Welsh language campaigners Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg send sarcastic 'congratulations' card sent to Newport Council for their failure to have a bilingual website

South Wales Argus: Sarcastic 'congratulations' card sent to Newport Council by Welsh language campaigners Sarcastic 'congratulations' card sent to Newport Council by Welsh language campaigners

LANGUAGE campaign group Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg have sent a tongue-in-cheek 'congratulations' card to Newport Council for being the only local authority in Wales without a Welsh language website.

The council were investigated earlier in the year after the group accused the authority of misleading people over its work on creating a bilingual website.

Newport Council claimed it was working on adding content in Welsh to its site, which led to complaints from the group, who believed no such work was being undertaken.

According to the Council's language plan, approved in 2009, the Council promised to "Ensure a Welsh dimension in the content of both the Council’s main vehicles of mass communication, publicity, the website and its newspaper".

But as of yet, the website remains the only one in Wales that doesn’t have a Welsh language version.

The group sent the card to Will Godfrey, the Chief Executive of the council, and it states "Very Many Congratulations! The Council is well ahead as the local authority most opposed to the Welsh language in Wales.

“And with so much competition, that's quite an achievement. You're the only local authority in Wales that doesn't have a Welsh language website. So, the Welsh Not is still alive in Newport."

Alun Thomas, a member of the Newport branch of Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg said: "If the council wasn't ridiculous before, it certainly is by now. There's an increasing demand for Council services in Welsh, but residents of the city are being ignored.

“It's a disgrace that they are the only council in Wales without a Welsh language website. Not only because they’re breaking their statutory Welsh language plan, but they don't even realise they’re breaking it.”

A page on the council’s website says that the authority is “working towards adding more Welsh language content to the site”.

However, despite many promises, this won’t be ready until 2014, when the costs of a bilingual site are clearer.

A Newport council spokeswoman said the authority was mindful of the need to develop Welsh language services for the web and commitments had been made to the commissioner.

“Providing information and services in Welsh also has a cost associated with it which presents a significant financial challenge as further cuts to the budget must be made.

"The council’s priority has to be the protection of frontline services, but recognises its statutory responsibilities to the Welsh language and those residents who use it.”

Comments (154)

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12:47am Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

What a waste of time. In all fairness Newport on this point, are the only Welsh authority with a sensible welsh Lang policy. Heere we go again folks!! Waste of money for a handful of moaners in a city which has many different languages, Welsh being near the bottom of speakiers.
What a waste of time. In all fairness Newport on this point, are the only Welsh authority with a sensible welsh Lang policy. Heere we go again folks!! Waste of money for a handful of moaners in a city which has many different languages, Welsh being near the bottom of speakiers. Banjalucka

1:21am Mon 23 Dec 13

gathin says...

If Pooport town council haven't been pushing the Welsh language then where has all the money that has been budgeted gone?
This Welsh language thing is a complete joke as nobody in Newport speaks it to any level of fluency anyway and just means that more of the publics money can be wasted on somebody's agenda (but not ours!).
If Pooport town council haven't been pushing the Welsh language then where has all the money that has been budgeted gone? This Welsh language thing is a complete joke as nobody in Newport speaks it to any level of fluency anyway and just means that more of the publics money can be wasted on somebody's agenda (but not ours!). gathin

7:38am Mon 23 Dec 13

portman says...

Waste of money !
Waste of money ! portman

7:53am Mon 23 Dec 13

Vox Dei says...

Nice of the language fascists to foster tolerance towards their hobbyhorse. The only reason they have been given so any concessions is because we tolerate them to a degree. This kind of thing is utterly unacceptable. They need the support of the 90% of people who don't care about it, so why alienate them?
Nice of the language fascists to foster tolerance towards their hobbyhorse. The only reason they have been given so any concessions is because we tolerate them to a degree. This kind of thing is utterly unacceptable. They need the support of the 90% of people who don't care about it, so why alienate them? Vox Dei

8:22am Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Council tax payer's money should be spent on essential services. Since even the language fascists can speak English it can't be essential. I've lived here pretty much all my life and it's the only language I've never heard spoken here by any age, even kids who have it force-fed to them in school. Insane.
Council tax payer's money should be spent on essential services. Since even the language fascists can speak English it can't be essential. I've lived here pretty much all my life and it's the only language I've never heard spoken here by any age, even kids who have it force-fed to them in school. Insane. Llanmartinangel

8:25am Mon 23 Dec 13

Lliswerry Man says...

As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it. Lliswerry Man

8:29am Mon 23 Dec 13

mep says...

At least the council are getting something right.
At least the council are getting something right. mep

8:36am Mon 23 Dec 13

white white says...

gathin wrote:
If Pooport town council haven't been pushing the Welsh language then where has all the money that has been budgeted gone?
This Welsh language thing is a complete joke as nobody in Newport speaks it to any level of fluency anyway and just means that more of the publics money can be wasted on somebody's agenda (but not ours!).
wrong
[quote][p][bold]gathin[/bold] wrote: If Pooport town council haven't been pushing the Welsh language then where has all the money that has been budgeted gone? This Welsh language thing is a complete joke as nobody in Newport speaks it to any level of fluency anyway and just means that more of the publics money can be wasted on somebody's agenda (but not ours!).[/p][/quote]wrong white white

8:39am Mon 23 Dec 13

white white says...

Lliswerry Man wrote:
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
[quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then white white

8:40am Mon 23 Dec 13

white white says...

Lliswerry Man wrote:
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
[quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then white white

8:41am Mon 23 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

I would want to know just where the 'demand' as claimed by Cymdaithas is actually coming from.

I feel quite safe in saying it isn't coming from the people of Newport.

Then we get a council, Torfaen, being driven into a similar demand because THREE, yes a whole Three complaints have been expressed about it's approach to similar matters emanating from the Commissioner.

About time Cymdaithas were told to shove off. and in no uncertain terms.
I would want to know just where the 'demand' as claimed by Cymdaithas is actually coming from. I feel quite safe in saying it isn't coming from the people of Newport. Then we get a council, Torfaen, being driven into a similar demand because THREE, yes a whole Three complaints have been expressed about it's approach to similar matters emanating from the Commissioner. About time Cymdaithas were told to shove off. and in no uncertain terms. varteg1

9:07am Mon 23 Dec 13

Vox Dei says...

I take it your not Welsh then

Oh dear.
[quote]I take it your not Welsh then[/quote] Oh dear. Vox Dei

9:11am Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Welsh should be the first language of Newport to restore our sense of civic pride and national indentity. Often when I stroll through our bustling town centre I am met with shouts of "Oi! Sparz uz sum. forra can or three like?"

If only these unfortunate Newportonians spoke good Welsh one might give them a few pence.

Off to put superglue in the Argus's door locks.
Welsh should be the first language of Newport to restore our sense of civic pride and national indentity. Often when I stroll through our bustling town centre I am met with shouts of "Oi! Sparz uz sum. forra can or three like?" If only these unfortunate Newportonians spoke good Welsh one might give them a few pence. Off to put superglue in the Argus's door locks. KarloMarko

9:27am Mon 23 Dec 13

Mr Angry says...

white white wrote:
Lliswerry Man wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
I am Welsh and proud of it. However the fact I cant speak Welsh does not make me a second class Welshman. The language has never been an issue with me, but these people are becoming annoying in the extereme.
[quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then[/p][/quote]I am Welsh and proud of it. However the fact I cant speak Welsh does not make me a second class Welshman. The language has never been an issue with me, but these people are becoming annoying in the extereme. Mr Angry

9:32am Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

white white wrote:
Lliswerry Man wrote:
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
'I take it your not Welsh then'

What is that exactly? Someone born here to English or foreign parents? Born in Monmouthshire or Anglesesy? Someone from Essex who can say 'hello' in a medieval tongue? The Italian diaspora running chippies in the Rhondda? Or just some fictitious 'nationality' which one can choose to cloak themselves in? Or not. Do enlighten us.
[quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then[/p][/quote]'I take it your not Welsh then' What is that exactly? Someone born here to English or foreign parents? Born in Monmouthshire or Anglesesy? Someone from Essex who can say 'hello' in a medieval tongue? The Italian diaspora running chippies in the Rhondda? Or just some fictitious 'nationality' which one can choose to cloak themselves in? Or not. Do enlighten us. Llanmartinangel

9:44am Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Its lovely living in Wales cos you can switch on Radio Wales at anytime and be bathed in a warm bubble bath of cosy corner 1950s Welshness that makes you glad to be alive and living the dream.

Otherwise Jamie Owen, Owen Money etc would be clearing blocked drains...
Its lovely living in Wales cos you can switch on Radio Wales at anytime and be bathed in a warm bubble bath of cosy corner 1950s Welshness that makes you glad to be alive and living the dream. Otherwise Jamie Owen, Owen Money etc would be clearing blocked drains... KarloMarko

10:07am Mon 23 Dec 13

Floppy backed says...

mep wrote:
At least the council are getting something right.
Yes exactly, with all our council tax we pay and essential services being scrapped back - its called priorities. We are an English speaking nation and going backwards when all other Countries are going forward is utter madness. As for heritage, many of us are Welsh through and through and proud to be. The language means nothing to us - lets move on.
[quote][p][bold]mep[/bold] wrote: At least the council are getting something right.[/p][/quote]Yes exactly, with all our council tax we pay and essential services being scrapped back - its called priorities. We are an English speaking nation and going backwards when all other Countries are going forward is utter madness. As for heritage, many of us are Welsh through and through and proud to be. The language means nothing to us - lets move on. Floppy backed

10:09am Mon 23 Dec 13

white white says...

Mr Angry wrote:
white white wrote:
Lliswerry Man wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
I am Welsh and proud of it. However the fact I cant speak Welsh does not make me a second class Welshman. The language has never been an issue with me, but these people are becoming annoying in the extereme.
I never presumed you are a 2nd class cit,but you said THE Welsh
and not WE Welsh ,which made me assume you were not,
[quote][p][bold]Mr Angry[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then[/p][/quote]I am Welsh and proud of it. However the fact I cant speak Welsh does not make me a second class Welshman. The language has never been an issue with me, but these people are becoming annoying in the extereme.[/p][/quote]I never presumed you are a 2nd class cit,but you said THE Welsh and not WE Welsh ,which made me assume you were not, white white

10:31am Mon 23 Dec 13

Mr Newport says...

Have Newport City Council received any complaints about this? Probably not - well done Newport
Have Newport City Council received any complaints about this? Probably not - well done Newport Mr Newport

10:47am Mon 23 Dec 13

Anne teak says...

This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on. Anne teak

10:52am Mon 23 Dec 13

Ollie254 says...

Well done Newport Council. At a time of priorities the provision of a Welsh Language web site is not top of the agenda. This minority pressure group is yet another that badly needs slapping down and ignoring totally.
In addition welsh language broadcasting should be funded on a pay to view basis as per Sky Sports etc. If you want to listen to it, you pay for it.
Well done Newport Council. At a time of priorities the provision of a Welsh Language web site is not top of the agenda. This minority pressure group is yet another that badly needs slapping down and ignoring totally. In addition welsh language broadcasting should be funded on a pay to view basis as per Sky Sports etc. If you want to listen to it, you pay for it. Ollie254

10:55am Mon 23 Dec 13

white white says...

Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
bbc wales has one as well
[quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]bbc wales has one as well white white

11:05am Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Ollie254 wrote:
Well done Newport Council. At a time of priorities the provision of a Welsh Language web site is not top of the agenda. This minority pressure group is yet another that badly needs slapping down and ignoring totally.
In addition welsh language broadcasting should be funded on a pay to view basis as per Sky Sports etc. If you want to listen to it, you pay for it.
Get out of here with all your common sense.
[quote][p][bold]Ollie254[/bold] wrote: Well done Newport Council. At a time of priorities the provision of a Welsh Language web site is not top of the agenda. This minority pressure group is yet another that badly needs slapping down and ignoring totally. In addition welsh language broadcasting should be funded on a pay to view basis as per Sky Sports etc. If you want to listen to it, you pay for it.[/p][/quote]Get out of here with all your common sense. Llanmartinangel

11:24am Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

"Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym"

The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque.
"Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym" The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque. KarloMarko

11:29am Mon 23 Dec 13

GardenVarietyMushroom says...

Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget.

Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free.

In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.
[quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget. Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free. In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it. GardenVarietyMushroom

11:41am Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

GardenVarietyMushroo
m
wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget.

Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free.

In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.
'In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it'

Good point but think about it. If you were Meri Hughes with you plush office, £104k pa salary, gilt-edged pension and army of academic storm troopers, would you allow yourself to be put out of a job? The fact is that the Welsh obsessives hold sway in Cardiff Bay and will look after their own.
[quote][p][bold]GardenVarietyMushroo m[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget. Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free. In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.[/p][/quote]'In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it' Good point but think about it. If you were Meri Hughes with you plush office, £104k pa salary, gilt-edged pension and army of academic storm troopers, would you allow yourself to be put out of a job? The fact is that the Welsh obsessives hold sway in Cardiff Bay and will look after their own. Llanmartinangel

12:19pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Woodgnome says...

Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
Instead of guessing, why not ask NCC or WAG what the annual costs of all the welsh translation services are? The cost is not peanuts as you seem to suggest.
[quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]Instead of guessing, why not ask NCC or WAG what the annual costs of all the welsh translation services are? The cost is not peanuts as you seem to suggest. Woodgnome

12:20pm Mon 23 Dec 13

risca 85 says...

Total waste of money. My grand father was from Lampeter, where they were welsh speakers, moved to Newport in the early 19 hundreds to find work. told me that was the last time he needed welsh, even when he back to Lampeter years later English was the main language. As for the waste of money printing two utility bills, who pays for that, oh I just remembered you and me the customers.
Total waste of money. My grand father was from Lampeter, where they were welsh speakers, moved to Newport in the early 19 hundreds to find work. told me that was the last time he needed welsh, even when he back to Lampeter years later English was the main language. As for the waste of money printing two utility bills, who pays for that, oh I just remembered you and me the customers. risca 85

12:24pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

Lliswerry Man wrote:
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
How much money spent on Support for the Welsh Language?

Well, start with S4C.

Until the current government took an interest in S4C it was getting a GRANT of £105 million per year. Extrapolate that over its 30 year history then you arrive at £3.15 BILLION !! The current government has reduced that by 25% over 4 years and handed management to the BBC. Incidentally S4C was supplied with 10 hours per week of Welsh language programming at no cost to itself (i.e. we licence payers paid for it on top of the grant).

The Welsh Amateur Government spends about 1.5% of its £15 billion annual budget on support for the language. So there is another £225 million per year.

The imponderables are how much private and public sector spend implementing the demands of the 1993 Welsh Language Act.

All this spending may have some justification if it was actually achieving it's objective. The 2011 census showed a continuing fall in the number of Welsh language speakers. A more realistic measure of the use of the old language comes from Welsh water, who report less than 3% of their contact with customers is done in Welsh.

How bad do things in Wales have to get before we admit that the 1993 Act has failed in it's objective and should be repealed?

In one word - people of Wales -- VOTE!
[quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]How much money spent on Support for the Welsh Language? Well, start with S4C. Until the current government took an interest in S4C it was getting a GRANT of £105 million per year. Extrapolate that over its 30 year history then you arrive at £3.15 BILLION !! The current government has reduced that by 25% over 4 years and handed management to the BBC. Incidentally S4C was supplied with 10 hours per week of Welsh language programming at no cost to itself (i.e. we licence payers paid for it on top of the grant). The Welsh Amateur Government spends about 1.5% of its £15 billion annual budget on support for the language. So there is another £225 million per year. The imponderables are how much private and public sector spend implementing the demands of the 1993 Welsh Language Act. All this spending may have some justification if it was actually achieving it's objective. The 2011 census showed a continuing fall in the number of Welsh language speakers. A more realistic measure of the use of the old language comes from Welsh water, who report less than 3% of their contact with customers is done in Welsh. How bad do things in Wales have to get before we admit that the 1993 Act has failed in it's objective and should be repealed? In one word - people of Wales -- VOTE! Grüngemüse

12:26pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Bobevans says...

GardenVarietyMushroo
m
wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget.

Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free.

In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.
So there is you answer you can do it youself
[quote][p][bold]GardenVarietyMushroo m[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget. Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free. In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.[/p][/quote]So there is you answer you can do it youself Bobevans

12:47pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

This letter in the Western Mail illustrates the level of abuse some Welsh speakers hurl at people who questions the support demanded for their language.

"Re the letter by (a contributor) with its communiqué: ‘The teaching of Welsh has no effect on the use of the Welsh language, it has only alienated generations of young people against the Welsh language’.
This shows the ethical and moral ignorance of the English monoglots.
It also shows how dangerous a monoglot media is to humanity, as it has been proven throughout history.
No wonder that when the Nazis were accused of using propaganda on the German people (Nuremberg 1946) they replied ‘We learnt it from the LBC’. (London Broadcasting Corporation).
If the letter writer had not been brainwashed to participate in the policy of ethno-genocide it would have made recommendations on how to remedy the ‘problem’.
The de-nastification of all place names and street names and a ban on the compulsory teaching of English as a propaganda language would be a start.
The letter should been sent to the prime minister of England ‘I wish Wales and the Welsh language did not exist, it is a waste of English money’.
R T Jones, Gwynedd."

Is this supposed to endear the old language to us?
This letter in the Western Mail illustrates the level of abuse some Welsh speakers hurl at people who questions the support demanded for their language. "Re the letter by (a contributor) with its communiqué: ‘The teaching of Welsh has no effect on the use of the Welsh language, it has only alienated generations of young people against the Welsh language’. This shows the ethical and moral ignorance of the English monoglots. It also shows how dangerous a monoglot media is to humanity, as it has been proven throughout history. No wonder that when the Nazis were accused of using propaganda on the German people (Nuremberg 1946) they replied ‘We learnt it from the LBC’. (London Broadcasting Corporation). If the letter writer had not been brainwashed to participate in the policy of ethno-genocide it would have made recommendations on how to remedy the ‘problem’. The de-nastification of all place names and street names and a ban on the compulsory teaching of English as a propaganda language would be a start. The letter should been sent to the prime minister of England ‘I wish Wales and the Welsh language did not exist, it is a waste of English money’. R T Jones, Gwynedd." Is this supposed to endear the old language to us? Grüngemüse

1:21pm Mon 23 Dec 13

scraptheWAG says...

well if these welsh language campaigners want this stupidity why done they send the council a cheque for however much it will cost for this stupid old tripe.

I would rather the money be spent refurbishing the central library or the sports centre
well if these welsh language campaigners want this stupidity why done they send the council a cheque for however much it will cost for this stupid old tripe. I would rather the money be spent refurbishing the central library or the sports centre scraptheWAG

1:25pm Mon 23 Dec 13

scraptheWAG says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
GardenVarietyMushroo

m
wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget.

Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free.

In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.
'In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it'

Good point but think about it. If you were Meri Hughes with you plush office, £104k pa salary, gilt-edged pension and army of academic storm troopers, would you allow yourself to be put out of a job? The fact is that the Welsh obsessives hold sway in Cardiff Bay and will look after their own.
Did you know there is a whole department down the WAG for this stupid nonsence, 104k per annum for a non job like this that if it were in the private sector would command little over the minimum wage . And good old uncle Carwyn still blames the troubles of wales on underfunding by the nasty tory government.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]GardenVarietyMushroo m[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget. Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free. In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.[/p][/quote]'In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it' Good point but think about it. If you were Meri Hughes with you plush office, £104k pa salary, gilt-edged pension and army of academic storm troopers, would you allow yourself to be put out of a job? The fact is that the Welsh obsessives hold sway in Cardiff Bay and will look after their own.[/p][/quote]Did you know there is a whole department down the WAG for this stupid nonsence, 104k per annum for a non job like this that if it were in the private sector would command little over the minimum wage . And good old uncle Carwyn still blames the troubles of wales on underfunding by the nasty tory government. scraptheWAG

3:15pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Lots of comments on tius. Naddolig llawen
Lots of comments on tius. Naddolig llawen Banjalucka

3:26pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Jazztap says...

KarloMarko wrote:
"Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym"

The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque.
Quite true. The whole Welsh - language fascism project is all about jobs for the well-connected welsh-speaking Taffia , like Meri Huws.
Get a proper job Meri, and play at being Welsh elsewhere.. ,
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: "Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym" The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque.[/p][/quote]Quite true. The whole Welsh - language fascism project is all about jobs for the well-connected welsh-speaking Taffia , like Meri Huws. Get a proper job Meri, and play at being Welsh elsewhere.. , Jazztap

3:30pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Jazztap says...

Sarcastic comment ? But Newport is an English-speaking Anglo-Norman plantation town and has its own unique ( non-Welsh ) heritage. Why don't these language fascists attack the language policy in places like Hereford or Shrewsbury, which were once Welsh ?
Sarcastic comment ? But Newport is an English-speaking Anglo-Norman plantation town and has its own unique ( non-Welsh ) heritage. Why don't these language fascists attack the language policy in places like Hereford or Shrewsbury, which were once Welsh ? Jazztap

3:37pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so. Thomas O'Malley

3:52pm Mon 23 Dec 13

blackandamber says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it blackandamber

4:10pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Samantha902013 says...

This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else!

If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!!

Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example.

Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken!
This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else! If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!! Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example. Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken! Samantha902013

4:37pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Samantha - You are doing the ranting. Others on here are just telling you that its a waste of money having dual forms. tele. etc. Especially in Newport. Your point about moving and peiple with unwanted kids etc is totally unconnected to the Welsh issue. Can ypou really see EVERYONE shopping in Spytty babbling on in Welsh. Its you, my love, who needs to get real.
Samantha - You are doing the ranting. Others on here are just telling you that its a waste of money having dual forms. tele. etc. Especially in Newport. Your point about moving and peiple with unwanted kids etc is totally unconnected to the Welsh issue. Can ypou really see EVERYONE shopping in Spytty babbling on in Welsh. Its you, my love, who needs to get real. Banjalucka

4:45pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Hey Samantha! Wake up a smell the Cymru coffee! Welsh is A language of Wales in SOME parts of Wales. In Newport you'll find Polish spoken far more often...and less obtrusively.

And even in its heartlands Welsh is now on the skids, our kids don't use after it being force fed and even...oh no! Radio Cosey Cymru is shedding listeners like a Ponty sheep in windstorm!

Guess what? The emperor has NO clothes....and WE now know it!
Hey Samantha! Wake up a smell the Cymru coffee! Welsh is A language of Wales in SOME parts of Wales. In Newport you'll find Polish spoken far more often...and less obtrusively. And even in its heartlands Welsh is now on the skids, our kids don't use after it being force fed and even...oh no! Radio Cosey Cymru is shedding listeners like a Ponty sheep in windstorm! Guess what? The emperor has NO clothes....and WE now know it! KarloMarko

4:53pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Samantha902013 wrote:
This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else!

If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!!

Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example.

Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken!
For a start, the language of Wales is English, not Welsh and living in England doesn't get you out of paying for it either. They have a levy on their licence fee to fund S4C and around £10billion of their tax subsidises Wales which our assembly then waste part of on this tripe.
[quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else! If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!! Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example. Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken![/p][/quote]For a start, the language of Wales is English, not Welsh and living in England doesn't get you out of paying for it either. They have a levy on their licence fee to fund S4C and around £10billion of their tax subsidises Wales which our assembly then waste part of on this tripe. Llanmartinangel

4:55pm Mon 23 Dec 13

county mad says...

Samantha902013 wrote:
This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else!

If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!!

Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example.

Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken!
If you go to spain or greece you may detect the populace speak spnish or greek so you would expect the signage to be in the local language DOH!! The majority of S.East wales ,about 98.9% speak english, so why waste all that money on signs ,forms etc
[quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else! If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!! Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example. Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken![/p][/quote]If you go to spain or greece you may detect the populace speak spnish or greek so you would expect the signage to be in the local language DOH!! The majority of S.East wales ,about 98.9% speak english, so why waste all that money on signs ,forms etc county mad

4:58pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Jazztap wrote:
KarloMarko wrote:
"Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym"

The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque.
Quite true. The whole Welsh - language fascism project is all about jobs for the well-connected welsh-speaking Taffia , like Meri Huws.
Get a proper job Meri, and play at being Welsh elsewhere.. ,
Spot on.
[quote][p][bold]Jazztap[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: "Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg" roughly translated means "Giz a job in the medya/researcher down the Assembly/as a iconic druid in Pontcanna/ a walk on in Pobyl y Cym" The former Head of the Welsh Language Society pulled his son out of a top Welsh speaking school and sent him to Eton for the "right" education! How very Cymru-esque.[/p][/quote]Quite true. The whole Welsh - language fascism project is all about jobs for the well-connected welsh-speaking Taffia , like Meri Huws. Get a proper job Meri, and play at being Welsh elsewhere.. ,[/p][/quote]Spot on. Llanmartinangel

5:24pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

blackandamber wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.
[quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it[/p][/quote]As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country. Thomas O'Malley

5:35pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
blackandamber wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.
Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it[/p][/quote]As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.[/p][/quote]Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity. Llanmartinangel

5:54pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Well, in Caerleon I want all the road signs to be in Italian because our Roman citizenship has never been revoked! Our kids should be fluent in pasta making and there should be compulsory opera concerts every Friday. And angry lions on Sunday. Its our heritage!

If the Welsh dont like it they can clear off back to Bangor. Or the BBC Llandaff staff club.
Well, in Caerleon I want all the road signs to be in Italian because our Roman citizenship has never been revoked! Our kids should be fluent in pasta making and there should be compulsory opera concerts every Friday. And angry lions on Sunday. Its our heritage! If the Welsh dont like it they can clear off back to Bangor. Or the BBC Llandaff staff club. KarloMarko

5:58pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
blackandamber wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.
Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.
Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it[/p][/quote]As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.[/p][/quote]Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.[/p][/quote]Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance. Thomas O'Malley

6:00pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy O'Malley - your comments are insignificant as regards to Newport. Nobody really cares what language people speak here as long as they can make themselves understood. Nobody derides the many languages here and why can't you understand that no-one here goes around, from day to day, babbling off in Cymric!
Tommy O'Malley - your comments are insignificant as regards to Newport. Nobody really cares what language people speak here as long as they can make themselves understood. Nobody derides the many languages here and why can't you understand that no-one here goes around, from day to day, babbling off in Cymric! Banjalucka

6:04pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Mr Bump. says...

white white wrote:
Lliswerry Man wrote:
As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales.

I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be.

As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same.

The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.
I take it your not Welsh then
Do you mean 'You're' not Welsh? Maybe You should learn English so we can all understand what you are prattling on about.
[quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Lliswerry Man[/bold] wrote: As above, a total waste of money, Welsh Speakers from the west coast /north coast have always considered us Newportonians English anyway ( I know from living in both places )... we do not need a welsh language website and maybe the council have actually followed what the Majority want not the Minority, and used the funds wisely by not wasting it on such a low spoken language this part of Wales. I would like to know how much money Welsh Speakers actually pay into the system compared to us English speakers, so we can see whether they pay enough to cover ALL the costs involved in a dual language. ITS Daft, always was , always will be. As others have also stated above, there are MANY languages spoken in the whole of UK, should we have road signs in HINDU, SPANISH , ROMANIAN etc? enough is enough, if I go to a foreign country, I take a language dictionary with me, I DO NOT expect the country and its population to understand me and have everything in a language just for me, and we need to start being the same. The Welsh are welcome to their language, but STOP trying to force its costs on the rest of us, who DO NOT want it.[/p][/quote]I take it your not Welsh then[/p][/quote]Do you mean 'You're' not Welsh? Maybe You should learn English so we can all understand what you are prattling on about. Mr Bump.

6:06pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Monmouthshire Merlin says...

Congratulations Newport City Council. Possibly the only decision that has the support of the majority of the electorates this year.
You have our support on this.
Maintain the position and see what the commissioner threatens, then ask the populous what they want.
That is true democracy!
Congratulations Newport City Council. Possibly the only decision that has the support of the majority of the electorates this year. You have our support on this. Maintain the position and see what the commissioner threatens, then ask the populous what they want. That is true democracy! Monmouthshire Merlin

6:24pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Tommy O'Malley - your comments are insignificant as regards to Newport. Nobody really cares what language people speak here as long as they can make themselves understood. Nobody derides the many languages here and why can't you understand that no-one here goes around, from day to day, babbling off in Cymric!
"nobody derides the many languages",,,"babbli
ng off in Cymric". Hmmm.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Tommy O'Malley - your comments are insignificant as regards to Newport. Nobody really cares what language people speak here as long as they can make themselves understood. Nobody derides the many languages here and why can't you understand that no-one here goes around, from day to day, babbling off in Cymric![/p][/quote]"nobody derides the many languages",,,"babbli ng off in Cymric". Hmmm. NakedDancer

6:25pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Stevenboy says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
blackandamber wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.
Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.
Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance.
You see Welsh people everywhere in Newport. Don't you? The women wear stove-pipe hats and shawls and the men traipse about in satin bed-linen reciting poetry. Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it[/p][/quote]As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.[/p][/quote]Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.[/p][/quote]Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance.[/p][/quote]You see Welsh people everywhere in Newport. Don't you? The women wear stove-pipe hats and shawls and the men traipse about in satin bed-linen reciting poetry. Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up. Stevenboy

6:32pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Now Now! Newport is VERY Welsh. I once saw Tom Jones on Newport station.
Now Now! Newport is VERY Welsh. I once saw Tom Jones on Newport station. KarloMarko

6:44pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Stevenboy wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
blackandamber wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it
As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.
Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.
Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance.
You see Welsh people everywhere in Newport. Don't you? The women wear stove-pipe hats and shawls and the men traipse about in satin bed-linen reciting poetry. Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up.
That's too obviously a windup by an Englishman, like most of this thread.
[quote][p][bold]Stevenboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]The cost to the NHS of multi lingual signs and forms including Welsh is in access of £23 million pounds .Hardly insignificant is it[/p][/quote]As I said, trivial issue blown out of proportion. The cost to Newport Council of multilingual webpages is virtually nothing. If you want to challenge the WAG on the law and their spending priorities that's a different issue. I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and there's many bigger problems than this. It saddens me that Welshmen can be the biggest nationalists for a rugby match versus England and the next day totally intolerant and cant respect fellow Welshmen that just want to use their own language in their own country.[/p][/quote]Define a 'Welshman'. You can't. It's an imaginary adopted identity.[/p][/quote]Someone who considers themselves Welsh. But thanks for proving my point re intolerance.[/p][/quote]You see Welsh people everywhere in Newport. Don't you? The women wear stove-pipe hats and shawls and the men traipse about in satin bed-linen reciting poetry. Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up.[/p][/quote]That's too obviously a windup by an Englishman, like most of this thread. NakedDancer

6:50pm Mon 23 Dec 13

cannyfradock says...

I was born in Newport and lived here most of my life. In 55 years I have lived in Bettws, Maindee, Ridgeway and the Beechwood area of the City. In my 55 years in the town I have actually met one.....yes ONE welsh speaking Newportonion.

I admire the local authorities for promoting The Welsh Language in schools and introducing evening classes for mature students who wish to learn Welsh.

"They "say that 10% of the population of Newport are Welsh speakers....I would like to dispute that percentage figure. In any case the reality is....that Newport has a largely Welsh population who do not speak Gaelic.

As mentioned I am all for giving every opportunity for people to learn Welsh, but I strongly appose any body or organisation that bullies non-gaelic speaking Welsh people to take compulsory measures.

This is a message to Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg ...in the language spoken by the people of Newport.....**** OFF!!
I was born in Newport and lived here most of my life. In 55 years I have lived in Bettws, Maindee, Ridgeway and the Beechwood area of the City. In my 55 years in the town I have actually met one.....yes ONE welsh speaking Newportonion. I admire the local authorities for promoting The Welsh Language in schools and introducing evening classes for mature students who wish to learn Welsh. "They "say that 10% of the population of Newport are Welsh speakers....I would like to dispute that percentage figure. In any case the reality is....that Newport has a largely Welsh population who do not speak Gaelic. As mentioned I am all for giving every opportunity for people to learn Welsh, but I strongly appose any body or organisation that bullies non-gaelic speaking Welsh people to take compulsory measures. This is a message to Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg ...in the language spoken by the people of Newport.....**** OFF!! cannyfradock

7:00pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Scottish or Irish Gaelic is a different language to Welsh but, sadly yes, course swearing is often the language of Newport.
Scottish or Irish Gaelic is a different language to Welsh but, sadly yes, course swearing is often the language of Newport. NakedDancer

7:01pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Samantha902013 says...

Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost"
Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost" Samantha902013

7:07pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Ivor the Engine has become..... Ivor the Welsh language gravy train!

"Toot Toot! All aboard...first stop Cardiff Bay!"
Ivor the Engine has become..... Ivor the Welsh language gravy train! "Toot Toot! All aboard...first stop Cardiff Bay!" KarloMarko

7:08pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
Here's a Cut'n'paste from Walesonline --11/11/2008

SERVICES provided to customers through the medium of Welsh are barely used, according to new figures released today, despite increasing demands from language groups that more is done to make such services available.

Despite the migration of large numbers of Welsh speakers into Cardiff, it seems hardly any of them use the language when getting money from cash machines in the Welsh capital.

But as language activists step up their campaign for new Welsh language rights to force private companies into providing bilingual services, there are now warnings that this could lead to an increase in costs which would be passed on to already hard-up customers.

S4C current affairs programme Y Byd ar Bedwar asked several large private companies to monitor their Welsh language services for a period of one week.

The survey included banks, post offices and call centres across Wales. The results suggest that the language is rarely used commercially outside its heartlands.

Barclays Bank measured the use of Welsh language services at cash points within branches in Caernarfon, Llanelli and Cardiff. In Caernarfon, 500 transactions were made in Welsh (75% of all transactions). This fell to just 26 in Llanelli (10%), while in Cardiff’s Queen Street only five people used that cash point through the medium of Welsh, which amounted to less than 1%.

Meanwhile, three post offices measured the use of their Welsh language counter services, at Amlwch in Anglesey, in Llanelli, and at the Queens Arcade Post Office in Cardiff.

Half the customers spoke Welsh while posting, banking and paying bills at Amlwch. This figure fell dramatically to 0.8% in Llanelli, while no one at all spoke Welsh at the Cardiff branch.

Welsh Water was brought under the present Welsh Language Act in 2005, and is bound by law to provide a Welsh language service to customers.

But over a week, only 0.7% of hits on Welsh Water’s website proceeded to the Welsh language service, with 5,126 looking at web pages in English, and only 35 doing the same in Welsh.

During the week, Welsh Water received 240 complaints – none in Welsh.

And 635 calls were made to Welsh Water’s dedicated Welsh language line – 8.6% of all calls made during the week.

Although unable to provide a percentage, British Gas said 193 customers phoned their Welsh language call centre during the week. British Gas has 800,000 customers in Wales, and 3,000 of these have registered to receive correspondence in Welsh – less than 0.1% of Welsh customers.

British Gas has warned that new language rights incorporating the private sector could lead to higher gas bills.

“The energy industry is under a lot of pressure at the moment in terms of the cost it pays for the raw gas it provides to gas and electricity customers,” Rhys Jones, British Gas’ corporate affairs manager, tells the programme.

“So any costs above this occurring from any new Welsh Language Act are going to be quite high and there’s a possibility it will be passed on to the customers in the long term.”
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]Here's a Cut'n'paste from Walesonline --11/11/2008 SERVICES provided to customers through the medium of Welsh are barely used, according to new figures released today, despite increasing demands from language groups that more is done to make such services available. Despite the migration of large numbers of Welsh speakers into Cardiff, it seems hardly any of them use the language when getting money from cash machines in the Welsh capital. But as language activists step up their campaign for new Welsh language rights to force private companies into providing bilingual services, there are now warnings that this could lead to an increase in costs which would be passed on to already hard-up customers. S4C current affairs programme Y Byd ar Bedwar asked several large private companies to monitor their Welsh language services for a period of one week. The survey included banks, post offices and call centres across Wales. The results suggest that the language is rarely used commercially outside its heartlands. Barclays Bank measured the use of Welsh language services at cash points within branches in Caernarfon, Llanelli and Cardiff. In Caernarfon, 500 transactions were made in Welsh (75% of all transactions). This fell to just 26 in Llanelli (10%), while in Cardiff’s Queen Street only five people used that cash point through the medium of Welsh, which amounted to less than 1%. Meanwhile, three post offices measured the use of their Welsh language counter services, at Amlwch in Anglesey, in Llanelli, and at the Queens Arcade Post Office in Cardiff. Half the customers spoke Welsh while posting, banking and paying bills at Amlwch. This figure fell dramatically to 0.8% in Llanelli, while no one at all spoke Welsh at the Cardiff branch. Welsh Water was brought under the present Welsh Language Act in 2005, and is bound by law to provide a Welsh language service to customers. But over a week, only 0.7% of hits on Welsh Water’s website proceeded to the Welsh language service, with 5,126 looking at web pages in English, and only 35 doing the same in Welsh. During the week, Welsh Water received 240 complaints – none in Welsh. And 635 calls were made to Welsh Water’s dedicated Welsh language line – 8.6% of all calls made during the week. Although unable to provide a percentage, British Gas said 193 customers phoned their Welsh language call centre during the week. British Gas has 800,000 customers in Wales, and 3,000 of these have registered to receive correspondence in Welsh – less than 0.1% of Welsh customers. British Gas has warned that new language rights incorporating the private sector could lead to higher gas bills. “The energy industry is under a lot of pressure at the moment in terms of the cost it pays for the raw gas it provides to gas and electricity customers,” Rhys Jones, British Gas’ corporate affairs manager, tells the programme. “So any costs above this occurring from any new Welsh Language Act are going to be quite high and there’s a possibility it will be passed on to the customers in the long term.” Grüngemüse

7:10pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Monmouthshire Merlin says...

Samantha902013 wrote:
Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost"
Samantha, currently what you say is correct. However, there is a ground swell of opinion that is seeking the repeal of The Welsh Language Act.
That will put an end to this silliness and disgraceful waste.
[quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost"[/p][/quote]Samantha, currently what you say is correct. However, there is a ground swell of opinion that is seeking the repeal of The Welsh Language Act. That will put an end to this silliness and disgraceful waste. Monmouthshire Merlin

7:22pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Samantha....and I admire your "bravery", but if the Argus had a dedicated Welsh language site how many people in Newport do you think would use it? Apart from you and your snappy dog, "Glyndwr"? Get the point now?
Samantha....and I admire your "bravery", but if the Argus had a dedicated Welsh language site how many people in Newport do you think would use it? Apart from you and your snappy dog, "Glyndwr"? Get the point now? KarloMarko

7:23pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

Samantha902013 wrote:
This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else!

If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!!

Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example.

Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken!
Welsh language does not have equality with English is Wales.

Welsh is an "Official" language.
English is not.
So Welsh is given superior status.

You are right - it is the LAW. But laws can be repealed. The failed Welsh Language Act 1993 should be repealed to help stop Wales' slide into oblivion.
[quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else! If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!! Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example. Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken![/p][/quote]Welsh language does not have equality with English is Wales. Welsh is an "Official" language. English is not. So Welsh is given superior status. You are right - it is the LAW. But laws can be repealed. The failed Welsh Language Act 1993 should be repealed to help stop Wales' slide into oblivion. Grüngemüse

7:27pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Grüngemüse wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.
Here's a Cut'n'paste from Walesonline --11/11/2008

SERVICES provided to customers through the medium of Welsh are barely used, according to new figures released today, despite increasing demands from language groups that more is done to make such services available.

Despite the migration of large numbers of Welsh speakers into Cardiff, it seems hardly any of them use the language when getting money from cash machines in the Welsh capital.

But as language activists step up their campaign for new Welsh language rights to force private companies into providing bilingual services, there are now warnings that this could lead to an increase in costs which would be passed on to already hard-up customers.

S4C current affairs programme Y Byd ar Bedwar asked several large private companies to monitor their Welsh language services for a period of one week.

The survey included banks, post offices and call centres across Wales. The results suggest that the language is rarely used commercially outside its heartlands.

Barclays Bank measured the use of Welsh language services at cash points within branches in Caernarfon, Llanelli and Cardiff. In Caernarfon, 500 transactions were made in Welsh (75% of all transactions). This fell to just 26 in Llanelli (10%), while in Cardiff’s Queen Street only five people used that cash point through the medium of Welsh, which amounted to less than 1%.

Meanwhile, three post offices measured the use of their Welsh language counter services, at Amlwch in Anglesey, in Llanelli, and at the Queens Arcade Post Office in Cardiff.

Half the customers spoke Welsh while posting, banking and paying bills at Amlwch. This figure fell dramatically to 0.8% in Llanelli, while no one at all spoke Welsh at the Cardiff branch.

Welsh Water was brought under the present Welsh Language Act in 2005, and is bound by law to provide a Welsh language service to customers.

But over a week, only 0.7% of hits on Welsh Water’s website proceeded to the Welsh language service, with 5,126 looking at web pages in English, and only 35 doing the same in Welsh.

During the week, Welsh Water received 240 complaints – none in Welsh.

And 635 calls were made to Welsh Water’s dedicated Welsh language line – 8.6% of all calls made during the week.

Although unable to provide a percentage, British Gas said 193 customers phoned their Welsh language call centre during the week. British Gas has 800,000 customers in Wales, and 3,000 of these have registered to receive correspondence in Welsh – less than 0.1% of Welsh customers.

British Gas has warned that new language rights incorporating the private sector could lead to higher gas bills.

“The energy industry is under a lot of pressure at the moment in terms of the cost it pays for the raw gas it provides to gas and electricity customers,” Rhys Jones, British Gas’ corporate affairs manager, tells the programme.

“So any costs above this occurring from any new Welsh Language Act are going to be quite high and there’s a possibility it will be passed on to the customers in the long term.”
Whats your point ? In every case some people CHOSE to use Welsh rather than English. If you don't think its value for money try looking at most other things the WAG do where there's much bigger problems. You can vote for a party that doesn't support the Welsh Language Act but Labour, Conservatives and Libdems do - and Newport has 2 safe Labour WAG seats with the wasters Butler and Griffiths sure to be re-elected, and they won't rock any boat.
[quote][p][bold]Grüngemüse[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: I'm not a Welsh speaker but this is Wales and we should respect the rights of those that want to access Welsh language content. I've developed multi-lingual webpages and the cost is totally insignificant in the councils budget. The real issue here is once again Newport council commit to something and then don't do it, so a trivial issue gets blown out of proportion. If they don't intend to do it they should just say so.[/p][/quote]Here's a Cut'n'paste from Walesonline --11/11/2008 SERVICES provided to customers through the medium of Welsh are barely used, according to new figures released today, despite increasing demands from language groups that more is done to make such services available. Despite the migration of large numbers of Welsh speakers into Cardiff, it seems hardly any of them use the language when getting money from cash machines in the Welsh capital. But as language activists step up their campaign for new Welsh language rights to force private companies into providing bilingual services, there are now warnings that this could lead to an increase in costs which would be passed on to already hard-up customers. S4C current affairs programme Y Byd ar Bedwar asked several large private companies to monitor their Welsh language services for a period of one week. The survey included banks, post offices and call centres across Wales. The results suggest that the language is rarely used commercially outside its heartlands. Barclays Bank measured the use of Welsh language services at cash points within branches in Caernarfon, Llanelli and Cardiff. In Caernarfon, 500 transactions were made in Welsh (75% of all transactions). This fell to just 26 in Llanelli (10%), while in Cardiff’s Queen Street only five people used that cash point through the medium of Welsh, which amounted to less than 1%. Meanwhile, three post offices measured the use of their Welsh language counter services, at Amlwch in Anglesey, in Llanelli, and at the Queens Arcade Post Office in Cardiff. Half the customers spoke Welsh while posting, banking and paying bills at Amlwch. This figure fell dramatically to 0.8% in Llanelli, while no one at all spoke Welsh at the Cardiff branch. Welsh Water was brought under the present Welsh Language Act in 2005, and is bound by law to provide a Welsh language service to customers. But over a week, only 0.7% of hits on Welsh Water’s website proceeded to the Welsh language service, with 5,126 looking at web pages in English, and only 35 doing the same in Welsh. During the week, Welsh Water received 240 complaints – none in Welsh. And 635 calls were made to Welsh Water’s dedicated Welsh language line – 8.6% of all calls made during the week. Although unable to provide a percentage, British Gas said 193 customers phoned their Welsh language call centre during the week. British Gas has 800,000 customers in Wales, and 3,000 of these have registered to receive correspondence in Welsh – less than 0.1% of Welsh customers. British Gas has warned that new language rights incorporating the private sector could lead to higher gas bills. “The energy industry is under a lot of pressure at the moment in terms of the cost it pays for the raw gas it provides to gas and electricity customers,” Rhys Jones, British Gas’ corporate affairs manager, tells the programme. “So any costs above this occurring from any new Welsh Language Act are going to be quite high and there’s a possibility it will be passed on to the customers in the long term.”[/p][/quote]Whats your point ? In every case some people CHOSE to use Welsh rather than English. If you don't think its value for money try looking at most other things the WAG do where there's much bigger problems. You can vote for a party that doesn't support the Welsh Language Act but Labour, Conservatives and Libdems do - and Newport has 2 safe Labour WAG seats with the wasters Butler and Griffiths sure to be re-elected, and they won't rock any boat. NakedDancer

7:31pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

KarloMarko wrote:
Ivor the Engine has become..... Ivor the Welsh language gravy train!

"Toot Toot! All aboard...first stop Cardiff Bay!"
More like the Orient Express.
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: Ivor the Engine has become..... Ivor the Welsh language gravy train! "Toot Toot! All aboard...first stop Cardiff Bay!"[/p][/quote]More like the Orient Express. Grüngemüse

7:36pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

So the REAL point is that it doesn't matter a **** how many people actually want or use these services at whatever the cost per head....it should happen because its PURELY SYMBOLIC! Screw the user, we want it as part of our Project Wales! Our fantasy Wales that we cant get any other way.

Most people get over that kind of "politics" by the time they are six.
So the REAL point is that it doesn't matter a **** how many people actually want or use these services at whatever the cost per head....it should happen because its PURELY SYMBOLIC! Screw the user, we want it as part of our Project Wales! Our fantasy Wales that we cant get any other way. Most people get over that kind of "politics" by the time they are six. KarloMarko

7:37pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

Woodgnome wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
Instead of guessing, why not ask NCC or WAG what the annual costs of all the welsh translation services are? The cost is not peanuts as you seem to suggest.
I have seen a figure of £80 per double side of A4.
[quote][p][bold]Woodgnome[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]Instead of guessing, why not ask NCC or WAG what the annual costs of all the welsh translation services are? The cost is not peanuts as you seem to suggest.[/p][/quote]I have seen a figure of £80 per double side of A4. Grüngemüse

7:38pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Mervyn James says...

I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.
I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism. Mervyn James

7:43pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Anne teak says...

GardenVarietyMushroo
m
wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget.

Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free.

In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.
Exactly.,that was my point


WAG should provide a translation if necessary. They have enough people sitting round doing nothing much,

And Wales is not an extra English county..so why not?
[quote][p][bold]GardenVarietyMushroo m[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]I think we should be careful of bandying phrases about like 'shouldn't be too expensive' - this is NCC we're talking about here don't forget. Secondly, you've kind of shot yourself in the foot a little because I just ran bits of NCC's website through google translate, and it works very well. Seems to me that if you want to read something on the internet in Welsh, then you already have that facility, essentially for free. In fact I don't know why the WAG don't just write a browser extension for automatically translating a webpage into Welsh, and be done with it.[/p][/quote]Exactly.,that was my point WAG should provide a translation if necessary. They have enough people sitting round doing nothing much, And Wales is not an extra English county..so why not? Anne teak

7:47pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen.
Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen. Banjalucka

7:53pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Anne teak says...

Amusing to see how many 'Welsh' people on this site just wanting to roll over and give in to English speakers.

Logically these intolerants, should not be supporting Welsh rugby or football either.
Amusing to see how many 'Welsh' people on this site just wanting to roll over and give in to English speakers. Logically these intolerants, should not be supporting Welsh rugby or football either. Anne teak

7:59pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Grüngemüse says...

Samantha902013 wrote:
Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost"
Of course laws can be changed and REPEALED. The Welsh Language Act 1993 and its subsequent amendments were intended to support the language. They have clearly failed.
Wales is sliding backwards on any measure.
Check out recent news stories;
PISA report on education - Wales worst UK, which itself is way down the international list.
NHS in Wales worse than on England.
Economic activity - worst in UK.
It goes on and on.

Wales' woes cannot all be laid at the door of the Welsh language policies - but they sure as hell don't help.

The Welsh Language Act 1993 has FAILED in its objective and should be REPEALED to free Wales to catch up with the modern world AS IT IS not as some would like it to be!
[quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: Regardless to what languages people speak in Wales, Welsh has been the longest living language which people still speak today along with many people who are learning Welsh. Welsh AND English are both official languages of Wales with equal status!! So there are going to be Welsh and English signs! Get over it guys! Nothing you say is going to change the law! No matter the "cost"[/p][/quote]Of course laws can be changed and REPEALED. The Welsh Language Act 1993 and its subsequent amendments were intended to support the language. They have clearly failed. Wales is sliding backwards on any measure. Check out recent news stories; PISA report on education - Wales worst UK, which itself is way down the international list. NHS in Wales worse than on England. Economic activity - worst in UK. It goes on and on. Wales' woes cannot all be laid at the door of the Welsh language policies - but they sure as hell don't help. The Welsh Language Act 1993 has FAILED in its objective and should be REPEALED to free Wales to catch up with the modern world AS IT IS not as some would like it to be! Grüngemüse

8:02pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.
For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c. KarloMarko

8:04pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?
Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Banjalucka

8:50pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

KarloMarko wrote:
For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.
You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you.
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.[/p][/quote]You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you. Thomas O'Malley

8:50pm Mon 23 Dec 13

scraptheWAG says...

we should put it to the vote and everyone who supports this backward language should have their NI numbers taken and pay for the guff in a extra allowance but I suppose most will be unemployed or claim that they are too disabled to work.
we should put it to the vote and everyone who supports this backward language should have their NI numbers taken and pay for the guff in a extra allowance but I suppose most will be unemployed or claim that they are too disabled to work. scraptheWAG

8:52pm Mon 23 Dec 13

ExNewport says...

Typical Newportonian comments. Thank God I'm out.
Typical Newportonian comments. Thank God I'm out. ExNewport

9:05pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
KarloMarko wrote:
For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.
You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you.
"When was Wales?" (Prof) Glwyn Alf Williams. The formation of a "Wales" via linked industrialisation and internal/inward migration. THE classic analysis et history.

Worth reading. You can read?

You just rub two (nationlist) brain cells together.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.[/p][/quote]You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you.[/p][/quote]"When was Wales?" (Prof) Glwyn Alf Williams. The formation of a "Wales" via linked industrialisation and internal/inward migration. THE classic analysis et history. Worth reading. You can read? You just rub two (nationlist) brain cells together. KarloMarko

9:06pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

scraptheWAG wrote:
we should put it to the vote and everyone who supports this backward language should have their NI numbers taken and pay for the guff in a extra allowance but I suppose most will be unemployed or claim that they are too disabled to work.
Seriously ? the unemployed and disabled are the Welsh language supporters and its their fault ? what a disgrace.
[quote][p][bold]scraptheWAG[/bold] wrote: we should put it to the vote and everyone who supports this backward language should have their NI numbers taken and pay for the guff in a extra allowance but I suppose most will be unemployed or claim that they are too disabled to work.[/p][/quote]Seriously ? the unemployed and disabled are the Welsh language supporters and its their fault ? what a disgrace. NakedDancer

9:11pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

KarloMarko wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
KarloMarko wrote:
For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.
You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you.
"When was Wales?" (Prof) Glwyn Alf Williams. The formation of a "Wales" via linked industrialisation and internal/inward migration. THE classic analysis et history.

Worth reading. You can read?

You just rub two (nationlist) brain cells together.
Can you say anything without insults ?. Take your poison back to England.
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.[/p][/quote]You really don't have to repeat you dislike Wales and the Welsh. Just go back to England and take your snide spiteful comments with you. We really wont miss you.[/p][/quote]"When was Wales?" (Prof) Glwyn Alf Williams. The formation of a "Wales" via linked industrialisation and internal/inward migration. THE classic analysis et history. Worth reading. You can read? You just rub two (nationlist) brain cells together.[/p][/quote]Can you say anything without insults ?. Take your poison back to England. NakedDancer

9:27pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

"Get back to England" (sic)

Well here we are again in Nat Land. Anyone who calls the Fantasy Wales (c) project into question should just..."Get back to England"

I've lived here on and off for some sixty years. Simple minded bigots and petit myth mongers notwithstanding.
"Get back to England" (sic) Well here we are again in Nat Land. Anyone who calls the Fantasy Wales (c) project into question should just..."Get back to England" I've lived here on and off for some sixty years. Simple minded bigots and petit myth mongers notwithstanding. KarloMarko

9:46pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.
Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate. Thomas O'Malley

9:58pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

My, the clowns are out tonight! Dai ap Smart's Circus in town for Christmas? Saunders Lewis still ringmaster?

Shame you can't get the local audiences these days. I blame universities and their fancy comopolitan educations giving people "horizons" beyond the valley. And people from "outside" of course. Especially "them".
My, the clowns are out tonight! Dai ap Smart's Circus in town for Christmas? Saunders Lewis still ringmaster? Shame you can't get the local audiences these days. I blame universities and their fancy comopolitan educations giving people "horizons" beyond the valley. And people from "outside" of course. Especially "them". KarloMarko

10:12pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.
I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.[/p][/quote]I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start. Llanmartinangel

10:30pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.
I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.
I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.[/p][/quote]I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.[/p][/quote]I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance. Thomas O'Malley

10:35pm Mon 23 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.
I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.
I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance.
I accept the human right for someone to call themselves a chimpanzee. But not if I have to pay for translation into a language which isn't necessary.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.[/p][/quote]I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.[/p][/quote]I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance.[/p][/quote]I accept the human right for someone to call themselves a chimpanzee. But not if I have to pay for translation into a language which isn't necessary. Llanmartinangel

10:47pm Mon 23 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

There's a bit in "The Life of Brian" where one of the revolutionary male followers demands the "human right to give birth just like a woman!". When they point out he doesn't have quite the anatomy, he then demands the "symbolic right to give birth then!"

Welsh Nationalism...all about the "symbols".

Merry Xmas.
There's a bit in "The Life of Brian" where one of the revolutionary male followers demands the "human right to give birth just like a woman!". When they point out he doesn't have quite the anatomy, he then demands the "symbolic right to give birth then!" Welsh Nationalism...all about the "symbols". Merry Xmas. KarloMarko

11:06pm Mon 23 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.
I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.
I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance.
I accept the human right for someone to call themselves a chimpanzee. But not if I have to pay for translation into a language which isn't necessary.
Er, no - like KarloMarko you've already said you are anti-welsh, not just anti-Welsh language or anti-website.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: Due to your your spiteful insults no-one takes you seriously. Maybe you insult strangers in real life but of course your not that brave. Try going down to Cardiff city centre and spouting your bile. Sixty years of hating Wales and the Welsh - you really should move - lots of minorities in England for you to hate.[/p][/quote]I ask again: who is Welsh? Is he insulting a Somali born here? Someone of English parents who's lived here just for Uni. It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start.[/p][/quote]I say again, anyone that considers themselves Welsh. Anyone that considers themselves Somali is Somali. If you cant accept basic human right to choose your identity you have a big problem. But your welcome to go to Cardiff city centre and spout nonsense. Thanks for proving my point again though re intolerance.[/p][/quote]I accept the human right for someone to call themselves a chimpanzee. But not if I have to pay for translation into a language which isn't necessary.[/p][/quote]Er, no - like KarloMarko you've already said you are anti-welsh, not just anti-Welsh language or anti-website. NakedDancer

9:54am Tue 24 Dec 13

Mervyn James says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen.
'Most here' are anti-welsh so biased don't you think ? I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. When they do I'd be more than happy to respond to them but carping about something you know nothing about doesn't seem to have a point.

You say there are two sides,but anyone with half an eye reading this topic would very much doubt it,and it seems any suspicion of support for welsh invokes this 'Welsh Not' syndrome among those for whom English is all they have,but minus the identity. As I said I didn't think the joke at Newport was the way to do things, given the real hatred for welsh/its culture/ and its assembly in Newport.

If I was part (And I am), of a language culture that has survived despite hundreds of years of real oppression, then I am proud of that. Wales music, arts and well respected throughout the world, Llangollen is a beacon of welsh endevour where all races are welcomed and united in song and in dance, compare that with the doomsday merchants and no hopers moaning all the time about something they know little or nothing about, I know my money is well spent preserving Welsh and Wales.

Talk it up not down,people forget what it BRINGS to Wales, simply because they can't be bothered to look. Americans would make what we have a real money and job spinner,here I think is where welsh language and culture is failing, the soft sell clearly doesn't work. Newport's Eistedd was as well attended as any Eisteddfod in Wales,which tends to suggest a lot here are the r real minority.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen.[/p][/quote]'Most here' are anti-welsh so biased don't you think ? I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. When they do I'd be more than happy to respond to them but carping about something you know nothing about doesn't seem to have a point. You say there are two sides,but anyone with half an eye reading this topic would very much doubt it,and it seems any suspicion of support for welsh invokes this 'Welsh Not' syndrome among those for whom English is all they have,but minus the identity. As I said I didn't think the joke at Newport was the way to do things, given the real hatred for welsh/its culture/ and its assembly in Newport. If I was part (And I am), of a language culture that has survived despite hundreds of years of real oppression, then I am proud of that. Wales music, arts and well respected throughout the world, Llangollen is a beacon of welsh endevour where all races are welcomed and united in song and in dance, compare that with the doomsday merchants and no hopers moaning all the time about something they know little or nothing about, I know my money is well spent preserving Welsh and Wales. Talk it up not down,people forget what it BRINGS to Wales, simply because they can't be bothered to look. Americans would make what we have a real money and job spinner,here I think is where welsh language and culture is failing, the soft sell clearly doesn't work. Newport's Eistedd was as well attended as any Eisteddfod in Wales,which tends to suggest a lot here are the r real minority. Mervyn James

9:55am Tue 24 Dec 13

Anne teak says...

Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No. Anne teak

10:22am Tue 24 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Well Mrs Teak, you sure confused me!
1. We all know that Wales is a separate country. No prob with that. Are you a devoluionist then?
2.Your comparison with national support sucks. So anyone who supports Wales in sport but not as a Welsh speaking nation is a hypocrite? Get real. I don't thing 50,000 at a match would agree with you. I can just see you in the middle of the pitch on the stage shouting out You are all hypocrites, get out!'
3.Like it or not, 99.9% in Wales speak English. It is the common communicating language. Welsh isn't. Nothing racist in that gal. I think Welsh is a wonderful language but dated in modern world.

Mrs Teak people wandering about town speaking Welsh all the time is never going to happen. Great for culture etc, which should be encouraged but not for day to day reality.
Well Mrs Teak, you sure confused me! 1. We all know that Wales is a separate country. No prob with that. Are you a devoluionist then? 2.Your comparison with national support sucks. So anyone who supports Wales in sport but not as a Welsh speaking nation is a hypocrite? Get real. I don't thing 50,000 at a match would agree with you. I can just see you in the middle of the pitch on the stage shouting out You are all hypocrites, get out!' 3.Like it or not, 99.9% in Wales speak English. It is the common communicating language. Welsh isn't. Nothing racist in that gal. I think Welsh is a wonderful language but dated in modern world. Mrs Teak people wandering about town speaking Welsh all the time is never going to happen. Great for culture etc, which should be encouraged but not for day to day reality. Banjalucka

10:24am Tue 24 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
[quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted. Llanmartinangel

11:56am Tue 24 Dec 13

haggy says...

white white wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
This is Wales.

It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice.

...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.
bbc wales has one as well
choice is the word. but we are not given choice my children are force fed welsh. i was born in Cardiff as was my father granddad ect we never learnt welsh English is spoken in many countries welsh in one i know what i want my children to speak how about teaching sign to the kids they would get more use out of it than welsh again CHOICE matters
[quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: This is Wales. It has it's own language - and efforts should be made to give people a choice. ...And it shouldn't be too expensive to provide a Welsh-translated part of the website..try running the English one through Google translate Newport- and then just adding it on.[/p][/quote]bbc wales has one as well[/p][/quote]choice is the word. but we are not given choice my children are force fed welsh. i was born in Cardiff as was my father granddad ect we never learnt welsh English is spoken in many countries welsh in one i know what i want my children to speak how about teaching sign to the kids they would get more use out of it than welsh again CHOICE matters haggy

2:40pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

KarloMarko wrote:
For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.
don't be daft, to watch S4C one would need a TV set and electricity, how could someone living near Brecon do it when their main source of energy would be tallow candles, and source of heating?, whatever they could find to burn?

Today we live a multicultural style of ;life generated over centuries from inward immigration, usually in a period when the basic export industries, coal, timber, iron etc., needed far more labour than the region itself could provide.
The language went into almost terminal decline NOT because of that immigration, but because it was the only way all those immigrants could communicate with one another, and as English is a far more comprehensible languagenthan the Cymraeg, it was the Cymro themselves who opted to 'lose' it in favour of a tongue they could make far better use of.

Had the main tranche of immigrant been German or Russian, we would today all be yacking in German or Russian, not English.

Had the original non English speaking Cymro, not decided their offspring would be better of more affluent and seriously wider educated by adopting English, the Welsh diaspora, like that from Scotland and Ireland, hundreds of thousands of the young would NOT have departed for America, Australia, wherever, they would have stayed at home, but even then, due to the international adoption by virtually all other nation states, they would still have been taking English as a matter of course.

Cymdaithas can scream all it likes, but it will never b e in a position to oust English

Time to shut up shop and go away.
[quote][p][bold]KarloMarko[/bold] wrote: For Gods sake the Welsh are not a "race"! Deeply misused though that concept is anyway. Wales /Welsh is a history of constant inward migration from England and the wider Europe etc. and cultural inter marriage. Thank God for that otherwise we would all be living in a cottage outside Bangor watching S4c.[/p][/quote]don't be daft, to watch S4C one would need a TV set and electricity, how could someone living near Brecon do it when their main source of energy would be tallow candles, and source of heating?, whatever they could find to burn? Today we live a multicultural style of ;life generated over centuries from inward immigration, usually in a period when the basic export industries, coal, timber, iron etc., needed far more labour than the region itself could provide. The language went into almost terminal decline NOT because of that immigration, but because it was the only way all those immigrants could communicate with one another, and as English is a far more comprehensible languagenthan the Cymraeg, it was the Cymro themselves who opted to 'lose' it in favour of a tongue they could make far better use of. Had the main tranche of immigrant been German or Russian, we would today all be yacking in German or Russian, not English. Had the original non English speaking Cymro, not decided their offspring would be better of more affluent and seriously wider educated by adopting English, the Welsh diaspora, like that from Scotland and Ireland, hundreds of thousands of the young would NOT have departed for America, Australia, wherever, they would have stayed at home, but even then, due to the international adoption by virtually all other nation states, they would still have been taking English as a matter of course. Cymdaithas can scream all it likes, but it will never b e in a position to oust English Time to shut up shop and go away. varteg1

2:53pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you. Thomas O'Malley

3:08pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL.
Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL. Banjalucka

4:02pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion. Llanmartinangel

4:41pm Tue 24 Dec 13

RR1234 says...

I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking.
I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking. RR1234

6:22pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

RR1234 wrote:
I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking.
Check out 2011 census. 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (that is, 15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language.
[quote][p][bold]RR1234[/bold] wrote: I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking.[/p][/quote]Check out 2011 census. 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (that is, 15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language. Thomas O'Malley

6:34pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL.
Do you not understand the concept of a username ? Thomas O'Malley is a Disney character. And I haven't said I'm Welsh.

What I object to is the 'Wales doesn't even exist' Nazis like Llanmartin who fuel divisions in society. We all have the right to choose what we want to be.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL.[/p][/quote]Do you not understand the concept of a username ? Thomas O'Malley is a Disney character. And I haven't said I'm Welsh. What I object to is the 'Wales doesn't even exist' Nazis like Llanmartin who fuel divisions in society. We all have the right to choose what we want to be. Thomas O'Malley

6:45pm Tue 24 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.[/p][/quote]zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you. NakedDancer

7:13pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Stevenboy says...

NakedDancer wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.
I love the irony of you mentioning civilisation whilst the Wales spends millions on a medieval language and at the same time people are dying here on waiting lists and visiting food banks. Maybe a trip to civilisation would be a revelation for you.
[quote][p][bold]NakedDancer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.[/p][/quote]zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.[/p][/quote]I love the irony of you mentioning civilisation whilst the Wales spends millions on a medieval language and at the same time people are dying here on waiting lists and visiting food banks. Maybe a trip to civilisation would be a revelation for you. Stevenboy

7:19pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

county mad wrote:
Samantha902013 wrote:
This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else!

If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!!

Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example.

Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken!
If you go to spain or greece you may detect the populace speak spnish or greek so you would expect the signage to be in the local language DOH!! The majority of S.East wales ,about 98.9% speak english, so why waste all that money on signs ,forms etc
I was informed that signage on the M4 on this side of the Severn, were not just twice the cost because of dual language, but because they also had to be more wind resistant due to their size, extra support and foundations were required, which I was made some signs as much as four times as expensive as single language signs.signs.

Just one of those extra hidden costs that never get mentioned, until someone take the trouble to find out such details.

I wonder how many such expensive signs there are in Wales?
[quote][p][bold]county mad[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Samantha902013[/bold] wrote: This really makes my blood boil. To all you anti Welsh people on here!The fact of this matter is that Welsh Is the language of Wales, whether you understand it or not. It is the LAW for WELSH to have equal status as the English! Therefore Newport should have a bilingual website! So quit your moaning, and rant about something else! If you go to Spain or Greece etc you will see their signs in their language so why can't Wales? This pettiness towards the Welsh language needs to stop! If you can't read or speak it, that's down to you! If you don't like it and you "don't wanna pay for it" as some people have mentioned it then I suggest you move out of Wales. There's lots of things our money goes on like benefits & people sit and take it, without even looking for work, there's people that get pregnant or have more kids for extra money and a house but do you see people ranting and moaning about that! NO!!!! Face the facts that sometimes we just gotta deal with what goes on in our society , yes not everything that happens in life we like and yes sometimes we are not going to please everyone, and this is a prime example. Deal with it! You live in WALES where WELSH and English is spoken![/p][/quote]If you go to spain or greece you may detect the populace speak spnish or greek so you would expect the signage to be in the local language DOH!! The majority of S.East wales ,about 98.9% speak english, so why waste all that money on signs ,forms etc[/p][/quote]I was informed that signage on the M4 on this side of the Severn, were not just twice the cost because of dual language, but because they also had to be more wind resistant due to their size, extra support and foundations were required, which I was made some signs as much as four times as expensive as single language signs.signs. Just one of those extra hidden costs that never get mentioned, until someone take the trouble to find out such details. I wonder how many such expensive signs there are in Wales? varteg1

7:26pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

NakedDancer wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.
That's the I security I was referring to talking. Even facts and opinion scare you.
[quote][p][bold]NakedDancer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.[/p][/quote]zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.[/p][/quote]That's the I security I was referring to talking. Even facts and opinion scare you. Llanmartinangel

7:28pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Banjalucka wrote:
Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL.
Do you not understand the concept of a username ? Thomas O'Malley is a Disney character. And I haven't said I'm Welsh.

What I object to is the 'Wales doesn't even exist' Nazis like Llanmartin who fuel divisions in society. We all have the right to choose what we want to be.
You don't have the right to make other people work to pay for it.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Tommy O'Malley - For such a Welshie, you've picked a grand Welsh name, be jabers! By quoting Three other commentators your message is slightly confusing. Who are you repling to - me. Mrs Teal and Lanmartin? And why the heck are people intolerant.? I will repeat. Welsh is great lingo for cultural stuff - Esiteddfods and such . BUT NOT DAY TO DAY!! AND IT NEVER WILL.[/p][/quote]Do you not understand the concept of a username ? Thomas O'Malley is a Disney character. And I haven't said I'm Welsh. What I object to is the 'Wales doesn't even exist' Nazis like Llanmartin who fuel divisions in society. We all have the right to choose what we want to be.[/p][/quote]You don't have the right to make other people work to pay for it. Llanmartinangel

7:32pm Tue 24 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and haven't commented on the language. That doesn't prevent me having a basic level of respect for other human beings. Unlike you with your petty windup "Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up". Just go back to England, please.
I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and haven't commented on the language. That doesn't prevent me having a basic level of respect for other human beings. Unlike you with your petty windup "Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up". Just go back to England, please. NakedDancer

7:52pm Tue 24 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
NakedDancer wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.
That's the I security I was referring to talking. Even facts and opinion scare you.
Jeeez. Can you really not stop?.Take your spite and hate and go !
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NakedDancer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.[/p][/quote]zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.[/p][/quote]That's the I security I was referring to talking. Even facts and opinion scare you.[/p][/quote]Jeeez. Can you really not stop?.Take your spite and hate and go ! NakedDancer

7:55pm Tue 24 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Stevenboy wrote:
NakedDancer wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.
zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.
I love the irony of you mentioning civilisation whilst the Wales spends millions on a medieval language and at the same time people are dying here on waiting lists and visiting food banks. Maybe a trip to civilisation would be a revelation for you.
I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and haven't commented on the language. That doesn't prevent me having a basic level of respect for other human beings. Unlike you with your petty windup "Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up". Just go back to England, please.
[quote][p][bold]Stevenboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]NakedDancer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]Born and brought up here for a start. And I was looking for it on the United Nations website. It isn't there. And I didn't 'deny' anyone calling themselves Welsh, I asked that someone define exactly what it meant. It is merely an identity with which some people cloak themselves like a comfort blanket. Yet it is spoken about on here like the 'Welsh' are something apart. That is entirely an illusion.[/p][/quote]zzzzzz Your words "It's just a comfort blanket for insecure people it isn't a nationality. It isn't a nation for a start." Take your hate and go as far away from civilised people as possible. The world doesn't need you.[/p][/quote]I love the irony of you mentioning civilisation whilst the Wales spends millions on a medieval language and at the same time people are dying here on waiting lists and visiting food banks. Maybe a trip to civilisation would be a revelation for you.[/p][/quote]I have plenty of complaints about the WAG and haven't commented on the language. That doesn't prevent me having a basic level of respect for other human beings. Unlike you with your petty windup "Give us a break for god sake, the whole 'Welsh' thing is made up". Just go back to England, please. NakedDancer

9:01pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Roger Elliot says...

I am all for Welsh speaking. We are not "an English speaking nation" we are a BILINGUAL one.

But NOTHING seems to be top of the agenda for this council (unless it's destroying murals)

There has been a dodgy pedestrian traffic light by the Riverfront since forever. This is an actual DANGER TO HUMAN LIFE yet they are not doing a thing about it.

Cue their shill Vox Dei;_
I am all for Welsh speaking. We are not "an English speaking nation" we are a BILINGUAL one. But NOTHING seems to be top of the agenda for this council (unless it's destroying murals) There has been a dodgy pedestrian traffic light by the Riverfront since forever. This is an actual DANGER TO HUMAN LIFE yet they are not doing a thing about it. Cue their shill Vox Dei;_ Roger Elliot

9:37pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Vox Dei says...

You have been reading too much propaganda. There is no such thing as a "bilingual nation". A person can be bilingual, but given any sufficiently large and diverse population there will be a multitude of languages spoken. In order of popularity English is top and Welsh way down near the bottom.
You have been reading too much propaganda. There is no such thing as a "bilingual nation". A person can be bilingual, but given any sufficiently large and diverse population there will be a multitude of languages spoken. In order of popularity English is top and Welsh way down near the bottom. Vox Dei

10:00pm Tue 24 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy o'Malley - well we agree on that bro. Naked Dancer - you are extremely worked up. Vox Dei - For once i agree with you! Let it rest.
Tommy o'Malley - well we agree on that bro. Naked Dancer - you are extremely worked up. Vox Dei - For once i agree with you! Let it rest. Banjalucka

10:12pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
RR1234 wrote:
I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking.
Check out 2011 census. 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (that is, 15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language.
I worked for the ONS in 2001, my task was to revisit selected areas and persons to discuss certain factors about the census take.

I often chatted with people who quite brazenly told me they had declared they were fluent, but when I tried a few words of Cymraeg on them during the chat , they were obviously not able to respond. In some two or three hundred interviewed by myself and my wife, ( we had separate rosters) I found none to be fluent, I believe my wife found the same. In fact few could even tell me what roads signs they saw every day, nor could they tell me what the name of their village, road or town, meant.

Having worked in the building industry all over the eastern valley and Cardiff areas for the last fifty years, I only ever met a handful of Cymraeg speakers, who I would consider to be fluent, one a Somali ( could have been a Bengali or Pakistani) shopkeeper who had at one time had a small Spar type outlet in Pontadulais, where he found it useful to learn the language as many of his elderly customers spoke Cymraeg as a first language. In reference to his shop he then ran in Newport, he said he never heard anyone speak the language.

According to local data, including on Paul Murphy's web site, the estimated fluency rate in Torfaen ranges between 15% (Cymdaithas) and 2 to 3% according to Murphy.
Those figures should mean in my village some 8 to ten people are fluent, but as far as I am aware I know of no one actually fluent.
The only other person who I knew for certain to be totally fluent, , now sadly deceased, lived in Pontypool. and she came form Gogland anyway.

My two eldest grandchildren attended Cwmcarn, a Ysgol Gymraeg, the boy has never used ti since leaving school, thge girl is now able to use it because her daughters attend a school in Cwmbran and she has refreshed her usage to help her kids get through the school. Beyond that, she also has no use for it. If it was not for the demands of the school in requiring her kids to take lessons, I seriously doubt she would be using it at all.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]RR1234[/bold] wrote: I empathesize with the welsh speakers who wish to keep 'their sense of identity.' Also I agree that it probably would cost peanuts to have a website in welsh in the grand scheme of things. However im interested in the 560,000 welsh speakers quote. Is that people who routinely use the language day to day, or does it include people who have a GCSE in Welsh too. My younger siblings have all/are are currently learning welsh but I would not class them as welsh speakers. I have done French GCSE and can quite happy go into a shop and ask for a red balloon and purchase it. Does not really make me french speaking.[/p][/quote]Check out 2011 census. 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (that is, 15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language.[/p][/quote]I worked for the ONS in 2001, my task was to revisit selected areas and persons to discuss certain factors about the census take. I often chatted with people who quite brazenly told me they had declared they were fluent, but when I tried a few words of Cymraeg on them during the chat , they were obviously not able to respond. In some two or three hundred interviewed by myself and my wife, ( we had separate rosters) I found none to be fluent, I believe my wife found the same. In fact few could even tell me what roads signs they saw every day, nor could they tell me what the name of their village, road or town, meant. Having worked in the building industry all over the eastern valley and Cardiff areas for the last fifty years, I only ever met a handful of Cymraeg speakers, who I would consider to be fluent, one a Somali ( could have been a Bengali or Pakistani) shopkeeper who had at one time had a small Spar type outlet in Pontadulais, where he found it useful to learn the language as many of his elderly customers spoke Cymraeg as a first language. In reference to his shop he then ran in Newport, he said he never heard anyone speak the language. According to local data, including on Paul Murphy's web site, the estimated fluency rate in Torfaen ranges between 15% (Cymdaithas) and 2 to 3% according to Murphy. Those figures should mean in my village some 8 to ten people are fluent, but as far as I am aware I know of no one actually fluent. The only other person who I knew for certain to be totally fluent, , now sadly deceased, lived in Pontypool. and she came form Gogland anyway. My two eldest grandchildren attended Cwmcarn, a Ysgol Gymraeg, the boy has never used ti since leaving school, thge girl is now able to use it because her daughters attend a school in Cwmbran and she has refreshed her usage to help her kids get through the school. Beyond that, she also has no use for it. If it was not for the demands of the school in requiring her kids to take lessons, I seriously doubt she would be using it at all. varteg1

10:26pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even.
Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions..
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even. Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions.. varteg1

10:44pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Anne teak wrote:
Amusing to see how many 'Welsh' people on this site just wanting to roll over and give in to English speakers.

Logically these intolerants, should not be supporting Welsh rugby or football either.
How do you come to terms with the hundreds of millions, all over the globe, who do not even speak English, yet support Manchester United or Liverpool et al?

Even in Italy, France Germany, proud nations with languages that are gradually being eroded by their acceptance of English as the de Rigeur second language. for industrial, commercial and international purposes.

Many of such countries also carry regional languages, but which are not forced in to public and academic life beyond at basic education levels.

I suggest they also do not take excessive amounts of national funding to promote enforcement to the same extent as happens in Wales.
[quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Amusing to see how many 'Welsh' people on this site just wanting to roll over and give in to English speakers. Logically these intolerants, should not be supporting Welsh rugby or football either.[/p][/quote]How do you come to terms with the hundreds of millions, all over the globe, who do not even speak English, yet support Manchester United or Liverpool et al? Even in Italy, France Germany, proud nations with languages that are gradually being eroded by their acceptance of English as the de Rigeur second language. for industrial, commercial and international purposes. Many of such countries also carry regional languages, but which are not forced in to public and academic life beyond at basic education levels. I suggest they also do not take excessive amounts of national funding to promote enforcement to the same extent as happens in Wales. varteg1

10:56pm Tue 24 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Mervyn James wrote:
I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.
Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro.

So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future.





I am waiting.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.[/p][/quote]Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro. So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future. I am waiting. varteg1

12:51am Wed 25 Dec 13

Leepod says...

Yawn!
Yawn! Leepod

2:01pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Mervyn James says...

varteg1 wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.
Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro.

So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future.





I am waiting.
Your wait is over. I am concerned you are not aware of the link between language and culture, one gets a better appreciation of a culture if you acquire the language too, this is basics, you go to spain you learn spanish (Or not If you are english you just shout at them and call them thick etc). What you don't understand is what worries you that's the rub, pick up some welsh then you will know what you are criticizing for a start ! The rhetoric is so silly and biased on ignorance I am surprised the Argus allows the rants to continue. That's free speech, except IF you are aiming at polish, Arabic, whatever then you would be wise to shut up wouldn't you ? The law protects them,doesn't protect welsh speakers from attack. Welsh culture and language has a lot going for it, but if you are determined NOT to accept welsh or the welsh speaker and especially refute their cultural identity because you are unsure of your own well..........
[quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.[/p][/quote]Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro. So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future. I am waiting.[/p][/quote]Your wait is over. I am concerned you are not aware of the link between language and culture, one gets a better appreciation of a culture if you acquire the language too, this is basics, you go to spain you learn spanish (Or not If you are english you just shout at them and call them thick etc). What you don't understand is what worries you that's the rub, pick up some welsh then you will know what you are criticizing for a start ! The rhetoric is so silly and biased on ignorance I am surprised the Argus allows the rants to continue. That's free speech, except IF you are aiming at polish, Arabic, whatever then you would be wise to shut up wouldn't you ? The law protects them,doesn't protect welsh speakers from attack. Welsh culture and language has a lot going for it, but if you are determined NOT to accept welsh or the welsh speaker and especially refute their cultural identity because you are unsure of your own well.......... Mervyn James

2:23pm Thu 26 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Banjalucka wrote:
Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen.
'Most here' are anti-welsh so biased don't you think ? I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. When they do I'd be more than happy to respond to them but carping about something you know nothing about doesn't seem to have a point.

You say there are two sides,but anyone with half an eye reading this topic would very much doubt it,and it seems any suspicion of support for welsh invokes this 'Welsh Not' syndrome among those for whom English is all they have,but minus the identity. As I said I didn't think the joke at Newport was the way to do things, given the real hatred for welsh/its culture/ and its assembly in Newport.

If I was part (And I am), of a language culture that has survived despite hundreds of years of real oppression, then I am proud of that. Wales music, arts and well respected throughout the world, Llangollen is a beacon of welsh endevour where all races are welcomed and united in song and in dance, compare that with the doomsday merchants and no hopers moaning all the time about something they know little or nothing about, I know my money is well spent preserving Welsh and Wales.

Talk it up not down,people forget what it BRINGS to Wales, simply because they can't be bothered to look. Americans would make what we have a real money and job spinner,here I think is where welsh language and culture is failing, the soft sell clearly doesn't work. Newport's Eistedd was as well attended as any Eisteddfod in Wales,which tends to suggest a lot here are the r real minority.
MJ writes....

...." I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. ...."


I have never been to a star cluster that exists as far as we know, some multi million light years away, but I can understand that great distance in time and measurement is involved, despite the fact I CAN understand what is involved.

Cymraeg is another way of expressing concepts in oral and textual terms, it is no different than English, or any of the other hundreds of languages and dialects across the globe.
There is nothing mystic about Cymraeg, as the Cymro themselves realised, hence their general option to discard it in favour of a more readily usable tongue. Which is, as most of those hundreds of other language speakers are daily doing, if not actually adopting English as their premier language, they most certainly are adopting English as their second tongue, or as their global lingua Franca,
As more English gets adopted, so their native tongue declines, either by insinuating much English wordage into their own lingo, or by adopting from the English, because English words are common parlance across borders, or most certainly, nowadays, on the internet.

And that applies just as much to the Cymraeg as to the dialects spoken by a few tribes people in the depths of the Amazonian jungle to the Chinese, Japanese and wherever trade, commerce, air travel, radio communications and internet use has become a normal part of our world. Forced attempts to reverse the trend by funding a language that is actually really to old to be properly adapted to the modern era, is a folly and a fallacious exercise.

Conflating the attendance to a festival with actual demand for the language, cannot make up for the reality of the decline, nor can making reference to what Americans want. Mind you, if they want it so badly, maybe they can take it off our hands.

Perhaps, in finality, you can explain just what, in your opinion , the Language brings to Wales besides growing deprivation as hundreds of millions of the money raised from Non Cymraeg speakers is perceived as being wasted on it's promotion.

It's not a case of 'forgetting' it's more a case of having really nothing to remember before we need to forget.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Mervyn - Not all this again bro!! Two sides to everything. What can the language do for welsh people that English can't? Quite honestly most here don't give a hoot about it and think it is a complete waste of cash. I am not sure what all you 'bairds' want. It ain't going to happen.[/p][/quote]'Most here' are anti-welsh so biased don't you think ? I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. When they do I'd be more than happy to respond to them but carping about something you know nothing about doesn't seem to have a point. You say there are two sides,but anyone with half an eye reading this topic would very much doubt it,and it seems any suspicion of support for welsh invokes this 'Welsh Not' syndrome among those for whom English is all they have,but minus the identity. As I said I didn't think the joke at Newport was the way to do things, given the real hatred for welsh/its culture/ and its assembly in Newport. If I was part (And I am), of a language culture that has survived despite hundreds of years of real oppression, then I am proud of that. Wales music, arts and well respected throughout the world, Llangollen is a beacon of welsh endevour where all races are welcomed and united in song and in dance, compare that with the doomsday merchants and no hopers moaning all the time about something they know little or nothing about, I know my money is well spent preserving Welsh and Wales. Talk it up not down,people forget what it BRINGS to Wales, simply because they can't be bothered to look. Americans would make what we have a real money and job spinner,here I think is where welsh language and culture is failing, the soft sell clearly doesn't work. Newport's Eistedd was as well attended as any Eisteddfod in Wales,which tends to suggest a lot here are the r real minority.[/p][/quote]MJ writes.... ...." I'm willing to bet that most who oppose welsh language and culture here have never been involved in it nor examined it properly. ...." I have never been to a star cluster that exists as far as we know, some multi million light years away, but I can understand that great distance in time and measurement is involved, despite the fact I CAN understand what is involved. Cymraeg is another way of expressing concepts in oral and textual terms, it is no different than English, or any of the other hundreds of languages and dialects across the globe. There is nothing mystic about Cymraeg, as the Cymro themselves realised, hence their general option to discard it in favour of a more readily usable tongue. Which is, as most of those hundreds of other language speakers are daily doing, if not actually adopting English as their premier language, they most certainly are adopting English as their second tongue, or as their global lingua Franca, As more English gets adopted, so their native tongue declines, either by insinuating much English wordage into their own lingo, or by adopting from the English, because English words are common parlance across borders, or most certainly, nowadays, on the internet. And that applies just as much to the Cymraeg as to the dialects spoken by a few tribes people in the depths of the Amazonian jungle to the Chinese, Japanese and wherever trade, commerce, air travel, radio communications and internet use has become a normal part of our world. Forced attempts to reverse the trend by funding a language that is actually really to old to be properly adapted to the modern era, is a folly and a fallacious exercise. Conflating the attendance to a festival with actual demand for the language, cannot make up for the reality of the decline, nor can making reference to what Americans want. Mind you, if they want it so badly, maybe they can take it off our hands. Perhaps, in finality, you can explain just what, in your opinion , the Language brings to Wales besides growing deprivation as hundreds of millions of the money raised from Non Cymraeg speakers is perceived as being wasted on it's promotion. It's not a case of 'forgetting' it's more a case of having really nothing to remember before we need to forget. varteg1

2:47pm Thu 26 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Mervyn James wrote:
varteg1 wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.
Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro.

So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future.





I am waiting.
Your wait is over. I am concerned you are not aware of the link between language and culture, one gets a better appreciation of a culture if you acquire the language too, this is basics, you go to spain you learn spanish (Or not If you are english you just shout at them and call them thick etc). What you don't understand is what worries you that's the rub, pick up some welsh then you will know what you are criticizing for a start ! The rhetoric is so silly and biased on ignorance I am surprised the Argus allows the rants to continue. That's free speech, except IF you are aiming at polish, Arabic, whatever then you would be wise to shut up wouldn't you ? The law protects them,doesn't protect welsh speakers from attack. Welsh culture and language has a lot going for it, but if you are determined NOT to accept welsh or the welsh speaker and especially refute their cultural identity because you are unsure of your own well..........
Let me wise YOU up.

I come from a family whose Welsh, not Cymro, history stretches back to the 17th century in this part of Wales.

So let us examine this 'culture' you bang on about.

What is 'cultural about a silly annual parade of people dressed in white all in effect 'worshipping' a non existent culture that was pretty well invented in the 19th century and which when examined closely bears little if any relationship to historical realities.
It's all well and good dressing kids in red dress with chequered aprons and wearing witches hats for dyd Ddewi Sant, fitting the boys with smart little shorts and shirts, wearing clogs, but just how far back into our history does that take 'culture'?
There is little evidence that the Wales of antiquity had anything of a culture that comes anywhere near to what is being claimed.

Most of what has come to us through written text, was preserved through the annals the Church, and we all know just how reliable those were and are for credulity and accuracy.
Take any one of your heroes of yesteryear and what do you discover, murder, rape robbery banditry, inter area scrapping between various factions and tribal groups. Bloodshed galore. And that is the 'culture' we have inherited, not a bunch of eisteddfordai creeping about waving white, waving various plants about and reciting poetry and singing supposed 'cultural' songs.
No sir, we have an invented Wales, which due to some incredible desire to secure an identity, designed to distance us from our IDENTICAL neighbours, has some how been almost accepted by a miserable few to be representative of what Wales 'was', and can again become.
Do give over.
It's all pure fantasy.

BTW, I am as fluent as the vast majority in Wales, I know enough to know it has little value except to help promote that fantasy, beyond Offa's Dyke it is defunct, and no amount of funding, which in real terms should be called what it really us... communal THEFT....will breathe a future in to it.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: I'm a dedicated welsh language supporter, but will express concern at this foolish tactic of poking fun at what is the most anti-welsh language and hostile area in South Wales, this is just arming them with more ammunition. Far better we promote positively, show what the language can do for welsh people, instead of relying on a law to brow beat them into submission, which will just help those who want rid of the welsh and the welsh language. The hypocrisy of stating polish and others are conspicuous by NOT using their language overtly, just shows that real tolerance is very much skin deep in Newport, you are welcome in Wales so long as you speak English and nothing else... or use your own language where we cannot hear it. In any other country that is racism.[/p][/quote]Please....I am ready to listen...just what is it that the Cymraeg can actually do for the Welsh...take note I did say WELSH, I did not say not Cymro. So be explicit, what can it do for the Welsh, all near 3 millions of us who have no use for it at the present moment., nor likely to have for the foreseeable future. I am waiting.[/p][/quote]Your wait is over. I am concerned you are not aware of the link between language and culture, one gets a better appreciation of a culture if you acquire the language too, this is basics, you go to spain you learn spanish (Or not If you are english you just shout at them and call them thick etc). What you don't understand is what worries you that's the rub, pick up some welsh then you will know what you are criticizing for a start ! The rhetoric is so silly and biased on ignorance I am surprised the Argus allows the rants to continue. That's free speech, except IF you are aiming at polish, Arabic, whatever then you would be wise to shut up wouldn't you ? The law protects them,doesn't protect welsh speakers from attack. Welsh culture and language has a lot going for it, but if you are determined NOT to accept welsh or the welsh speaker and especially refute their cultural identity because you are unsure of your own well..........[/p][/quote]Let me wise YOU up. I come from a family whose Welsh, not Cymro, history stretches back to the 17th century in this part of Wales. So let us examine this 'culture' you bang on about. What is 'cultural about a silly annual parade of people dressed in white all in effect 'worshipping' a non existent culture that was pretty well invented in the 19th century and which when examined closely bears little if any relationship to historical realities. It's all well and good dressing kids in red dress with chequered aprons and wearing witches hats for dyd Ddewi Sant, fitting the boys with smart little shorts and shirts, wearing clogs, but just how far back into our history does that take 'culture'? There is little evidence that the Wales of antiquity had anything of a culture that comes anywhere near to what is being claimed. Most of what has come to us through written text, was preserved through the annals the Church, and we all know just how reliable those were and are for credulity and accuracy. Take any one of your heroes of yesteryear and what do you discover, murder, rape robbery banditry, inter area scrapping between various factions and tribal groups. Bloodshed galore. And that is the 'culture' we have inherited, not a bunch of eisteddfordai creeping about waving white, waving various plants about and reciting poetry and singing supposed 'cultural' songs. No sir, we have an invented Wales, which due to some incredible desire to secure an identity, designed to distance us from our IDENTICAL neighbours, has some how been almost accepted by a miserable few to be representative of what Wales 'was', and can again become. Do give over. It's all pure fantasy. BTW, I am as fluent as the vast majority in Wales, I know enough to know it has little value except to help promote that fantasy, beyond Offa's Dyke it is defunct, and no amount of funding, which in real terms should be called what it really us... communal THEFT....will breathe a future in to it. varteg1

3:07pm Thu 26 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

varteg1 wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even.
Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions..
Seriously ? your saying over 280,000 people lied on the census ? don't be silly.
[quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even. Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions..[/p][/quote]Seriously ? your saying over 280,000 people lied on the census ? don't be silly. NakedDancer

3:54pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Dickieboy says...

One of my parents is Welsh the other from a commonwealth country. When the Eisteddfod came to Newport many years ago my Commonwealth parent was thrilled and insisted that we visit it. Our visit lasted approximately 25-30 minutes after which time we had both had enough of the ignorant and unwelcoming attitude given to us both because we were non Welsh speakers and we left. I have my own children now (3) and never fail to impress upon them what a prejudiced and nasty group the Welsh language minority clique are and how much money is wasted pandering to them. Even though Welsh was compulsorily taught to them thankfully it matters not one jot that all three could not be bothered to give the language credence preferring to put their efforts into languages that will serve them better in the world .
One of my parents is Welsh the other from a commonwealth country. When the Eisteddfod came to Newport many years ago my Commonwealth parent was thrilled and insisted that we visit it. Our visit lasted approximately 25-30 minutes after which time we had both had enough of the ignorant and unwelcoming attitude given to us both because we were non Welsh speakers and we left. I have my own children now (3) and never fail to impress upon them what a prejudiced and nasty group the Welsh language minority clique are and how much money is wasted pandering to them. Even though Welsh was compulsorily taught to them thankfully it matters not one jot that all three could not be bothered to give the language credence preferring to put their efforts into languages that will serve them better in the world . Dickieboy

4:02pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Naked Dancer - I agree that the census figure is dubious., And Yes people do lie, for whatever reason. I can speak a bit and understand a bit - also bought thye books years ago. The number of fluent Welsh speakers here is nowhere near 250,000. In Newport, and most of the rest of Wales, Welsh language will never become the daily language. All this yahoo about culture is nonsense.
Naked Dancer - I agree that the census figure is dubious., And Yes people do lie, for whatever reason. I can speak a bit and understand a bit - also bought thye books years ago. The number of fluent Welsh speakers here is nowhere near 250,000. In Newport, and most of the rest of Wales, Welsh language will never become the daily language. All this yahoo about culture is nonsense. Banjalucka

5:12pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

It's obviously ridiculous to suggest hundreds or even tens of thousands of people lied. The 2011 census doesn't seem to have a direct question about 'fluency' in Wales - it says 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language. The Welsh Language Surveys 2004-6 reported 315,000 stated they were fluent in the written language.

Over 3 million people in Wales consider themselves Welsh with a similar number in other countries considering themselves Welsh.

Fluency and everyday use isn't the only test of the value of a language (Yiddish, Catalan, Breton, Latin, Flemish etc).
It's obviously ridiculous to suggest hundreds or even tens of thousands of people lied. The 2011 census doesn't seem to have a direct question about 'fluency' in Wales - it says 19% of the population (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language. The Welsh Language Surveys 2004-6 reported 315,000 stated they were fluent in the written language. Over 3 million people in Wales consider themselves Welsh with a similar number in other countries considering themselves Welsh. Fluency and everyday use isn't the only test of the value of a language (Yiddish, Catalan, Breton, Latin, Flemish etc). Thomas O'Malley

5:38pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

So what's your point Tommy? Each of those figures is open to doubt particularly 560,000 speaking Welsh. No way Jose-Pedro! Whatever they put on their census forms a good percntage of them said they spoke it because they could read the odd sign or the Welsh National Anthem. So, shall we say about 75% of them exaggerated a little!!!
So what's your point Tommy? Each of those figures is open to doubt particularly 560,000 speaking Welsh. No way Jose-Pedro! Whatever they put on their census forms a good percntage of them said they spoke it because they could read the odd sign or the Welsh National Anthem. So, shall we say about 75% of them exaggerated a little!!! Banjalucka

6:18pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question.

If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked).

Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.
It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question. If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked). Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language. Thomas O'Malley

7:22pm Thu 26 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

NakedDancer wrote:
varteg1 wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland"

Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.
No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even.
Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions..
Seriously ? your saying over 280,000 people lied on the census ? don't be silly.
If you want it bluntly... Yes I am saying just that.
[quote][p][bold]NakedDancer[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]From the Office for National Statistics website: "The top-level division of administrative geography in the UK is the four countries - England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland" Thankfully your outdated English imperialist views are not shared by the population of the UK that recognise England, Wales, Scotland and N Ireland as countries within the UK. Its astonishing you say you are happy for people to call themselves chimpanzees but not Welsh. Where is your humanity ? There's over 560,000 Welsh speakers. If you don't like Wales and the Welsh just go and take your spite and hate back to England. One of the reasons there isn't rational debate on the Welsh language is the intolerance of people like you with no empathy for anyone that wants to be a bit different to you.[/p][/quote]No, there are some half a million who have said they are Cymraeg fluent, but when studied at ground level, the numbers soon come down to a more realistic half of that figure, if that even. Just as millions of men deny they masturbate, when scientific analysis demonstrates those in denial do so out of the fear of feeling shame, so do hundreds of thousands declare they are fluent Cymnrag speakers, do so fore the opposite reason, a feeling of bravado, the problem being, it can only be guessed at, not quantified. with any high degree of accuracy, People can be, and often are, inveterate liars when asked quantifiable questions..[/p][/quote]Seriously ? your saying over 280,000 people lied on the census ? don't be silly.[/p][/quote]If you want it bluntly... Yes I am saying just that. varteg1

7:49pm Thu 26 Dec 13

varteg1 says...

Thomas O'Malley wrote:
It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question.

If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked).

Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.
I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here.
I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?).

However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact.
You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man.

The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain.

It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric.

The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity.

Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims.

Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even..

Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.
[quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question. If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked). Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.[/p][/quote]I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here. I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?). However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact. You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man. The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain. It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric. The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity. Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims. Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even.. Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers. varteg1

7:55pm Thu 26 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Do you not realise how big that number is ? twice the population of Newport lied ? almost 10% of the population ? really ? You actually made some good points and its understandable you don't want to live in Y Farteg but if you counter the silly people that proposed that name with silly conspiracy theories no-one will listen.
Do you not realise how big that number is ? twice the population of Newport lied ? almost 10% of the population ? really ? You actually made some good points and its understandable you don't want to live in Y Farteg but if you counter the silly people that proposed that name with silly conspiracy theories no-one will listen. NakedDancer

10:32pm Thu 26 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy - Sorry you are playing games wiuth stats. I am proud to be Welsh and have nothing against the language or culture - in the right place and in small doses. The Welshie's come over to me as rather egotistical and superior with their ability to speak it. That's what makies non-speakers angry and resentful. Too much money pumped into it for little return except to create elite jobs for the boys.
Naked Dancer - You don't make yourself clear and still i don't understand your point. I am certain many people lied on census. And what has Varteg got to do with this debate?
Tommy - Sorry you are playing games wiuth stats. I am proud to be Welsh and have nothing against the language or culture - in the right place and in small doses. The Welshie's come over to me as rather egotistical and superior with their ability to speak it. That's what makies non-speakers angry and resentful. Too much money pumped into it for little return except to create elite jobs for the boys. Naked Dancer - You don't make yourself clear and still i don't understand your point. I am certain many people lied on census. And what has Varteg got to do with this debate? Banjalucka

9:12am Fri 27 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

varteg1 wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question.

If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked).

Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.
I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here.
I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?).

However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact.
You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man.

The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain.

It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric.

The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity.

Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims.

Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even..

Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.
Good post. Like I said before, the 'Welsh race' thing is imagined fantasy. Yet somehow these pressure groups have mesmerised the foolish into (a) believing in it and (b) much worse, paying out huge sums to prop up their fancy dress party. The same people who would have us squander millions on this tripe should spend a day seeing how people here are treated in the hospitals.
[quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question. If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked). Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.[/p][/quote]I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here. I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?). However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact. You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man. The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain. It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric. The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity. Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims. Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even.. Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.[/p][/quote]Good post. Like I said before, the 'Welsh race' thing is imagined fantasy. Yet somehow these pressure groups have mesmerised the foolish into (a) believing in it and (b) much worse, paying out huge sums to prop up their fancy dress party. The same people who would have us squander millions on this tripe should spend a day seeing how people here are treated in the hospitals. Llanmartinangel

10:16am Fri 27 Dec 13

KarloMarko says...

My children (aged 23 and 41) woke up on Christmas Day to find that...

a. We still do not have an Independent Wales!

b. 80 plus % of our fellow Welsh "patriots"....speak English all day and shun our glorious Radio Cymru!

This proves that Santa is an English imperialist with his jackboots on the neck of our iconic aspirational ambitions. I will not rest until we have a WELSH Santa (Dai ap Santa and his sexy wife Betsan) who respect our heritage and do NOT make my kids cry year after year after year! Only the Sais would do this.
My children (aged 23 and 41) woke up on Christmas Day to find that... a. We still do not have an Independent Wales! b. 80 plus % of our fellow Welsh "patriots"....speak English all day and shun our glorious Radio Cymru! This proves that Santa is an English imperialist with his jackboots on the neck of our iconic aspirational ambitions. I will not rest until we have a WELSH Santa (Dai ap Santa and his sexy wife Betsan) who respect our heritage and do NOT make my kids cry year after year after year! Only the Sais would do this. KarloMarko

2:21pm Fri 27 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

varteg1 wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question.

If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked).

Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.
I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here.
I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?).

However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact.
You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man.

The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain.

It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric.

The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity.

Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims.

Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even..

Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.
You are welcome to call yourself Northern European or a child of the universe if you like. Of course historically all the UK is descended from Celts, Vikings, Saxons and Normans and in modern history every part of the world.

Similarly everyone else has the right to choose their own identity and they will: in the UK there's 45 million who call themselves English, over 4 million that call themselves Scottish and over 3 million that call themselves Welsh (with another 3 million outside Wales that call themselves Welsh). That's absolutely their right - as is the identity adopted by Geordies, Scousers , Cornish etc.

Around 90% of Welsh people don't speak the Welsh language fluently so the language has no bearing on whether people consider themselves to be Welsh. You might as well blame the Morris dancers and Pearly kings with their fancy dress and rituals. Nationalist fervour and racial purity in Wales ? really ? in the Wales I live in the vast majority of people just want to get on with their lives and accept other peoples differences.

I'm not a Welsh speaker and I'm not that interested in the language debate. For me, the destruction of Newport and surrounding economy by the WAG is far more important. It's just a shame we can't have a debate on the language without giving a platform to the Welsh-haters and pointless arguments about nationality.
[quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question. If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked). Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.[/p][/quote]I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here. I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?). However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact. You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man. The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain. It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric. The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity. Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims. Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even.. Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.[/p][/quote]You are welcome to call yourself Northern European or a child of the universe if you like. Of course historically all the UK is descended from Celts, Vikings, Saxons and Normans and in modern history every part of the world. Similarly everyone else has the right to choose their own identity and they will: in the UK there's 45 million who call themselves English, over 4 million that call themselves Scottish and over 3 million that call themselves Welsh (with another 3 million outside Wales that call themselves Welsh). That's absolutely their right - as is the identity adopted by Geordies, Scousers , Cornish etc. Around 90% of Welsh people don't speak the Welsh language fluently so the language has no bearing on whether people consider themselves to be Welsh. You might as well blame the Morris dancers and Pearly kings with their fancy dress and rituals. Nationalist fervour and racial purity in Wales ? really ? in the Wales I live in the vast majority of people just want to get on with their lives and accept other peoples differences. I'm not a Welsh speaker and I'm not that interested in the language debate. For me, the destruction of Newport and surrounding economy by the WAG is far more important. It's just a shame we can't have a debate on the language without giving a platform to the Welsh-haters and pointless arguments about nationality. NakedDancer

2:41pm Fri 27 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Naked Dancer - What do you need a debate for? Think you mean 'welsh speaker haters'. You must admit these do tend to act rather superior.
Naked Dancer - What do you need a debate for? Think you mean 'welsh speaker haters'. You must admit these do tend to act rather superior. Banjalucka

7:20pm Fri 27 Dec 13

Mervyn James says...

varteg1 wrote:
Thomas O'Malley wrote:
It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question.

If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked).

Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.
I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here.
I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?).

However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact.
You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man.

The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain.

It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric.

The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity.

Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims.

Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even..

Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.
Wales extended right down to Cornwall originally, it used to be called 'west wales'....so a significant part of the 'UK'. There are also very strong links to Bretons in France..... and to the Irish. Even to this day place names indicate the welsh language influence in Cornwall. Cornwall too, has similar flag to wales, and there is a resurgence of Cornish language there. This suggests people want a stringer identity than mimicking Americanese.....

What saddens me, is the bile behind the Argus welsh-hater, such hatred for a language and culture, when did this hatred start originate ? With the influx of English speakers and Industry ? The Tudors were welsh and ran England......We can only admire the fact welsh still survives despite all this hate. Be proud of your country, respect traditions still exist. Cymru Am Byth
[quote][p][bold]varteg1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Thomas O'Malley[/bold] wrote: It obviously has nowt to do with lies or exaggeration. People answered the census question as they understood the question. If the question was 'are you fluent ?' the answer would probably have been more like the 315,000 as per the Welsh Language Surveys (because that's the question that survey asked). Anyway, my real point is there's a population of over 3million that considers themselves Welsh and hundreds of thousands that have some knowledge of the language (like you) or are fluent. They deserve some basic level of respect in any debate - not just the Welsh haters saying Wales and the Welsh don't exist so scrap the language.[/p][/quote]I can only speak for myself, and can assure you I have no hatred for the language, and as I come from a long line of Welsh who have resided in the eastern valley area since the late 17th century ,I think I can claim I also have no hatred of the Welsh or Wales, being both Welsh and a long term resident here. I was born in Manchester, to Welsh ex pat parents, so I have every right to claim, via that parentage, my birthright, my ethnicity(?). However, as there is virtually, ( none as can be detected scientifically) any difference between the bulk of northern Europeans, especially within the confines of the British Isles, I find it extremely tedious to keep banging on about that fact. You can takes man out of Wales but you cannot put the Wales in to the man. The whole state of perception is that because someone is actually born here,or born as I was, to parents who were born here, we have some sort of imaginary racialism to separate us from the rest of mainland Britain. It is a totally wrong perception, excitingly and enthusiastically fostered by the Welsh nationalist element, who have got historical actuality so screwed up they have come to believe their own idiotic rhetoric. The whole notion is akin to that of the Nazi's perception of Aryan racial purity. Unfortunately, where the Nazi's had only ethnic types to hit on for their concept of racial purity, and nothing else, our bunch of fascists have a language they believe backs up their false claims. Without that language, or at least the recent pressures generated around and about it, there would be no nationalist fervour, no nationalists or nationalism even.. Wales would be what it has been for centuries, a region of the UK, or Britain, if one prefers.[/p][/quote]Wales extended right down to Cornwall originally, it used to be called 'west wales'....so a significant part of the 'UK'. There are also very strong links to Bretons in France..... and to the Irish. Even to this day place names indicate the welsh language influence in Cornwall. Cornwall too, has similar flag to wales, and there is a resurgence of Cornish language there. This suggests people want a stringer identity than mimicking Americanese..... What saddens me, is the bile behind the Argus welsh-hater, such hatred for a language and culture, when did this hatred start originate ? With the influx of English speakers and Industry ? The Tudors were welsh and ran England......We can only admire the fact welsh still survives despite all this hate. Be proud of your country, respect traditions still exist. Cymru Am Byth Mervyn James

7:22pm Fri 27 Dec 13

white white says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now
it was officially classed as a country some time ago.
if that's not good enough look on most websites
and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland
England and the islands are known constiuate
country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain..
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now it was officially classed as a country some time ago. if that's not good enough look on most websites and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland England and the islands are known constiuate country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain.. white white

8:12pm Fri 27 Dec 13

Llanmartinangel says...

white white wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now
it was officially classed as a country some time ago.
if that's not good enough look on most websites
and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland
England and the islands are known constiuate
country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain..
Why is its head of state the same as the UK then? By your reckoning Florida is a country.
[quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now it was officially classed as a country some time ago. if that's not good enough look on most websites and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland England and the islands are known constiuate country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain..[/p][/quote]Why is its head of state the same as the UK then? By your reckoning Florida is a country. Llanmartinangel

12:35pm Sat 28 Dec 13

scraptheWAG says...

there are alot of poorly education people in wales Carwyn and all his labour cronies have persuaded them they all would be so much better of in independence how stupid they all must feel now Carwyn though he is way better off .
there are alot of poorly education people in wales Carwyn and all his labour cronies have persuaded them they all would be so much better of in independence how stupid they all must feel now Carwyn though he is way better off . scraptheWAG

5:04pm Sun 29 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
white white wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Anne teak wrote:
Banjalucka says...

Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh.

Nope.. Try and follow the argument.

So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport?

Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team

And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers.

English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others.

That would be racism.

As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause?

Er.. No.
Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.
Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now
it was officially classed as a country some time ago.
if that's not good enough look on most websites
and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland
England and the islands are known constiuate
country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain..
Why is its head of state the same as the UK then? By your reckoning Florida is a country.
You've already said you hate Wales and the Welsh - you really don't have to keep repeating it. The sovereign is a purely ceremonial role and nothing at all to do with the Welsh language debate. The sovereign is also head of state for Canada, Australia, New Zealand and many others - so you say they are not countries. Pathetic.

The vast majority of British people have no problem being English and British, Northern-Irish and British, Scottish and British, Welsh and British etc. It's always been that way and always will be, however much poison and division you try to spread.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]white white[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Anne teak[/bold] wrote: Banjalucka says... Ann Teak - Rather dis-jointed comment lol. There are more Welsh people who speak English than Welsh. Nope.. Try and follow the argument. So are you saying all these should not support Wales in sport? Nope.. I'm saying its hypocritical not to recognise Wales as a country, separate from England ....and then support it's national sports team And what's this about rollIng over and giving in to English speakers. English is spoken in many countries. It doesn't mean that it has to be the only language in every country to the exclusion of all others. That would be racism. As there are so few of them they have little choice. Are you expecting Owain Glyndawr to suddenly appear and fight the cause? Er.. No.[/p][/quote]Wales isn't a country. However many of you and the media types try to talk that inaccuracy up the fact remains that the 'country' is neither England nor Wales, it's the UK. And no-one is questioning it's right to be spoken as a language, just the amount of money being thrown at it to try and stem it's inevitable decline. Ergo, the money is being wasted.[/p][/quote]Wales is a country,it's was before and it is now it was officially classed as a country some time ago. if that's not good enough look on most websites and you will also see that Wales , northern ireland,Scotland England and the islands are known constiuate country's that make up the United kingdom of great britain..[/p][/quote]Why is its head of state the same as the UK then? By your reckoning Florida is a country.[/p][/quote]You've already said you hate Wales and the Welsh - you really don't have to keep repeating it. The sovereign is a purely ceremonial role and nothing at all to do with the Welsh language debate. The sovereign is also head of state for Canada, Australia, New Zealand and many others - so you say they are not countries. Pathetic. The vast majority of British people have no problem being English and British, Northern-Irish and British, Scottish and British, Welsh and British etc. It's always been that way and always will be, however much poison and division you try to spread. Thomas O'Malley

5:30pm Sun 29 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Naked Dancer - What do you need a debate for? Think you mean 'welsh speaker haters'. You must admit these do tend to act rather superior.
Check the posts by Karlomarko, Llanmartinangel and others for hate of Wales and the Welsh, not just the language. It's ridiculous to think hundreds of thousands of people are 'acting superior'. You say you rarely encounter Welsh speakers so when have they acted superior towards you? I dont speak Welsh so i wouldnt know even if they were acting superior - any more than i'd know if the chinese staff in my local takeaway are acting superior when they use their language.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Naked Dancer - What do you need a debate for? Think you mean 'welsh speaker haters'. You must admit these do tend to act rather superior.[/p][/quote]Check the posts by Karlomarko, Llanmartinangel and others for hate of Wales and the Welsh, not just the language. It's ridiculous to think hundreds of thousands of people are 'acting superior'. You say you rarely encounter Welsh speakers so when have they acted superior towards you? I dont speak Welsh so i wouldnt know even if they were acting superior - any more than i'd know if the chinese staff in my local takeaway are acting superior when they use their language. NakedDancer

5:47pm Sun 29 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Naked Dancer - I read all comments -good or bad. You have a habit of bringing-in exagerations all the time. f course not every welsh speaker acts superior, but the few comments on this local paper in an area where 99.9% speak english from Welsh speakers/lovers, is exactly that - superior about a lost cause.
Also the number of welsh speakers seems to grow with every posting - 'Hundreds of thousands' now. I am Welsh and have been to many parts of the world, but have never heard anyoneasking for translation into Welsh , only English.
Naked Dancer - I read all comments -good or bad. You have a habit of bringing-in exagerations all the time. f course not every welsh speaker acts superior, but the few comments on this local paper in an area where 99.9% speak english from Welsh speakers/lovers, is exactly that - superior about a lost cause. Also the number of welsh speakers seems to grow with every posting - 'Hundreds of thousands' now. I am Welsh and have been to many parts of the world, but have never heard anyoneasking for translation into Welsh , only English. Banjalucka

7:21pm Sun 29 Dec 13

NakedDancer says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Naked Dancer - I read all comments -good or bad. You have a habit of bringing-in exagerations all the time. f course not every welsh speaker acts superior, but the few comments on this local paper in an area where 99.9% speak english from Welsh speakers/lovers, is exactly that - superior about a lost cause.
Also the number of welsh speakers seems to grow with every posting - 'Hundreds of thousands' now. I am Welsh and have been to many parts of the world, but have never heard anyoneasking for translation into Welsh , only English.
If you cant remember numbers please re-read the thread re 2011 Census and 2004-6 Welsh language survey. Hundreds of thousands is correct.

I don't know what constitutes 'acting superior'. I cant find a comment from a Welsh speaker 'acting superior' (or many comments defending the language at all). I doubt they can bother to respond to the spiteful silly comments. However, I can find plenty of comments from people hating Wales and Welsh people (whatever language they speak). Which part of 'Wales and the Welsh don't exist' and other insults aimed at you just because you are Welsh do you not understand ? If anyone is 'acting superior' its not the Welsh speakers in this thread.

No-one denies Welsh language fluency in Newport area is low. I've never met anyone that speaks Spanish in Newport but plenty of people do in Newport and elsewhere.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Naked Dancer - I read all comments -good or bad. You have a habit of bringing-in exagerations all the time. f course not every welsh speaker acts superior, but the few comments on this local paper in an area where 99.9% speak english from Welsh speakers/lovers, is exactly that - superior about a lost cause. Also the number of welsh speakers seems to grow with every posting - 'Hundreds of thousands' now. I am Welsh and have been to many parts of the world, but have never heard anyoneasking for translation into Welsh , only English.[/p][/quote]If you cant remember numbers please re-read the thread re 2011 Census and 2004-6 Welsh language survey. Hundreds of thousands is correct. I don't know what constitutes 'acting superior'. I cant find a comment from a Welsh speaker 'acting superior' (or many comments defending the language at all). I doubt they can bother to respond to the spiteful silly comments. However, I can find plenty of comments from people hating Wales and Welsh people (whatever language they speak). Which part of 'Wales and the Welsh don't exist' and other insults aimed at you just because you are Welsh do you not understand ? If anyone is 'acting superior' its not the Welsh speakers in this thread. No-one denies Welsh language fluency in Newport area is low. I've never met anyone that speaks Spanish in Newport but plenty of people do in Newport and elsewhere. NakedDancer

9:50pm Sun 29 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Naked Dancer. getting monotonous now lol. The figures are not genuine and highly dubious. Once again you bring in silly comparisons with Spanish. The main theme here is the use of Welsh in Wales. Which is totally useless except for a hobby or culture, which i applaud. Anything else and its a waste of money like Forms, S4C and numerous quangos set up for solely promoting the lingo. Utterly crass!
Naked Dancer. getting monotonous now lol. The figures are not genuine and highly dubious. Once again you bring in silly comparisons with Spanish. The main theme here is the use of Welsh in Wales. Which is totally useless except for a hobby or culture, which i applaud. Anything else and its a waste of money like Forms, S4C and numerous quangos set up for solely promoting the lingo. Utterly crass! Banjalucka

10:57pm Sun 29 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Banjalucka. You are entitled to your opinion and you have some valid points. However you blow your own argument by claiming people are 'acting superior' (whatever that is) and dismissing the official published Census and Welsh language surveys. If you want to invent these monstrous welsh speakers and invent your own statistics that's up to you but it just shows your opinion is based on no more than personal bias.
Banjalucka. You are entitled to your opinion and you have some valid points. However you blow your own argument by claiming people are 'acting superior' (whatever that is) and dismissing the official published Census and Welsh language surveys. If you want to invent these monstrous welsh speakers and invent your own statistics that's up to you but it just shows your opinion is based on no more than personal bias. Thomas O'Malley

3:13am Mon 30 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy - For the last time i will say i am a non-Welsh speaker Welshman. Not a Welsh hater. But like every minority language, it is just that. Applaud the Welsh culture and love to see the fellas clog dancing and women walking about with bunches of daffs - ON CERTAIN OCCASIONS. Please don't start taking the Michael about inventing as i am very much a realist.
So you don't think that many who answered the census question only have a very limited knowledge of Welsh? having been a Census Monitor a few times i can tell you they have. I'd halve the number for a start, but in any case the whole argument needs toning down. Great ideal you have that there will be a massive revival and come next Crimbo Newportonians will be conducting their lives i dai iown diloh. etc.It will never happen. AND quite rightly many object to the use of public cash £millions to have dual forms, Welsh quangos, S4C, and a host of regulations for companies shops and offices to implement.
My personal bias is that the whole Welshnness fad should be kept in check for cultural purposes not stuffed down your throat everyday by a small band, like you, who are somehow embedded in cloud Cuckoo Land,
Tommy - For the last time i will say i am a non-Welsh speaker Welshman. Not a Welsh hater. But like every minority language, it is just that. Applaud the Welsh culture and love to see the fellas clog dancing and women walking about with bunches of daffs - ON CERTAIN OCCASIONS. Please don't start taking the Michael about inventing as i am very much a realist. So you don't think that many who answered the census question only have a very limited knowledge of Welsh? having been a Census Monitor a few times i can tell you they have. I'd halve the number for a start, but in any case the whole argument needs toning down. Great ideal you have that there will be a massive revival and come next Crimbo Newportonians will be conducting their lives i dai iown diloh. etc.It will never happen. AND quite rightly many object to the use of public cash £millions to have dual forms, Welsh quangos, S4C, and a host of regulations for companies shops and offices to implement. My personal bias is that the whole Welshnness fad should be kept in check for cultural purposes not stuffed down your throat everyday by a small band, like you, who are somehow embedded in cloud Cuckoo Land, Banjalucka

12:12pm Mon 30 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

Huh ? I've said I don't speak Welsh and I haven't expressed any opinion on the language. More invention. The WAG has much bigger problems and I'd rather they spent time on that but if I have to have an opinion on the language I'd probably share many of your views. However my opinion is based on economic priority, not bias of fictional people 'acting superior' or pretending Welsh speakers don't exist.

Lets pretend 50% of those that said they were fluent in the Welsh Language survey lied. As unlikely as that is that's still 155,000. Not a 'small band' as you call it.

My only point is that people that consider themselves Welsh deserve some basic human respect, as do Welsh speakers; not subjected to the spite and bias on this comments page. The Welsh haters insult all the Welsh and then the English-speaking Welsh insult the Welsh speakers. It's a disgrace .
Huh ? I've said I don't speak Welsh and I haven't expressed any opinion on the language. More invention. The WAG has much bigger problems and I'd rather they spent time on that but if I have to have an opinion on the language I'd probably share many of your views. However my opinion is based on economic priority, not bias of fictional people 'acting superior' or pretending Welsh speakers don't exist. Lets pretend 50% of those that said they were fluent in the Welsh Language survey lied. As unlikely as that is that's still 155,000. Not a 'small band' as you call it. My only point is that people that consider themselves Welsh deserve some basic human respect, as do Welsh speakers; not subjected to the spite and bias on this comments page. The Welsh haters insult all the Welsh and then the English-speaking Welsh insult the Welsh speakers. It's a disgrace . Thomas O'Malley

2:40pm Mon 30 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy - We are now the only ones commenting on this bro. Whatever race you are doesn't matter to me.but can't you accept that millions in Wales conduct their lives in English. FACT. Do you want the dubious 155,000 speakers (which is way lower ) to walk around in shops etc making an **** of themselves?
I have never experienced any hatred of Welsh people only comical stuff, much like the Paddies and Scots.
Your opinion based on economic priority? Not sure what you mean Tom but its a complete waste of dough as i have previously said. And majority agree. same as WAG - another farce, with a rigged election result. Still people are people. Happy New Year Tommy.
Tommy - We are now the only ones commenting on this bro. Whatever race you are doesn't matter to me.but can't you accept that millions in Wales conduct their lives in English. FACT. Do you want the dubious 155,000 speakers (which is way lower ) to walk around in shops etc making an **** of themselves? I have never experienced any hatred of Welsh people only comical stuff, much like the Paddies and Scots. Your opinion based on economic priority? Not sure what you mean Tom but its a complete waste of dough as i have previously said. And majority agree. same as WAG - another farce, with a rigged election result. Still people are people. Happy New Year Tommy. Banjalucka

5:08pm Mon 30 Dec 13

Thomas O'Malley says...

No-one in this thread has denied everyday business is conducted in English, (which is quickly becoming American English by the way). Of course there's many other languages spoken in the UK every day. People, including me, are not happy with the WAG but "rigged election? " - you should take your evidence to the police. As for welsh speakers "walk around in shops etc making an **** of themselves?" you should be ashamed, especially as you say you never meet any.
No-one in this thread has denied everyday business is conducted in English, (which is quickly becoming American English by the way). Of course there's many other languages spoken in the UK every day. People, including me, are not happy with the WAG but "rigged election? " - you should take your evidence to the police. As for welsh speakers "walk around in shops etc making an **** of themselves?" you should be ashamed, especially as you say you never meet any. Thomas O'Malley

6:36am Tue 31 Dec 13

Banjalucka says...

Tommy - this is getting stupid now bro. 1) The election of WAG was well reported as only happening when, strangely, extra votes were found in North Wales. Also, a very small turnout. Hardly popular.
2) Stupid comment about taking evidence to police Tommy. No need for sarcasm. I assume you are an election expert?
3)In no way am i ashamed. Why the heck should i be. Once again i will tell you Tommy, I know many people, of many nationalities all over the world. You are struggling now to score points. Getting a bit cheeky now bro.
Desist please.
Tommy - this is getting stupid now bro. 1) The election of WAG was well reported as only happening when, strangely, extra votes were found in North Wales. Also, a very small turnout. Hardly popular. 2) Stupid comment about taking evidence to police Tommy. No need for sarcasm. I assume you are an election expert? 3)In no way am i ashamed. Why the heck should i be. Once again i will tell you Tommy, I know many people, of many nationalities all over the world. You are struggling now to score points. Getting a bit cheeky now bro. Desist please. Banjalucka

2:47pm Thu 2 Jan 14

_Bryan_ says...

This "lack of suport for the Welsh language" may be one of the few things that Newport have got right. There is a huge expense involved in duplicating all the council's online content and this is money that could be better spent elsewhere.

If this campaign group are so keen to read web pages in Welsh, they can always use google translate and save taxpayers a small fortune.
This "lack of suport for the Welsh language" may be one of the few things that Newport have got right. There is a huge expense involved in duplicating all the council's online content and this is money that could be better spent elsewhere. If this campaign group are so keen to read web pages in Welsh, they can always use google translate and save taxpayers a small fortune. _Bryan_

3:39pm Mon 6 Jan 14

bed123123 says...

Never ceases to amaze & sadden me to see anti-Welsh language bigotry as some of the comments here. The usual intolerant cliche spouting few who seems to hate diversity and their own heritage just proves how rude and ignorant they really are. Shame on you.

Welsh belongs to the whole of Wales, and people as I do use it on a daily basis. We should treat people equally, and some here seem to want to treat Welsh speaker and learners as second class in their own country. Wales has moved on, and bilingaulism (the norm in most countries) is here to stay, get over it.
Never ceases to amaze & sadden me to see anti-Welsh language bigotry as some of the comments here. The usual intolerant cliche spouting few who seems to hate diversity and their own heritage just proves how rude and ignorant they really are. Shame on you. Welsh belongs to the whole of Wales, and people as I do use it on a daily basis. We should treat people equally, and some here seem to want to treat Welsh speaker and learners as second class in their own country. Wales has moved on, and bilingaulism (the norm in most countries) is here to stay, get over it. bed123123

3:00pm Wed 8 Jan 14

Lynne Ann Thomas says...

Banjalucka wrote:
What a waste of time. In all fairness Newport on this point, are the only Welsh authority with a sensible welsh Lang policy. Heere we go again folks!! Waste of money for a handful of moaners in a city which has many different languages, Welsh being near the bottom of speakiers.
Oh dear - so you don't realise that all children in Wales learn Welsh (Even NEWPORT)! and that there are now 3 Welsh language schools (Teaching through Welsh) in NEWPORT. That in a survey over 80% of parents said they would like their children to be educated in Welsh, in NEWPORT!

I am Welsh speaking, living in NEWPORT and have every right to have services from the council I pay my council tax to in my language.

After all if you only speak English you could go back to England and live there, but at the very least you could RESPECT the language of Wales, which is of course WELSH.
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: What a waste of time. In all fairness Newport on this point, are the only Welsh authority with a sensible welsh Lang policy. Heere we go again folks!! Waste of money for a handful of moaners in a city which has many different languages, Welsh being near the bottom of speakiers.[/p][/quote]Oh dear - so you don't realise that all children in Wales learn Welsh (Even NEWPORT)! and that there are now 3 Welsh language schools (Teaching through Welsh) in NEWPORT. That in a survey over 80% of parents said they would like their children to be educated in Welsh, in NEWPORT! I am Welsh speaking, living in NEWPORT and have every right to have services from the council I pay my council tax to in my language. After all if you only speak English you could go back to England and live there, but at the very least you could RESPECT the language of Wales, which is of course WELSH. Lynne Ann Thomas

3:01pm Wed 8 Jan 14

Lynne Ann Thomas says...

Oh dear - so you don't realise that all children in Wales learn Welsh (Even NEWPORT)! and that there are now 3 Welsh language schools (Teaching through Welsh) in NEWPORT. That in a survey over 80% of parents said they would like their children to be educated in Welsh, in NEWPORT!

I am Welsh speaking, living in NEWPORT and have every right to have services from the council I pay my council tax to in my language.

After all if you only speak English you could go back to England and live there, but at the very least you could RESPECT the language of Wales, which is of course WELSH.
Oh dear - so you don't realise that all children in Wales learn Welsh (Even NEWPORT)! and that there are now 3 Welsh language schools (Teaching through Welsh) in NEWPORT. That in a survey over 80% of parents said they would like their children to be educated in Welsh, in NEWPORT! I am Welsh speaking, living in NEWPORT and have every right to have services from the council I pay my council tax to in my language. After all if you only speak English you could go back to England and live there, but at the very least you could RESPECT the language of Wales, which is of course WELSH. Lynne Ann Thomas

2:07pm Mon 13 Jan 14

cymrostudent says...

Banjalucka wrote:
Tommy - this is getting stupid now bro. 1) The election of WAG was well reported as only happening when, strangely, extra votes were found in North Wales. Also, a very small turnout. Hardly popular.
2) Stupid comment about taking evidence to police Tommy. No need for sarcasm. I assume you are an election expert?
3)In no way am i ashamed. Why the heck should i be. Once again i will tell you Tommy, I know many people, of many nationalities all over the world. You are struggling now to score points. Getting a bit cheeky now bro.
Desist please.
Funny how every area of Wales voted for further powers (except Monmouthshire and that was only by a few hundred votes). Our Parliament is here to stay, as is our language!
[quote][p][bold]Banjalucka[/bold] wrote: Tommy - this is getting stupid now bro. 1) The election of WAG was well reported as only happening when, strangely, extra votes were found in North Wales. Also, a very small turnout. Hardly popular. 2) Stupid comment about taking evidence to police Tommy. No need for sarcasm. I assume you are an election expert? 3)In no way am i ashamed. Why the heck should i be. Once again i will tell you Tommy, I know many people, of many nationalities all over the world. You are struggling now to score points. Getting a bit cheeky now bro. Desist please.[/p][/quote]Funny how every area of Wales voted for further powers (except Monmouthshire and that was only by a few hundred votes). Our Parliament is here to stay, as is our language! cymrostudent

2:14pm Mon 13 Jan 14

cymrostudent says...

Casnewydd/Newport you should be ashamed of yourselves. You are one of Wales' cities now...act like one. Wales is bilingual - it has two official languages and those that speak Welsh and those children who are taught Welsh (that'll be all but the private ones) should be able to use Welsh in their everyday lives if they so wish. As a non-Welsh-speaking Welshman I am proud of the native tongue of this country...plenty of English-speaking only nations out there to choose to emigrate to if you hate Welsh in Wales.
Casnewydd/Newport you should be ashamed of yourselves. You are one of Wales' cities now...act like one. Wales is bilingual - it has two official languages and those that speak Welsh and those children who are taught Welsh (that'll be all but the private ones) should be able to use Welsh in their everyday lives if they so wish. As a non-Welsh-speaking Welshman I am proud of the native tongue of this country...plenty of English-speaking only nations out there to choose to emigrate to if you hate Welsh in Wales. cymrostudent

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