to reduce speed & to avoid congestion. This is the reason for the overturned lorries. Remove the dedicated lane will reduce speed & will reduce the centrifugal force & the lorries overturning.

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Bobevans says...
1:43pm Wed 13 Mar 13

The main problem is that the SDR was built on the cheap and has been designed and built badly.

The major problem is the very poor design of the roundabouts. What fool decided that having three lanes go into two at a roundabout needs to have his brain tested.. Another issue on the roundabouts is the lanes in many cases are so narrow only cars can stay in them

Dealing with the poor design of the roundabouts I suspect would solve most of the problem. In the short term perhaps a 20mph limit on the approach and on the roundabouts and the exit from them would help

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Bobevans says...
1:43pm Wed 13 Mar 13

The main problem is that the SDR was built on the cheap and has been designed and built badly.

The major problem is the very poor design of the roundabouts. What fool decided that having three lanes go into two at a roundabout needs to have his brain tested.. Another issue on the roundabouts is the lanes in many cases are so narrow only cars can stay in them

Dealing with the poor design of the roundabouts I suspect would solve most of the problem. In the short term perhaps a 20mph limit on the approach and on the roundabouts and the exit from them would help

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Bobevans says...
10:34am Fri 15 Mar 13

Loose-Cannon wrote:
I travel this road daily and of caution & common sense is used there is no problem, also the highway code shows you how to read a roundabout sign & tells you which lane you need to be in, so I don’t understand the confusion. Also if you look at the picture involved, it shows that where the lorry has overturned are chevrons, this is a dedicated lane to carry straight on over the roundabout, without the need to reduce speed & to avoid congestion. This is the reason for the overturned lorries. Remove the dedicated lane will reduce speed & will reduce the centrifugal force & the lorries overturning.
Have you actually passed your driving test?. Have you read the highway code?

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Strider says...
11:07pm Sun 17 Mar 13

Dragon I'm suprised to here that, I do agree Lorry drivers need there wits about them all times,

Sometimes on that SDR you do witness Lorrys pull out and everybody has to stop for them because of the size of the things, Again I agree there are far more responsible Lorry and Bus Drivers then bad.. I think as they drive long hour they get over confident, that doesn't make them bad drivers just sure of themselves and then accidents happen

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jerymp says...
9:36am Mon 18 Mar 13

Just a little off the main topic but when i`m driving on motorways my assessment of the responsibility of the average lorry driver does go down a lot when I see them travelling nose to tail at speeds well in excess of 40 mph.
This link will make you think!
http://www.ukmotoris
ts.com/hgv%20braking
%20distances.asp

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