£700,000 spent on translation services

£700,000 spent on translation services

£700,000 spent on translation services

First published in Gwent news South Wales Argus: Photograph of the Author by

GWENT Police spent more than £700,000 on translators over the past six years.

The force needed to employ translators for dozens of different languages in this time, including Welsh, and spent a total of £717,493.

Translators are brought in to talk to suspects in crimes, as well as witnesses and victims.

In 2006/07, the force spent £75,225 on translators; this more than doubled the following year to £160,899 and peaked in 2008/09 at £172,247.

In November 2009, the Wales Interpretation and Translation Service (WITS) was set up, supported by the Welsh Government, other Welsh police forces and councils.

WITS finds bilingual people close to where they are needed, carries out security checks, language assessments and training and helped reduce costs to the police.

Languages translated in this time were Polish, Lithuanian, Bengali, Urdu, Romanian, Punjabi Indian, Czech, British Sign Language, Vietnamese, Kurdish Sorani, Punjabi Pakistani, Turkish, Mandarin, Arabic, Russian, Slovak, Albanian, Spanish, Sylheti, Pashto, Latvian, Cantonese, Farsi, French, Hungarian, Nepalese, Swaheli, Algerian, Dari, German, Gujerati, Hindi, Italian, Krio, Malayalam, Portuguese, Somali, Tagalog, Tamil, Tigrinyan and Welsh

In 2009/10, the amount spent fell to £127,796, £83,529 before the introduction of WITS and £44,267 after, this fell to £95,348 in 2010/11 and £85,978 in 2011/12.

Between 2009 and 2011, Gwent Police paid a fixed rate of £36 an hour to translators.

Chief Inspector Tony Wilcox said: "All Police Forces have to comply with legal requirements to provide investigations in a language which people can understand. Without quality interpreters it would be impossible to conduct investigations involving victims, witnesses or offenders whose first language is not English or Welsh."

As well as languages one might expect translators to be needed for, such as Polish, French and Spanish, there was call for languages including Sylheti, spoken in North East Bangladesh, Krio, from Sierra Leone, Tagalog, spoken by people in the Philippines, and Tigrinyan, which is spoken by people in Ethiopia and Eritrea.

The force said it only kept a record of the list of languages it used translators for in 2010/11, when 41 translators were needed for 41 different languages.

 

 

 

Comments (72)

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11:46am Wed 22 Aug 12

rhinestine says...

My god!!! just goes to show that all soldiers, past and present died in vain, what have we become in the UK?

This is just shows we have really lost our identity.
My god!!! just goes to show that all soldiers, past and present died in vain, what have we become in the UK? This is just shows we have really lost our identity. rhinestine
  • Score: 0

12:11pm Wed 22 Aug 12

Michael Weedall says...

Disgusting £700.000 wasted it needs to be stopped now and spent on frontline services.
Disgusting £700.000 wasted it needs to be stopped now and spent on frontline services. Michael Weedall
  • Score: 0

12:21pm Wed 22 Aug 12

James Farror says...

British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK!
British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK! James Farror
  • Score: 0

12:59pm Wed 22 Aug 12

rhinestine says...

James Farror wrote:
British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK!
I think you're missing my point.......I am being diplomatic...... we are over run with immigrants, that's what I am saying, James....
[quote][p][bold]James Farror[/bold] wrote: British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK![/p][/quote]I think you're missing my point.......I am being diplomatic...... we are over run with immigrants, that's what I am saying, James.... rhinestine
  • Score: 0

3:24pm Wed 22 Aug 12

Dee-Gee says...

We're all immigrants here, have been ever since the Anglos started going toe-to-toe with the Saxons. I doubt that more than a tenth of the "Welsh" people of Gwent could claim an Welsh heritage pre-1900. The whole thing is fairytales to sell tartan "cilts" to idiots.
We're all immigrants here, have been ever since the Anglos started going toe-to-toe with the Saxons. I doubt that more than a tenth of the "Welsh" people of Gwent could claim an Welsh heritage pre-1900. The whole thing is fairytales to sell tartan "cilts" to idiots. Dee-Gee
  • Score: 0

5:43pm Wed 22 Aug 12

Gareth says...

I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument...
I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument... Gareth
  • Score: 0

5:49pm Wed 22 Aug 12

arvinda strop says...

Yep nothing to do with being born outside the uk then, and then emigrating to another country then.
Never mind the history leson look at the FACTS that is what Rhinestine is trying to point out, not racist just a statement of fact.
But a typical response to it.
Yep nothing to do with being born outside the uk then, and then emigrating to another country then. Never mind the history leson look at the FACTS that is what Rhinestine is trying to point out, not racist just a statement of fact. But a typical response to it. arvinda strop
  • Score: 0

6:05pm Wed 22 Aug 12

Howie' says...

rhinestine wrote:
James Farror wrote:
British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK!
I think you're missing my point.......I am being diplomatic...... we are over run with immigrants, that's what I am saying, James....
Over run eh Rhinestine?

Uk Population: 62 Million

Born in the UK: 55 Million

Born in a foreign Country: 7 Million

So nearly 90% of people living in the UK were born in the UK and you think we are over run by foreigners.

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Immigration
_to_the_United_Kingd
om_since_1922
[quote][p][bold]rhinestine[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]James Farror[/bold] wrote: British soldiers past and present did not die to stop people speaking languages other than English in the UK![/p][/quote]I think you're missing my point.......I am being diplomatic...... we are over run with immigrants, that's what I am saying, James....[/p][/quote]Over run eh Rhinestine? Uk Population: 62 Million Born in the UK: 55 Million Born in a foreign Country: 7 Million So nearly 90% of people living in the UK were born in the UK and you think we are over run by foreigners. http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/Immigration _to_the_United_Kingd om_since_1922 Howie'
  • Score: 0

7:47pm Wed 22 Aug 12

Limestonecowboy says...

Don't worry he's (Rhinestine) is being 'diplomatic' however with remarks about british soldiers he just comes over as ignorant & offensive; he needs a history lesson to see how many diffent nationalities worked, work & fought with HM forces past & present. What a complete idiot - get out of your comfy armchair & come and join the army my friend!
Don't worry he's (Rhinestine) is being 'diplomatic' however with remarks about british soldiers he just comes over as ignorant & offensive; he needs a history lesson to see how many diffent nationalities worked, work & fought with HM forces past & present. What a complete idiot - get out of your comfy armchair & come and join the army my friend! Limestonecowboy
  • Score: 0

10:31pm Wed 22 Aug 12

pwharley says...

I wonder how they work out what language requires translation in the first place?
I wonder how they work out what language requires translation in the first place? pwharley
  • Score: 0

10:39pm Wed 22 Aug 12

iandfox says...

So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!!
Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial.
So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!! Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial. iandfox
  • Score: 0

12:08am Thu 23 Aug 12

CM1 says...

So everyone they translated for broke the law; you know this for a fact?

This country is all the better for having a range and diversity of inhabitants. Do you want to tell Mo(hamed) Farah to get back to Somalia? No?.....how about getting back to wherever you came from, which is hopefully nowhere near me.

A diverse range of nationalities have fought for the British army, so I expect the majority of soldiers in our forces would see rhinestine's comments as a slight.
So everyone they translated for broke the law; you know this for a fact? This country is all the better for having a range and diversity of inhabitants. Do you want to tell Mo(hamed) Farah to get back to Somalia? No?.....how about getting back to wherever you came from, which is hopefully nowhere near me. A diverse range of nationalities have fought for the British army, so I expect the majority of soldiers in our forces would see rhinestine's comments as a slight. CM1
  • Score: 0

12:41am Thu 23 Aug 12

Howie' says...

iandfox wrote:
So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!!
Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial.
You are obviously to lazy to read the article. You assume that all the 10% have had contact with Police which the vast majority will not. Now this might be a surprise to you and sadly I think it will, hold tight Foxy for a revelation, are you ready?

NOT EVERYONE WHO HAS CONTACT WITH THE POLICE IS A CRIMINAL.

Where does the article say they have broken the law? Why do you imagine that they should defend themselves when the indigenous population would be shouting for a Solicitor on legal aid. Deported without trial... very democratic. Just to let you know the amount of migrants that come to the UK is slightly below average to the rest of Europe....oh no that's not what the Daily Mail told me so it can't be true.

Read on:

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Immigration
_to_the_United_Kingd
om_since_1922

Too lazy to learn English! If you want to find people too lazy to learn the language of the country they are living in look no further than the 5.5 Million Brits living around the world where the vast majority do not speak the native language (other than English of course) Brits are the laziest in the world when it comes to learning other languages and before you ask Foxy I speak the language of four other Country's fluently.
[quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote: So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!! Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial.[/p][/quote]You are obviously to lazy to read the article. You assume that all the 10% have had contact with Police which the vast majority will not. Now this might be a surprise to you and sadly I think it will, hold tight Foxy for a revelation, are you ready? NOT EVERYONE WHO HAS CONTACT WITH THE POLICE IS A CRIMINAL. Where does the article say they have broken the law? Why do you imagine that they should defend themselves when the indigenous population would be shouting for a Solicitor on legal aid. Deported without trial... very democratic. Just to let you know the amount of migrants that come to the UK is slightly below average to the rest of Europe....oh no that's not what the Daily Mail told me so it can't be true. Read on: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/Immigration _to_the_United_Kingd om_since_1922 Too lazy to learn English! If you want to find people too lazy to learn the language of the country they are living in look no further than the 5.5 Million Brits living around the world where the vast majority do not speak the native language (other than English of course) Brits are the laziest in the world when it comes to learning other languages and before you ask Foxy I speak the language of four other Country's fluently. Howie'
  • Score: 1

8:26am Thu 23 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

Totally defeats Cameron's pledge to make sure anyone who lives here has at least a rudimentary awareness of English. All they do is colonise us and if we insist, they use the human rights law to operate as if they never left their own country at all.

It's not just police, but SS, the NHS, any dept they come in contact with, with Kent having to manage 100 different languages and dialects, funds are being taken away from vital services too.

One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined..

Time to repatriate or at least send these people to SCHOOL so we aren't having to do this all the time.
Totally defeats Cameron's pledge to make sure anyone who lives here has at least a rudimentary awareness of English. All they do is colonise us and if we insist, they use the human rights law to operate as if they never left their own country at all. It's not just police, but SS, the NHS, any dept they come in contact with, with Kent having to manage 100 different languages and dialects, funds are being taken away from vital services too. One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined.. Time to repatriate or at least send these people to SCHOOL so we aren't having to do this all the time. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

8:32am Thu 23 Aug 12

chris227 says...

your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!!
your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!! chris227
  • Score: 0

9:07am Thu 23 Aug 12

Bobevans says...

The simple fact is that we cannot afford to keep paying out ever increasing sums of money for translations. In 5 years the cost has gone up almost 10 times.

There should be no legal requirement to provide translation services. If there is a need it is provided to that person or persons on a cost basis which they will need to pay
The simple fact is that we cannot afford to keep paying out ever increasing sums of money for translations. In 5 years the cost has gone up almost 10 times. There should be no legal requirement to provide translation services. If there is a need it is provided to that person or persons on a cost basis which they will need to pay Bobevans
  • Score: 0

9:21am Thu 23 Aug 12

Gareth says...

It's a contentious one this...

For all those demanding an end to it, please remember one thing: this is not all about immigrant criminals taking the mick. If, for example, your grandmother got mugged and a non-english speaking foreigner here on holiday was the only witness, would your view change?

If she got mugged whilst on holiday abroad, wouldn't you consider it a scandal if she had to pay for access to a policeman who spoke English?
It's a contentious one this... For all those demanding an end to it, please remember one thing: this is not all about immigrant criminals taking the mick. If, for example, your grandmother got mugged and a non-english speaking foreigner here on holiday was the only witness, would your view change? If she got mugged whilst on holiday abroad, wouldn't you consider it a scandal if she had to pay for access to a policeman who spoke English? Gareth
  • Score: 0

9:40am Thu 23 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

chris227 wrote:
your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!!
Nice one :) but you almost sounded sincere there lol. I suppose we get called racists and all sorts, I no longer care frankly it is just another excuse for these people to abuse what is left of our democracy. Multi-cultural Britain, the biggest con and hypocrisy ever, it just never happened. They just set up enclaves, street by street and town by town, and they hide behind their language when breaking the law too.
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!![/p][/quote]Nice one :) but you almost sounded sincere there lol. I suppose we get called racists and all sorts, I no longer care frankly it is just another excuse for these people to abuse what is left of our democracy. Multi-cultural Britain, the biggest con and hypocrisy ever, it just never happened. They just set up enclaves, street by street and town by town, and they hide behind their language when breaking the law too. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

9:43am Thu 23 Aug 12

rhinestine says...

Howie' wrote:
iandfox wrote:
So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!!
Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial.
You are obviously to lazy to read the article. You assume that all the 10% have had contact with Police which the vast majority will not. Now this might be a surprise to you and sadly I think it will, hold tight Foxy for a revelation, are you ready?

NOT EVERYONE WHO HAS CONTACT WITH THE POLICE IS A CRIMINAL.

Where does the article say they have broken the law? Why do you imagine that they should defend themselves when the indigenous population would be shouting for a Solicitor on legal aid. Deported without trial... very democratic. Just to let you know the amount of migrants that come to the UK is slightly below average to the rest of Europe....oh no that's not what the Daily Mail told me so it can't be true.

Read on:

http://en.wikipedia.

org/wiki/Immigration

_to_the_United_Kingd

om_since_1922

Too lazy to learn English! If you want to find people too lazy to learn the language of the country they are living in look no further than the 5.5 Million Brits living around the world where the vast majority do not speak the native language (other than English of course) Brits are the laziest in the world when it comes to learning other languages and before you ask Foxy I speak the language of four other Country's fluently.
A few points here, firstly, I know a fair bit about the forces, and I assure you I am no arm chair warrior.

Next thing, Yes, the solders from ww2 would be turning in their grave if they could see what Britain has become, we are over run with immigrants, our identity is lost and there are certain parts of the country where if you walk down the street, your not welcome, as it's Muslim or Black area.

It;s not a case of being racist, it's a fact, and large numbers of immigrants come here with no money or intention of earning any, they are here for the free ride, and criminal activity.

You only got to read the papers or watch crime watch and the majority of offenders are from other countries or of a different race. We have enough proplems with our own criminals etc, so why should we want all that garbage? Costing the tax payer, can't get a doctors appointment, dentist appointment etc, why? because we are over run and looking after all the immigrants, and they know it! they love it!

As for Mo Fara, well he is Somalian, end of......
[quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote: So Howie we have spent £700,000 on the 10% that are to lazy to learn english but want to break the law!!! Is that ok ? because I feel that if they want to break the law and cannot defend themselves then they should be deported without trial.[/p][/quote]You are obviously to lazy to read the article. You assume that all the 10% have had contact with Police which the vast majority will not. Now this might be a surprise to you and sadly I think it will, hold tight Foxy for a revelation, are you ready? NOT EVERYONE WHO HAS CONTACT WITH THE POLICE IS A CRIMINAL. Where does the article say they have broken the law? Why do you imagine that they should defend themselves when the indigenous population would be shouting for a Solicitor on legal aid. Deported without trial... very democratic. Just to let you know the amount of migrants that come to the UK is slightly below average to the rest of Europe....oh no that's not what the Daily Mail told me so it can't be true. Read on: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/Immigration _to_the_United_Kingd om_since_1922 Too lazy to learn English! If you want to find people too lazy to learn the language of the country they are living in look no further than the 5.5 Million Brits living around the world where the vast majority do not speak the native language (other than English of course) Brits are the laziest in the world when it comes to learning other languages and before you ask Foxy I speak the language of four other Country's fluently.[/p][/quote]A few points here, firstly, I know a fair bit about the forces, and I assure you I am no arm chair warrior. Next thing, Yes, the solders from ww2 would be turning in their grave if they could see what Britain has become, we are over run with immigrants, our identity is lost and there are certain parts of the country where if you walk down the street, your not welcome, as it's Muslim or Black area. It;s not a case of being racist, it's a fact, and large numbers of immigrants come here with no money or intention of earning any, they are here for the free ride, and criminal activity. You only got to read the papers or watch crime watch and the majority of offenders are from other countries or of a different race. We have enough proplems with our own criminals etc, so why should we want all that garbage? Costing the tax payer, can't get a doctors appointment, dentist appointment etc, why? because we are over run and looking after all the immigrants, and they know it! they love it! As for Mo Fara, well he is Somalian, end of...... rhinestine
  • Score: 0

9:50am Thu 23 Aug 12

rhinestine says...

Mervyn James wrote:
chris227 wrote:
your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!!
Nice one :) but you almost sounded sincere there lol. I suppose we get called racists and all sorts, I no longer care frankly it is just another excuse for these people to abuse what is left of our democracy. Multi-cultural Britain, the biggest con and hypocrisy ever, it just never happened. They just set up enclaves, street by street and town by town, and they hide behind their language when breaking the law too.
Good post, I agree, people are very quick to say "racist", when in fact, we are not, I have many friends of different cultures.

All I would say when calling people racist is this - If a white British person tried to open a British pub, Fish and Chip shop, or a Catholic Church in the middle east...how far would they get??
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: your a racist lot all these immigrants have made Newport the roaring success it is today and you have all benefited from living in a multi cultural society. Blair and Brown said so If you walk down Pill or corporation road it makes me burst with pride only wish I could afford to live there. Labour done some wonderful things for this country and this is just a small sample of it. So stop your moaning and get down the council office and hand over you 1k + a year in council tax and stop moaning - you lucky things!!![/p][/quote]Nice one :) but you almost sounded sincere there lol. I suppose we get called racists and all sorts, I no longer care frankly it is just another excuse for these people to abuse what is left of our democracy. Multi-cultural Britain, the biggest con and hypocrisy ever, it just never happened. They just set up enclaves, street by street and town by town, and they hide behind their language when breaking the law too.[/p][/quote]Good post, I agree, people are very quick to say "racist", when in fact, we are not, I have many friends of different cultures. All I would say when calling people racist is this - If a white British person tried to open a British pub, Fish and Chip shop, or a Catholic Church in the middle east...how far would they get?? rhinestine
  • Score: 0

10:12am Thu 23 Aug 12

Carrot's says...

Rhinestone - our very own Alf Garnett! It must be a windup - you have deployed the two comedy racist arguments to defend your position
- I have many friends...etc
- As we would be treated badly in other countries so its ok for us to do the same here...
Most of the 'immigrants' I know, work hard and pay their taxes. Go to Newport or Cwmbran magistrates court any day of the week to see the state dependent offenders up on burglary/mugging/dru
gs charges. Vast majority White British I am proud to say.
Rhinestone - our very own Alf Garnett! It must be a windup - you have deployed the two comedy racist arguments to defend your position - I have many friends...etc - As we would be treated badly in other countries so its ok for us to do the same here... Most of the 'immigrants' I know, work hard and pay their taxes. Go to Newport or Cwmbran magistrates court any day of the week to see the state dependent offenders up on burglary/mugging/dru gs charges. Vast majority White British I am proud to say. Carrot's
  • Score: 0

11:31am Thu 23 Aug 12

rhinestine says...

Carrot's wrote:
Rhinestone - our very own Alf Garnett! It must be a windup - you have deployed the two comedy racist arguments to defend your position
- I have many friends...etc
- As we would be treated badly in other countries so its ok for us to do the same here...
Most of the 'immigrants' I know, work hard and pay their taxes. Go to Newport or Cwmbran magistrates court any day of the week to see the state dependent offenders up on burglary/mugging/dru

gs charges. Vast majority White British I am proud to say.
You're the type of person who causes problems in this world, your so one eyed and opinionated about others, just because I am honest and say it as it is, does not make me a Racist!

Yes, I do have friends from different ethnic back grounds, and all of them work hard, pay tax and have integrated into society.

But the majority are free loaders and a problem, as they offer nothing to this country, they just take!

Let me remind you, racism is not just one way....
[quote][p][bold]Carrot's[/bold] wrote: Rhinestone - our very own Alf Garnett! It must be a windup - you have deployed the two comedy racist arguments to defend your position - I have many friends...etc - As we would be treated badly in other countries so its ok for us to do the same here... Most of the 'immigrants' I know, work hard and pay their taxes. Go to Newport or Cwmbran magistrates court any day of the week to see the state dependent offenders up on burglary/mugging/dru gs charges. Vast majority White British I am proud to say.[/p][/quote]You're the type of person who causes problems in this world, your so one eyed and opinionated about others, just because I am honest and say it as it is, does not make me a Racist! Yes, I do have friends from different ethnic back grounds, and all of them work hard, pay tax and have integrated into society. But the majority are free loaders and a problem, as they offer nothing to this country, they just take! Let me remind you, racism is not just one way.... rhinestine
  • Score: 0

12:02pm Thu 23 Aug 12

digispamman says...

if they cant bother to integrate by learning the countries language then send them back to where they came from. they clearly do not want to be british, they just want the obvious benefits of being in this country!
if they cant bother to integrate by learning the countries language then send them back to where they came from. they clearly do not want to be british, they just want the obvious benefits of being in this country! digispamman
  • Score: 0

5:16pm Thu 23 Aug 12

Strider says...

Gareth wrote:
I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument...
'Gareth' you should have known the people here don't do debate, their opinion is fact! The worst thing about these forums is the people who post there. They take a pride in behaving in the most anti-social way they can and would(do) go out of their way to make personal insults or say something unpleasant to anyone else.

I had ignored this topic giving it 3 posts before the insults started.. You where right the anti-immigration posts were made in the first post, 12 posts later CM1 decided not let the side down and gave gives a typically aggressive response to Ianfox....

I've always said you where one of the few decent posters here and I've always enjoyed talking to you, you've always make well written and argued comments and never resorted to insult or disrespect. Good to see you back however briefly..
[quote][p][bold]Gareth[/bold] wrote: I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument...[/p][/quote]'Gareth' you should have known the people here don't do debate, their opinion is fact! The worst thing about these forums is the people who post there. They take a pride in behaving in the most anti-social way they can and would(do) go out of their way to make personal insults or say something unpleasant to anyone else. I had ignored this topic giving it 3 posts before the insults started.. You where right the anti-immigration posts were made in the first post, 12 posts later CM1 decided not let the side down and gave gives a typically aggressive response to Ianfox.... I've always said you where one of the few decent posters here and I've always enjoyed talking to you, you've always make well written and argued comments and never resorted to insult or disrespect. Good to see you back however briefly.. Strider
  • Score: 0

6:22pm Thu 23 Aug 12

Poolerkev says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Totally defeats Cameron's pledge to make sure anyone who lives here has at least a rudimentary awareness of English. All they do is colonise us and if we insist, they use the human rights law to operate as if they never left their own country at all.

It's not just police, but SS, the NHS, any dept they come in contact with, with Kent having to manage 100 different languages and dialects, funds are being taken away from vital services too.

One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined..

Time to repatriate or at least send these people to SCHOOL so we aren't having to do this all the time.
"One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined.."

Now you must all see that that is wrong?
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: Totally defeats Cameron's pledge to make sure anyone who lives here has at least a rudimentary awareness of English. All they do is colonise us and if we insist, they use the human rights law to operate as if they never left their own country at all. It's not just police, but SS, the NHS, any dept they come in contact with, with Kent having to manage 100 different languages and dialects, funds are being taken away from vital services too. One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined.. Time to repatriate or at least send these people to SCHOOL so we aren't having to do this all the time.[/p][/quote]"One GP advertises 50 languages they will accommodate ! but a deaf man said he had no access himself to these services and he could not get an appointment with his GP,because sign language was not an access form they included,so even the disabled were sidelined.." Now you must all see that that is wrong? Poolerkev
  • Score: 0

7:13pm Thu 23 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

Strider wrote:
Gareth wrote:
I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument...
'Gareth' you should have known the people here don't do debate, their opinion is fact! The worst thing about these forums is the people who post there. They take a pride in behaving in the most anti-social way they can and would(do) go out of their way to make personal insults or say something unpleasant to anyone else.

I had ignored this topic giving it 3 posts before the insults started.. You where right the anti-immigration posts were made in the first post, 12 posts later CM1 decided not let the side down and gave gives a typically aggressive response to Ianfox....

I've always said you where one of the few decent posters here and I've always enjoyed talking to you, you've always make well written and argued comments and never resorted to insult or disrespect. Good to see you back however briefly..
Not anti-immigration, just basic common-sense. Anyone can see the British democracy is being abused at every level, any complaint, you are racist, time to change the record and also time to put THEM on the defensive instead of us. It cannot be right we are being attacked for insisting we are understood in our own country.
[quote][p][bold]Strider[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Gareth[/bold] wrote: I wondered how long it would for the anti-immigation argument...[/p][/quote]'Gareth' you should have known the people here don't do debate, their opinion is fact! The worst thing about these forums is the people who post there. They take a pride in behaving in the most anti-social way they can and would(do) go out of their way to make personal insults or say something unpleasant to anyone else. I had ignored this topic giving it 3 posts before the insults started.. You where right the anti-immigration posts were made in the first post, 12 posts later CM1 decided not let the side down and gave gives a typically aggressive response to Ianfox.... I've always said you where one of the few decent posters here and I've always enjoyed talking to you, you've always make well written and argued comments and never resorted to insult or disrespect. Good to see you back however briefly..[/p][/quote]Not anti-immigration, just basic common-sense. Anyone can see the British democracy is being abused at every level, any complaint, you are racist, time to change the record and also time to put THEM on the defensive instead of us. It cannot be right we are being attacked for insisting we are understood in our own country. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

8:45pm Thu 23 Aug 12

gordelpus says...

In for a penny, in for a pound, the biter is bit, and the grinder is ground. My experience of this over the past 20 yrs is that the offenders we've imported simply can't compete with the home grown scum who populate the custody suites, A&E, Corn St, the Housing Office HMP's Cardiff and Parc, and, unfortunately, the wider community where normal people live. Off to hell in a handcart.
In for a penny, in for a pound, the biter is bit, and the grinder is ground. My experience of this over the past 20 yrs is that the offenders we've imported simply can't compete with the home grown scum who populate the custody suites, A&E, Corn St, the Housing Office HMP's Cardiff and Parc, and, unfortunately, the wider community where normal people live. Off to hell in a handcart. gordelpus
  • Score: 0

8:46pm Thu 23 Aug 12

welshmen says...

You have to ask your self why? people want to come here from their homeland to a strange place with a different language, come here and seek asylum when they've past many UN countries, they come on the back of lorries through Europe, there are i suppose many reasons each have there own, like us we have our reasons why we want them and why we don't want them, i know because of them social amenities are stretched and indigenous people have to wait for housing because asylum seekers have to be by law housed and fed,there TV licence, Gas, Electric, Rent, Mobile phones, Council Tax, Doctors, Dentists clothing is all free, immigrant Europeans on the other hand have the same as the indigenous population,they can claim child allowance for their children that are back in their country, they have the right to work and pay taxes,and have help to buy a car tax and inc if they get a job, if they can't find work then they receive JSA (dole), also housing benefit, or if there older Pension credit as well as JSA, + all the other welfare stuff we take for granted, if they retire over here then there intituled to a state pension like the indigenous population, one of the biggest problems with the immigrant that upsets a lot of people is they have n't put anything in the POT, they take and take, all Liberal Labour Conservative minded voters encouraged immigration, the indigenous population were never asked, they were also promised a referendum on either we stay or go from the EU, the Media which brainwashes most of this countries population have a lot to answer for, i am happy if they come in smaller numbers a very slow build up, if they abide by our laws and don't try and set up there own law system, if they when asked to fight for our country, integrate with us because up to now Asians never have, how many you know have married a white girl? or how many white men have married a British Asian girl?, honour killings comes to mind, i believe things will get a lot worse, in France there were riots with the police and immigrant ghettoes our media have not shown that, if you mention the white word then your classed as a racist, the money spent on translators is a drop in the ocean compared to the true cost of immigration, go to London and you will see what the rest of our country is going to end up like, unless Governments change there policies Britain is finished...
You have to ask your self why? people want to come here from their homeland to a strange place with a different language, come here and seek asylum when they've past many UN countries, they come on the back of lorries through Europe, there are i suppose many reasons each have there own, like us we have our reasons why we want them and why we don't want them, i know because of them social amenities are stretched and indigenous people have to wait for housing because asylum seekers have to be by law housed and fed,there TV licence, Gas, Electric, Rent, Mobile phones, Council Tax, Doctors, Dentists clothing is all free, immigrant Europeans on the other hand have the same as the indigenous population,they can claim child allowance for their children that are back in their country, they have the right to work and pay taxes,and have help to buy a car tax and inc if they get a job, if they can't find work then they receive JSA (dole), also housing benefit, or if there older Pension credit as well as JSA, + all the other welfare stuff we take for granted, if they retire over here then there intituled to a state pension like the indigenous population, one of the biggest problems with the immigrant that upsets a lot of people is they have n't put anything in the POT, they take and take, all Liberal Labour Conservative minded voters encouraged immigration, the indigenous population were never asked, they were also promised a referendum on either we stay or go from the EU, the Media which brainwashes most of this countries population have a lot to answer for, i am happy if they come in smaller numbers a very slow build up, if they abide by our laws and don't try and set up there own law system, if they when asked to fight for our country, integrate with us because up to now Asians never have, how many you know have married a white girl? or how many white men have married a British Asian girl?, honour killings comes to mind, i believe things will get a lot worse, in France there were riots with the police and immigrant ghettoes our media have not shown that, if you mention the white word then your classed as a racist, the money spent on translators is a drop in the ocean compared to the true cost of immigration, go to London and you will see what the rest of our country is going to end up like, unless Governments change there policies Britain is finished... welshmen
  • Score: 0

8:46pm Thu 23 Aug 12

gordelpus says...

I'd like to call myself racist to fit in with the posters of the following comments.
I'd like to call myself racist to fit in with the posters of the following comments. gordelpus
  • Score: 0

8:50pm Thu 23 Aug 12

gordelpus says...

gordelpus wrote:
I'd like to call myself racist to fit in with the posters of the following comments.
Well said boy.
[quote][p][bold]gordelpus[/bold] wrote: I'd like to call myself racist to fit in with the posters of the following comments.[/p][/quote]Well said boy. gordelpus
  • Score: 0

8:52pm Thu 23 Aug 12

gordelpus says...

I appear to have quoted myself. Result.
Well said Welshmen
I appear to have quoted myself. Result. Well said Welshmen gordelpus
  • Score: 0

9:14pm Thu 23 Aug 12

CM1 says...

Strider, just looking at it from the flip side.
Strider, just looking at it from the flip side. CM1
  • Score: 0

11:16pm Thu 23 Aug 12

chris227 says...

for all you labour supporters out there if labour loved immigration so much and told the sheep how it made out lives complete why does morden and Flyn not choose to live in pill or corporation and choose to deprive themselves of this experience there leaders were so pleased to visit on the rest of us!!
for all you labour supporters out there if labour loved immigration so much and told the sheep how it made out lives complete why does morden and Flyn not choose to live in pill or corporation and choose to deprive themselves of this experience there leaders were so pleased to visit on the rest of us!! chris227
  • Score: 0

11:30pm Thu 23 Aug 12

Dolieboy says...

Translators are brought in to talk to suspects in crimes, as well as witnesses and victims.

There for the numskulls amongst you.

If you were on holiday in Italy and were mugged, I suppose you speak fluent Italian ?
Translators are brought in to talk to suspects in crimes, as well as witnesses and victims. There for the numskulls amongst you. If you were on holiday in Italy and were mugged, I suppose you speak fluent Italian ? Dolieboy
  • Score: 0

12:09am Fri 24 Aug 12

Strider says...

Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours..

Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later
Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours.. Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later Strider
  • Score: 0

8:48am Fri 24 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

I think the rhetoric of political correctness is well on the way to being kicked out Racists, Homophobic et al. We have to get back to some semblance of a democracy again. People who sit on the fence are just going to get a painful backside. Don't you just get fed up with those who espouse 'live and let live' then move away because they cannot understand what the people living in their street say any more. Where your kids are expecting to play with other children wearing masks all day ? Or not being able to understand what they are saying... in an ENGLISH lesson ? Enough is enough.
I think the rhetoric of political correctness is well on the way to being kicked out Racists, Homophobic et al. We have to get back to some semblance of a democracy again. People who sit on the fence are just going to get a painful backside. Don't you just get fed up with those who espouse 'live and let live' then move away because they cannot understand what the people living in their street say any more. Where your kids are expecting to play with other children wearing masks all day ? Or not being able to understand what they are saying... in an ENGLISH lesson ? Enough is enough. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

9:38am Fri 24 Aug 12

Howie' says...

chris227 wrote:
for all you labour supporters out there if labour loved immigration so much and told the sheep how it made out lives complete why does morden and Flyn not choose to live in pill or corporation and choose to deprive themselves of this experience there leaders were so pleased to visit on the rest of us!!
I don't know about you Chris, but most of us live in areas that we can afford to live. Nothing to do with politics or immigration just simple personal finance.
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: for all you labour supporters out there if labour loved immigration so much and told the sheep how it made out lives complete why does morden and Flyn not choose to live in pill or corporation and choose to deprive themselves of this experience there leaders were so pleased to visit on the rest of us!![/p][/quote]I don't know about you Chris, but most of us live in areas that we can afford to live. Nothing to do with politics or immigration just simple personal finance. Howie'
  • Score: 0

10:10am Fri 24 Aug 12

James Farror says...

Unfortunately, until proponents of both side of the argument pick up a history book or actually bother to do their homework properly, it's pointless even debating the issues prevalent in this piece.

Some people are so dogmatic and doctrinaire it's laughable.
Unfortunately, until proponents of both side of the argument pick up a history book or actually bother to do their homework properly, it's pointless even debating the issues prevalent in this piece. Some people are so dogmatic and doctrinaire it's laughable. James Farror
  • Score: 0

10:16am Fri 24 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Strider wrote:
Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours..

Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later
Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra
ltar 4,250.

And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times:

LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt.

The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity.

That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration.

That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning.
[quote][p][bold]Strider[/bold] wrote: Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours.. Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later[/p][/quote]Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra ltar 4,250. And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times: LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt. The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity. That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration. That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning. Howie'
  • Score: 0

12:48pm Fri 24 Aug 12

username2 says...

Howie, James, Carrot, it's such a relief to see that since the Argus has reintroduced online comments, there is space for rational, thought amongst the bigoted, I'll thought out comments. Completely agree.
Howie, James, Carrot, it's such a relief to see that since the Argus has reintroduced online comments, there is space for rational, thought amongst the bigoted, I'll thought out comments. Completely agree. username2
  • Score: 0

7:27pm Fri 24 Aug 12

gordelpus says...

I think I must be a bigot, and there was me thinking my views were pragmatic observations from the front line. In 20 yrs of attending the custody suites and Courts I don't think I've ever seen an interpreter used for a victim of crime. I have however witnessed many offenders who's competent ability to speak and understand the english language disappears upon being nicked. We're footing the bill for this remember. It's an abuse of the system designed to ensure that detainees are treated fairly.

Yours.

A confirmed rectionary bigot
I think I must be a bigot, and there was me thinking my views were pragmatic observations from the front line. In 20 yrs of attending the custody suites and Courts I don't think I've ever seen an interpreter used for a victim of crime. I have however witnessed many offenders who's competent ability to speak and understand the english language disappears upon being nicked. We're footing the bill for this remember. It's an abuse of the system designed to ensure that detainees are treated fairly. Yours. A confirmed rectionary bigot gordelpus
  • Score: 0

8:33pm Fri 24 Aug 12

regaturn says...

Does the sum quoted include Language line costs, it used to take on average 30 minutes to book someone into custody using language line, I was told the cost was betweem £10 and £20 per minute!!! I normally spoke with someone based in California.
Does the sum quoted include Language line costs, it used to take on average 30 minutes to book someone into custody using language line, I was told the cost was betweem £10 and £20 per minute!!! I normally spoke with someone based in California. regaturn
  • Score: 0

12:34am Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

gordelpus wrote:
I think I must be a bigot, and there was me thinking my views were pragmatic observations from the front line. In 20 yrs of attending the custody suites and Courts I don't think I've ever seen an interpreter used for a victim of crime. I have however witnessed many offenders who's competent ability to speak and understand the english language disappears upon being nicked. We're footing the bill for this remember. It's an abuse of the system designed to ensure that detainees are treated fairly.

Yours.

A confirmed rectionary bigot
Well you think your a bigot and who am I to argue.
[quote][p][bold]gordelpus[/bold] wrote: I think I must be a bigot, and there was me thinking my views were pragmatic observations from the front line. In 20 yrs of attending the custody suites and Courts I don't think I've ever seen an interpreter used for a victim of crime. I have however witnessed many offenders who's competent ability to speak and understand the english language disappears upon being nicked. We're footing the bill for this remember. It's an abuse of the system designed to ensure that detainees are treated fairly. Yours. A confirmed rectionary bigot[/p][/quote]Well you think your a bigot and who am I to argue. Howie'
  • Score: 0

9:47am Sat 25 Aug 12

Bobevans says...

Howie' wrote:
Strider wrote:
Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours..

Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later
Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra

ltar 4,250.

And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times:

LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt.

The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity.

That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration.

That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning.
We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5. Most of the countries that have population densities higher than us are small tax havens


Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination. Recent reports indicates mass migration is a net liability to the UK. Those claiming it benefits the UK look only at tax revenues and not the outgioing side of the equation

Migration wil not cut public debt that is a falaciy it will actually increase it.

Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither. You need several acres per household to support each familly
[quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Strider[/bold] wrote: Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours.. Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later[/p][/quote]Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra ltar 4,250. And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times: LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt. The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity. That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration. That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning.[/p][/quote]We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5. Most of the countries that have population densities higher than us are small tax havens Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination. Recent reports indicates mass migration is a net liability to the UK. Those claiming it benefits the UK look only at tax revenues and not the outgioing side of the equation Migration wil not cut public debt that is a falaciy it will actually increase it. Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither. You need several acres per household to support each familly Bobevans
  • Score: 0

10:46am Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Bobevans wrote:
Howie' wrote:
Strider wrote:
Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours..

Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later
Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra


ltar 4,250.

And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times:

LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt.

The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity.

That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration.

That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning.
We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5. Most of the countries that have population densities higher than us are small tax havens


Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination. Recent reports indicates mass migration is a net liability to the UK. Those claiming it benefits the UK look only at tax revenues and not the outgioing side of the equation

Migration wil not cut public debt that is a falaciy it will actually increase it.

Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither. You need several acres per household to support each familly
Hello Bobby, I wish you would read what I have said before commenting!

Bob Says: We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5.

No Bob, we are 52nd, here's the link to Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_sov
ereign_states_and_de
pendent_territories_
by_population_densit
y

or you can just Google 'population density' and you will find a lot of evidence that we are 52nd and not in the top 5.

Bob Says: Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination.

As I said Bob you should read what I said before commenting.
It is the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that I stated was claiming that migration is good for Fiscal Sustainability not me. The OBR that was set up by the Government that you support, Bob. If you actually take the time to read the report, Bob it does weigh up all the pros and cons. Here's the report that the Government that you voted for are actively considering.

http://budgetrespons
ibility.independent.
gov.uk/wordpress/doc
s/Executive-summary1
.pdf

Not that there is a hope in hell of you actually reading it, is there Bob?

Bob Says: Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither.

Where did I claim that we have plenty of space Bob???? read my post, but as you mention it, looking down from a recent flight to Scotland it is mostly a green and pleasant land.

Bob Says: You need several acres per household to support each familly.

Each person in this country has aprox 1 acre.
[quote][p][bold]Bobevans[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Strider[/bold] wrote: Mervyn I agree with you 100%, it's just if anybody dares to say we are overpopulated the internet Rambo's throw there toys out of their pram and become abusive and aggressive and shout you down a Fascist.. Out of 242 country's the UK ranks 22 in the most densely populated even France whose official estimate for population is 65,350,000 and that's a far bigger country than ours.. Look at Burma, North Korea and good old Robert Mugabe for human rights abuse.. Funny how these leftie's don't go to place's like Brazil to protest as there bodies would be found in a ditch a few day later[/p][/quote]Tom, the UK ranks 52nd not 22nd and Germany comes in at 57. Not sure what point you were trying to make, if it's the 'we are so overcrowded there is no room for anyone else' argument then I'm afraid it doesn't really stack up. We have a population density of 256 per sq kilometer, Macau has 19,610...Monaco 17,676..Singapore 7,363...Hong Kong...6,452...Gibra ltar 4,250. And bear in mind Tom that these areas that are populated up to 77 times what the UK is are amongst the wealthiest in the world and are teeming with immigrants. So what you have done is make an argument for increased immigration in to the UK, which is something this Conservative Government is actually considering, this from the Economic Times: LONDON: The David Cameron government, which has vowed to reduce immigration from non-EU countries like India, has found itself in a piquant situation as a public finance watchdog created by it has suggested that Britain needs immigrants to cut large public debt. The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR), which was created in 2010 to provide independent and authoritative analysis of the UK's public finances, said in its latest Fiscal Sustainability Report that higher levels of immigration over the next 50 years would spare taxpayers from the need to endure much greater austerity. That kinda chimes with your thinking Tom, more immigration means greater Fiscal Sustainability and lets face it the figures that you kindly pointed us to means that we have plenty of space for a lot more immigrants. But whilst everyone is arguing about it Cameron is quietly carrying out the recommendations of the OBR and relaxing the rules for immigration. That should get the juices of the Daily Mail and other right wing press readers going this morning.[/p][/quote]We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5. Most of the countries that have population densities higher than us are small tax havens Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination. Recent reports indicates mass migration is a net liability to the UK. Those claiming it benefits the UK look only at tax revenues and not the outgioing side of the equation Migration wil not cut public debt that is a falaciy it will actually increase it. Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither. You need several acres per household to support each familly[/p][/quote]Hello Bobby, I wish you would read what I have said before commenting! Bob Says: We are one of the most heeavilly populated countries in the world. We are in the top 5. No Bob, we are 52nd, here's the link to Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_sov ereign_states_and_de pendent_territories_ by_population_densit y or you can just Google 'population density' and you will find a lot of evidence that we are 52nd and not in the top 5. Bob Says: Your claimthat higher levels of migration will solve the UK's problems does not stand up to examination. As I said Bob you should read what I said before commenting. It is the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that I stated was claiming that migration is good for Fiscal Sustainability not me. The OBR that was set up by the Government that you support, Bob. If you actually take the time to read the report, Bob it does weigh up all the pros and cons. Here's the report that the Government that you voted for are actively considering. http://budgetrespons ibility.independent. gov.uk/wordpress/doc s/Executive-summary1 .pdf Not that there is a hope in hell of you actually reading it, is there Bob? Bob Says: Your claimthat we have plenty of space does not hold up neither. Where did I claim that we have plenty of space Bob???? read my post, but as you mention it, looking down from a recent flight to Scotland it is mostly a green and pleasant land. Bob Says: You need several acres per household to support each familly. Each person in this country has aprox 1 acre. Howie'
  • Score: 0

10:46am Sat 25 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

username2 wrote:
Howie, James, Carrot, it's such a relief to see that since the Argus has reintroduced online comments, there is space for rational, thought amongst the bigoted, I'll thought out comments. Completely agree.
Name-calling has no place in debates about these issues, it is the last refuge of those who cannot validate their obscure views on equality,which means some people should be more equal than others. We should be questioning mass immigration, NHS freebies to visitors, job-stealing by migrants who pay gang leaders, students who come here and never return to their own countries. Those that claim political asylum for no valid reason at all but to get work,housing and allowances.

We need a total opt out of the freedom of movement law that allows all these Europeans to wander in and out at will, when outside Europe those from Asia are well educated and do produce value, but who cannot get in.

Jobs for the euro boys ! The total inequality of fair access that puts British people last in their own country, and deprives even its own disabled and vulnerable to project an very discriminatory image we are a democracy, when the local population is being gagged, and being deprived or what work there is. You make it sound as if this is a concern of half a dozen posters here,when in fact 68% of the population puts YOU in a minority position,but for the inadequate and ridiculous HR law, we would have addressed most of this years ago.
[quote][p][bold]username2[/bold] wrote: Howie, James, Carrot, it's such a relief to see that since the Argus has reintroduced online comments, there is space for rational, thought amongst the bigoted, I'll thought out comments. Completely agree.[/p][/quote]Name-calling has no place in debates about these issues, it is the last refuge of those who cannot validate their obscure views on equality,which means some people should be more equal than others. We should be questioning mass immigration, NHS freebies to visitors, job-stealing by migrants who pay gang leaders, students who come here and never return to their own countries. Those that claim political asylum for no valid reason at all but to get work,housing and allowances. We need a total opt out of the freedom of movement law that allows all these Europeans to wander in and out at will, when outside Europe those from Asia are well educated and do produce value, but who cannot get in. Jobs for the euro boys ! The total inequality of fair access that puts British people last in their own country, and deprives even its own disabled and vulnerable to project an very discriminatory image we are a democracy, when the local population is being gagged, and being deprived or what work there is. You make it sound as if this is a concern of half a dozen posters here,when in fact 68% of the population puts YOU in a minority position,but for the inadequate and ridiculous HR law, we would have addressed most of this years ago. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

11:29am Sat 25 Aug 12

chris227 says...

mmm this multi cultural paradise that Labour was so keen on has got a few of you hot under the collar, but you have to admit you haven't got far to drive/walk in newport if you like take away!!
mmm this multi cultural paradise that Labour was so keen on has got a few of you hot under the collar, but you have to admit you haven't got far to drive/walk in newport if you like take away!! chris227
  • Score: 0

1:41pm Sat 25 Aug 12

welshmen says...

A lot of the reasons why we are as we are including immigration, it's because of the people who run our Country and i mean Britain, if you want an incite into what it's all about,and you have some time, those who rule us...
Bankers Rockafella Rothchild, look at
http://www.utube.com
/watch?v=swkq2e8mswl and make your own mind up, our Government are just puppets...
A lot of the reasons why we are as we are including immigration, it's because of the people who run our Country and i mean Britain, if you want an incite into what it's all about,and you have some time, those who rule us... Bankers Rockafella Rothchild, look at http://www.utube.com /watch?v=swkq2e8mswl and make your own mind up, our Government are just puppets... welshmen
  • Score: 0

6:50pm Sat 25 Aug 12

chris227 says...

howie not sure what you meant on your reply to my previous post you think morden cannot afford a house down pill or corp road on 66k a year which Labour has told its followers is heaven on earth!
howie not sure what you meant on your reply to my previous post you think morden cannot afford a house down pill or corp road on 66k a year which Labour has told its followers is heaven on earth! chris227
  • Score: 0

7:49pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Strider says...

Howie can you send me a link to the populations per country.. I got my source from Wikipedia the same place you're getting yours?

Sincerely yours

Tom XXX
Howie can you send me a link to the populations per country.. I got my source from Wikipedia the same place you're getting yours? Sincerely yours Tom XXX Strider
  • Score: 0

8:47pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

chris227 wrote:
howie not sure what you meant on your reply to my previous post you think morden cannot afford a house down pill or corp road on 66k a year which Labour has told its followers is heaven on earth!
Quite simple Chris, I'm sure that you can work it out! If your a millionaire then you would live in an area commensurate with your wealth, ditto for someone on whatever their income. It's not rocket science Chris.

Maybe you can tell me when our Mp's said that Pill or Corporation Road is in your words 'Heaven on Earth'. I'll give you a clue Chris.....they did not say that.
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: howie not sure what you meant on your reply to my previous post you think morden cannot afford a house down pill or corp road on 66k a year which Labour has told its followers is heaven on earth![/p][/quote]Quite simple Chris, I'm sure that you can work it out! If your a millionaire then you would live in an area commensurate with your wealth, ditto for someone on whatever their income. It's not rocket science Chris. Maybe you can tell me when our Mp's said that Pill or Corporation Road is in your words 'Heaven on Earth'. I'll give you a clue Chris.....they did not say that. Howie'
  • Score: 0

8:49pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

welshmen wrote:
A lot of the reasons why we are as we are including immigration, it's because of the people who run our Country and i mean Britain, if you want an incite into what it's all about,and you have some time, those who rule us...
Bankers Rockafella Rothchild, look at
http://www.utube.com

/watch?v=swkq2e8mswl and make your own mind up, our Government are just puppets...
Your link does not work; What is 'utube'.
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: A lot of the reasons why we are as we are including immigration, it's because of the people who run our Country and i mean Britain, if you want an incite into what it's all about,and you have some time, those who rule us... Bankers Rockafella Rothchild, look at http://www.utube.com /watch?v=swkq2e8mswl and make your own mind up, our Government are just puppets...[/p][/quote]Your link does not work; What is 'utube'. Howie'
  • Score: 0

8:52pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Strider wrote:
Howie can you send me a link to the populations per country.. I got my source from Wikipedia the same place you're getting yours?

Sincerely yours

Tom XXX
Here it is Tom:

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_sov
ereign_states_and_de
pendent_territories_
by_population_densit
y
[quote][p][bold]Strider[/bold] wrote: Howie can you send me a link to the populations per country.. I got my source from Wikipedia the same place you're getting yours? Sincerely yours Tom XXX[/p][/quote]Here it is Tom: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_sov ereign_states_and_de pendent_territories_ by_population_densit y Howie'
  • Score: 0

10:32pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Strider says...

Thanks Howie just been reading it, interesting read.. Will have to try and find you that other wiki article.. The Guardian ran a article sighting this link..
Thanks Howie just been reading it, interesting read.. Will have to try and find you that other wiki article.. The Guardian ran a article sighting this link.. Strider
  • Score: 0

11:48pm Sat 25 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Please do, Tom. Look forward to reading it.
Please do, Tom. Look forward to reading it. Howie'
  • Score: 0

9:57am Sun 26 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

I just want an equality law that is based on common sense and not politically correct rhetoric and noisy minorities running the show, via a law based in Europe that just works for them. The Human rights act HAS to go, (So too has the child act), at least be re-written in the light of soft countries like ours being exploited to the detriment of British people. Human rights now overrules equality laws, that is not what it was designed for. They should compliment each other not work against.
I just want an equality law that is based on common sense and not politically correct rhetoric and noisy minorities running the show, via a law based in Europe that just works for them. The Human rights act HAS to go, (So too has the child act), at least be re-written in the light of soft countries like ours being exploited to the detriment of British people. Human rights now overrules equality laws, that is not what it was designed for. They should compliment each other not work against. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

10:26am Sun 26 Aug 12

chris227 says...

I suppose that Newport is so run down and deprived now it looks like Kabul without the weather but saying that i did see that even they have a new shopping centre- 'kabul city shopping centre' perhaps the brain dead morons that run that city council could go over for some on the job training.
I suppose that Newport is so run down and deprived now it looks like Kabul without the weather but saying that i did see that even they have a new shopping centre- 'kabul city shopping centre' perhaps the brain dead morons that run that city council could go over for some on the job training. chris227
  • Score: 0

11:39am Sun 26 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this:

There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index.

Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats.

Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.
Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this: There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index. Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats. Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well. Howie'
  • Score: 0

12:53pm Sun 26 Aug 12

welshmen says...

Howie. google utube, once there search
The Secret of Oz.
Howie. google utube, once there search The Secret of Oz. welshmen
  • Score: 0

5:05pm Sun 26 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Found it now thanks, interesting I have read a couple of articles about this.

http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=7qIhDdST2
7g
Found it now thanks, interesting I have read a couple of articles about this. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=7qIhDdST2 7g Howie'
  • Score: 0

6:36pm Sun 26 Aug 12

Dee-Gee says...

chris227 wrote:
mmm this multi cultural paradise that Labour was so keen on has got a few of you hot under the collar, but you have to admit you haven't got far to drive/walk in newport if you like take away!!
I *do* like takeaway. And I like working and living alongside people from all over the world.

Horses for courses and all that, but to my mind, it's a LOT better than being holed up in a dull little Valleys village where everyone looks the same, acts the same, eats the same, thinks the same, dresses the same and dies the same, unless they drink themselves to death first in a mind-numbing sputter of boredom.

Down the club every weekend night; same old faces, same old pint...
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: mmm this multi cultural paradise that Labour was so keen on has got a few of you hot under the collar, but you have to admit you haven't got far to drive/walk in newport if you like take away!![/p][/quote]I *do* like takeaway. And I like working and living alongside people from all over the world. Horses for courses and all that, but to my mind, it's a LOT better than being holed up in a dull little Valleys village where everyone looks the same, acts the same, eats the same, thinks the same, dresses the same and dies the same, unless they drink themselves to death first in a mind-numbing sputter of boredom. Down the club every weekend night; same old faces, same old pint... Dee-Gee
  • Score: 0

6:42pm Sun 26 Aug 12

chris227 says...

yes howie that's true i have a friend that has emigrated to perth and one to British columbia but they needed qualifications and a trade it took them a year and cost a fortune even the dog cost over 1k to emigrate!. They never turned up at the door and told some fairy tale storey about being picked on if you watch "channel 4 - immigration the inconvenient truth" its on you tube you will see 80% of Somalians are on the disability/job seekers what ever you want to call it.
yes howie that's true i have a friend that has emigrated to perth and one to British columbia but they needed qualifications and a trade it took them a year and cost a fortune even the dog cost over 1k to emigrate!. They never turned up at the door and told some fairy tale storey about being picked on if you watch "channel 4 - immigration the inconvenient truth" its on you tube you will see 80% of Somalians are on the disability/job seekers what ever you want to call it. chris227
  • Score: 0

7:56pm Sun 26 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

Howie' wrote:
Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this:

There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index.

Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats.

Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.
Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.
[quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this: There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index. Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats. Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.[/p][/quote]Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

1:22am Mon 27 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Howie' wrote:
Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this:

There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index.

Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats.

Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.
Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.
Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact.
I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's.
My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this: There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index. Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats. Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.[/p][/quote]Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.[/p][/quote]Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact. I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's. My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out. Howie'
  • Score: 0

1:39am Mon 27 Aug 12

Howie' says...

chris227 wrote:
yes howie that's true i have a friend that has emigrated to perth and one to British columbia but they needed qualifications and a trade it took them a year and cost a fortune even the dog cost over 1k to emigrate!. They never turned up at the door and told some fairy tale storey about being picked on if you watch "channel 4 - immigration the inconvenient truth" its on you tube you will see 80% of Somalians are on the disability/job seekers what ever you want to call it.
Exactly Chris, they legally applied and were admitted the same as the vast majority of migrants in this Country.

Just out of curiosity where did you get the '80% of Somalians on disability' from.

The UK has a large Somali population,biggest in Europe, many of the families going back to the 19th century when they first settled here. There is a total of 108, 000 or 0.15% of the population.
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: yes howie that's true i have a friend that has emigrated to perth and one to British columbia but they needed qualifications and a trade it took them a year and cost a fortune even the dog cost over 1k to emigrate!. They never turned up at the door and told some fairy tale storey about being picked on if you watch "channel 4 - immigration the inconvenient truth" its on you tube you will see 80% of Somalians are on the disability/job seekers what ever you want to call it.[/p][/quote]Exactly Chris, they legally applied and were admitted the same as the vast majority of migrants in this Country. Just out of curiosity where did you get the '80% of Somalians on disability' from. The UK has a large Somali population,biggest in Europe, many of the families going back to the 19th century when they first settled here. There is a total of 108, 000 or 0.15% of the population. Howie'
  • Score: 0

10:30am Mon 27 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

Howie' wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
Howie' wrote:
Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this:

There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index.

Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats.

Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.
Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.
Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact.
I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's.
My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out.
They leave because immigration has meant there is no future for them or their children, our best brains are getting out while they can. They move because of a 'better life' since life is becoming Intolerable here. On SKY News this morning a politician says Immigration HAS to be halted and this issue debated and sorted out,but no-one is actually doing it in case they get called racist or something this is really an unhealthy situation.
[quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this: There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index. Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats. Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.[/p][/quote]Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.[/p][/quote]Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact. I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's. My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out.[/p][/quote]They leave because immigration has meant there is no future for them or their children, our best brains are getting out while they can. They move because of a 'better life' since life is becoming Intolerable here. On SKY News this morning a politician says Immigration HAS to be halted and this issue debated and sorted out,but no-one is actually doing it in case they get called racist or something this is really an unhealthy situation. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

11:09am Mon 27 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Howie' wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
Howie' wrote:
Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this:

There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index.

Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats.

Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.
Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.
Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact.
I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's.
My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out.
They leave because immigration has meant there is no future for them or their children, our best brains are getting out while they can. They move because of a 'better life' since life is becoming Intolerable here. On SKY News this morning a politician says Immigration HAS to be halted and this issue debated and sorted out,but no-one is actually doing it in case they get called racist or something this is really an unhealthy situation.
They leave for a myriad of reasons Merv and trying to say it is all down to immigration and the Human Rights act is very disingenuous because throughout Europe they have had and used the Human Rights act since the 1950's, immigration into Germany, Spain, Sweden, Austria and Belgium is slightly higher as a percentage of the population than the UK whilst the rest of western Europe is very close yet about 1.6 million ex pats have moved there and they have the same Human Rights Act and similar levels of migration.

Whilst I am not a fan of immigration I have read a lot about the projected demographics for the UK and Europe and it is frightening reading.

Whoever the politico was on Sky News this morning calling for a halt on immigration was being very disingenuous because all Government ministers know the figures, why do you think the Tory's who have always been anti-immigrant have done nothing about it, just paid lip service to cutting down on immigration. Why do German ministers rue not letting the East Europeans in in 2003 and say that Britain stole a march on them. You might not like it Merv and I certainly don't but no Government is going to stop immigration not even if UKIP came to power.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Howie'[/bold] wrote: Just heard an interesting comment by Damian Green the Government Immigration Minister, he said that there are more Brits living and working abroad than any other European Country. So I googled it and found this: There are now 4.6 million British expats living and working abroad, helping to shape the communities they live in, according the fifth annual NatWest International Personal Banking (NatWest IPB) Quality of Life Index. Australia (1.4 million), Spain (940,000) and the USA (794,000) are the three most popular destinations for British expats. Seems we like to work and live in other country's as well.[/p][/quote]Driven out. All of then say there is nothing here for real brits any more. How many migrants, illegals, free loaders, out of work Europeans, false students, Health tourists, fake asylum seekers, are here ? Kicks 4m into a cocked hat. We've allowed Europe to do to us what Hitler couldn't.[/p][/quote]Very dramatic Merv but lacking in fact. I was expecting someone to say that but the figures have been pretty constant since the 90's. My mates living in Spain and my family living in NZ were certainly not driven out and when I visit them I meet a lot of their ex pat mates and I have never heard one say that they were driven out.[/p][/quote]They leave because immigration has meant there is no future for them or their children, our best brains are getting out while they can. They move because of a 'better life' since life is becoming Intolerable here. On SKY News this morning a politician says Immigration HAS to be halted and this issue debated and sorted out,but no-one is actually doing it in case they get called racist or something this is really an unhealthy situation.[/p][/quote]They leave for a myriad of reasons Merv and trying to say it is all down to immigration and the Human Rights act is very disingenuous because throughout Europe they have had and used the Human Rights act since the 1950's, immigration into Germany, Spain, Sweden, Austria and Belgium is slightly higher as a percentage of the population than the UK whilst the rest of western Europe is very close yet about 1.6 million ex pats have moved there and they have the same Human Rights Act and similar levels of migration. Whilst I am not a fan of immigration I have read a lot about the projected demographics for the UK and Europe and it is frightening reading. Whoever the politico was on Sky News this morning calling for a halt on immigration was being very disingenuous because all Government ministers know the figures, why do you think the Tory's who have always been anti-immigrant have done nothing about it, just paid lip service to cutting down on immigration. Why do German ministers rue not letting the East Europeans in in 2003 and say that Britain stole a march on them. You might not like it Merv and I certainly don't but no Government is going to stop immigration not even if UKIP came to power. Howie'
  • Score: 0

2:45pm Mon 27 Aug 12

Cwmderi says...

When immigration is the hot topic and contributors start by referring to immigrants as "These People". It immediately sets out their anti immigration (UKIP) attitudes.
I spent some time in India last year in the company of a Sikh tour manager, which I found to be educational, enlightening and informative, especially about the history and culture of Sikhism and their warrior beliefs and practices.
Over the years many Sikhs have chosen to move to Wales and the UK to set up new lives for themselves and should be welcomed with open arms. For had it not been for the Sikhs and others from India and the rest of the then British Empire who stood shoulder to shoulder with Britain in the two world wars, we would not have the democracy or freedoms that we have today.
As a small example of the sacrifices, suffering and contributions that Sikhs made for Britain and the world, I quote the words of General Sir Frank Messervy. KCSI..KBE. CB. DSO;
"In the last two World Wars 83,005 turban wearing Sikh soldiers were killed and 109,045 wounded. They all died or were wounded for the freedom of Britain and the world"
Enough said.
When immigration is the hot topic and contributors start by referring to immigrants as "These People". It immediately sets out their anti immigration (UKIP) attitudes. I spent some time in India last year in the company of a Sikh tour manager, which I found to be educational, enlightening and informative, especially about the history and culture of Sikhism and their warrior beliefs and practices. Over the years many Sikhs have chosen to move to Wales and the UK to set up new lives for themselves and should be welcomed with open arms. For had it not been for the Sikhs and others from India and the rest of the then British Empire who stood shoulder to shoulder with Britain in the two world wars, we would not have the democracy or freedoms that we have today. As a small example of the sacrifices, suffering and contributions that Sikhs made for Britain and the world, I quote the words of General Sir Frank Messervy. KCSI..KBE. CB. DSO; "In the last two World Wars 83,005 turban wearing Sikh soldiers were killed and 109,045 wounded. They all died or were wounded for the freedom of Britain and the world" Enough said. Cwmderi
  • Score: 0

4:50pm Mon 27 Aug 12

chris227 says...

all the qualified people leave the country all the benfit scroungers come to the country
all the qualified people leave the country all the benfit scroungers come to the country chris227
  • Score: 0

11:27pm Mon 27 Aug 12

Howie' says...

chris227 wrote:
all the qualified people leave the country all the benfit scroungers come to the country
But we all know Chris you will not supply any evidence of that just like your claim that 80% of Somalis are on disability, just plucking unsubstantiated comments out of the air.
[quote][p][bold]chris227[/bold] wrote: all the qualified people leave the country all the benfit scroungers come to the country[/p][/quote]But we all know Chris you will not supply any evidence of that just like your claim that 80% of Somalis are on disability, just plucking unsubstantiated comments out of the air. Howie'
  • Score: 0

10:22am Tue 28 Aug 12

Mervyn James says...

Cwmderi wrote:
When immigration is the hot topic and contributors start by referring to immigrants as "These People". It immediately sets out their anti immigration (UKIP) attitudes.
I spent some time in India last year in the company of a Sikh tour manager, which I found to be educational, enlightening and informative, especially about the history and culture of Sikhism and their warrior beliefs and practices.
Over the years many Sikhs have chosen to move to Wales and the UK to set up new lives for themselves and should be welcomed with open arms. For had it not been for the Sikhs and others from India and the rest of the then British Empire who stood shoulder to shoulder with Britain in the two world wars, we would not have the democracy or freedoms that we have today.
As a small example of the sacrifices, suffering and contributions that Sikhs made for Britain and the world, I quote the words of General Sir Frank Messervy. KCSI..KBE. CB. DSO;
"In the last two World Wars 83,005 turban wearing Sikh soldiers were killed and 109,045 wounded. They all died or were wounded for the freedom of Britain and the world"
Enough said.
From what I see most of the problem is emanating from Europe not outside it. Once we opened the floodgates to Europe we were swamped, and they keep coming. I've a lot of empathy with those who fought with us,including the Gurkhas who were treated appallingly and earned a right to come here. All these eastern bloc countries are at the root of a lot of it, and we are supporting those countries up via benefits from here to their families who have never set foot in the UK. But all presumably with the right to come if they want. Cameron demands those OUTSIDE Europe must show adequate qualifications and a standard of English knowledge, but cannot do the same with the Europeans who display the bulk of the problem..
[quote][p][bold]Cwmderi[/bold] wrote: When immigration is the hot topic and contributors start by referring to immigrants as "These People". It immediately sets out their anti immigration (UKIP) attitudes. I spent some time in India last year in the company of a Sikh tour manager, which I found to be educational, enlightening and informative, especially about the history and culture of Sikhism and their warrior beliefs and practices. Over the years many Sikhs have chosen to move to Wales and the UK to set up new lives for themselves and should be welcomed with open arms. For had it not been for the Sikhs and others from India and the rest of the then British Empire who stood shoulder to shoulder with Britain in the two world wars, we would not have the democracy or freedoms that we have today. As a small example of the sacrifices, suffering and contributions that Sikhs made for Britain and the world, I quote the words of General Sir Frank Messervy. KCSI..KBE. CB. DSO; "In the last two World Wars 83,005 turban wearing Sikh soldiers were killed and 109,045 wounded. They all died or were wounded for the freedom of Britain and the world" Enough said.[/p][/quote]From what I see most of the problem is emanating from Europe not outside it. Once we opened the floodgates to Europe we were swamped, and they keep coming. I've a lot of empathy with those who fought with us,including the Gurkhas who were treated appallingly and earned a right to come here. All these eastern bloc countries are at the root of a lot of it, and we are supporting those countries up via benefits from here to their families who have never set foot in the UK. But all presumably with the right to come if they want. Cameron demands those OUTSIDE Europe must show adequate qualifications and a standard of English knowledge, but cannot do the same with the Europeans who display the bulk of the problem.. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

11:46pm Tue 28 Aug 12

Howie' says...

Most Europeans have a good command of English Merv, unlike the Brits who think the whole world should speak English so they don't have to learn any other language.

Once we opened the floodgates to Europe we were swamped, and they keep coming.

545,00 Polish in the UK.............2 Million Polish in Germany.
Most Europeans have a good command of English Merv, unlike the Brits who think the whole world should speak English so they don't have to learn any other language. Once we opened the floodgates to Europe we were swamped, and they keep coming. 545,00 Polish in the UK.............2 Million Polish in Germany. Howie'
  • Score: 0

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