A lesson from history

First published in Letters

FOLLOWING on from Wayne Thomas in the letters page on the 15th January, I have followed the news on television and in newspapers for a while, and have noted the similarities between the government’s policies and its attempt to justify them, to the way that Hitler came to power and maintained that power for a number of years. The systematic way in which the coalition uses newspapers and television to perpetrate their idea that there is a race problem, union problem, an old person problem, disabled problem, European problem.

Setting one group of the population against another seems to be the way that this coalition is determined to create strife and disorder in order to put their policies into the statute book. There is never a bankers’ problem, management problem and financial problem that is deemed serious enough to require legislation. We cannot allow this, the most right-wing government that has ever come to power in Britain, to create a country of embitterment and jealousy.

W.D. Gange Greenhill Road Pontypool

Comments (28)

Please log in to enable comment sorting

3:34pm Mon 21 Jan 13

P C Neilson says...

It can seem that way and it is easy to make comparisons that might lead us to the wrong ideas about government. Even though it's not exactly what we might imagine a democratic government, what we have here is far from a secret fascist regime that uses mind control via the media.

Letting things slide such as union rights and local issues is our own fault to a certain extent. We rely on authority to get it right, so we don't have to take any interest ourselves, when the reality is that they will seldom come to decisions that reflect our desires. It seems to me that the only thing we can do is keep being vocal in our opposition, and support lobbyists that match our views.

I don't think that there is freedom to demonstrate like their should be, (this is the way it might end up) and nobody wants to hurt their lively-hood and social standing by getting roughed up by the police on the picket line and possibly getting a criminal record out of it. Myself included.

I admire those that are willing to do so, and I think we must support them. I'm not even sure that the 'average joe' is capable of making pragmatic decisions, my confidence in public opinion is regularly shaken, but then that is because I have my own bias, as do the men and women running the country. But this is normal and what we should expect of our fellow mammals.

Rich and influential people seldom get the same brand of justice that mere 'plebs' do, and blame shifting is still a good way to pull attention away from the public eye, and muddy the issues.

This government is guilty of lots of unnecessary injustices, and I agree it 'has' to go. In it's place I think we need 'new blood' where it counts. The last generation are doing a terrible job (no offence). That's what I think anyway.
It can seem that way and it is easy to make comparisons that might lead us to the wrong ideas about government. Even though it's not exactly what we might imagine a democratic government, what we have here is far from a secret fascist regime that uses mind control via the media. Letting things slide such as union rights and local issues is our own fault to a certain extent. We rely on authority to get it right, so we don't have to take any interest ourselves, when the reality is that they will seldom come to decisions that reflect our desires. It seems to me that the only thing we can do is keep being vocal in our opposition, and support lobbyists that match our views. I don't think that there is freedom to demonstrate like their should be, (this is the way it might end up) and nobody wants to hurt their lively-hood and social standing by getting roughed up by the police on the picket line and possibly getting a criminal record out of it. Myself included. I admire those that are willing to do so, and I think we must support them. I'm not even sure that the 'average joe' is capable of making pragmatic decisions, my confidence in public opinion is regularly shaken, but then that is because I have my own bias, as do the men and women running the country. But this is normal and what we should expect of our fellow mammals. Rich and influential people seldom get the same brand of justice that mere 'plebs' do, and blame shifting is still a good way to pull attention away from the public eye, and muddy the issues. This government is guilty of lots of unnecessary injustices, and I agree it 'has' to go. In it's place I think we need 'new blood' where it counts. The last generation are doing a terrible job (no offence). That's what I think anyway. P C Neilson
  • Score: 0

7:31pm Mon 21 Jan 13

Mervyn James says...

"The systematic way in which the coalition uses newspapers and television to perpetrate their idea that there is a race problem, union problem, an old person problem, disabled problem, European problem."

Basically it is a 'divide and rule' tactic, by setting everyone against each other via 'blame' they neatly divert attention away from the fact THEY are the problem. Everyone is a fraud, everyone is denying everyone else fair play, especially the sick, the old, and vulnerable, and the elderly living too long. The tories are Hitlers children..
"The systematic way in which the coalition uses newspapers and television to perpetrate their idea that there is a race problem, union problem, an old person problem, disabled problem, European problem." Basically it is a 'divide and rule' tactic, by setting everyone against each other via 'blame' they neatly divert attention away from the fact THEY are the problem. Everyone is a fraud, everyone is denying everyone else fair play, especially the sick, the old, and vulnerable, and the elderly living too long. The tories are Hitlers children.. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

7:31pm Mon 21 Jan 13

Mervyn James says...

"The systematic way in which the coalition uses newspapers and television to perpetrate their idea that there is a race problem, union problem, an old person problem, disabled problem, European problem."

Basically it is a 'divide and rule' tactic, by setting everyone against each other via 'blame' they neatly divert attention away from the fact THEY are the problem. Everyone is a fraud, everyone is denying everyone else fair play, especially the sick, the old, and vulnerable, and the elderly living too long. The tories are Hitlers children..
"The systematic way in which the coalition uses newspapers and television to perpetrate their idea that there is a race problem, union problem, an old person problem, disabled problem, European problem." Basically it is a 'divide and rule' tactic, by setting everyone against each other via 'blame' they neatly divert attention away from the fact THEY are the problem. Everyone is a fraud, everyone is denying everyone else fair play, especially the sick, the old, and vulnerable, and the elderly living too long. The tories are Hitlers children.. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

7:41pm Mon 21 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

What a lot of paranoid drivel. We've never had so much scrutiny, democracy, social media, investigative journalism, public enquiries, appeals after appeals to the point where government is almost paralysed by debate. Yes, people tend to use emotive language but that goes both ways. To listen to some socialist commentators, anyone who's ever had a job in the City is a crook/tax evader/greedy champagne swilling moron. This despite the fact that their contribution to UK plc is massive compared to most of the population. And any government that thinks it's fine to set a benefit cap for healthy adults at £26K (tax free), lose control of our borders, increase the foreign aid budget to over £15 Billion, is no way right wing. Not even close.
What a lot of paranoid drivel. We've never had so much scrutiny, democracy, social media, investigative journalism, public enquiries, appeals after appeals to the point where government is almost paralysed by debate. Yes, people tend to use emotive language but that goes both ways. To listen to some socialist commentators, anyone who's ever had a job in the City is a crook/tax evader/greedy champagne swilling moron. This despite the fact that their contribution to UK plc is massive compared to most of the population. And any government that thinks it's fine to set a benefit cap for healthy adults at £26K (tax free), lose control of our borders, increase the foreign aid budget to over £15 Billion, is no way right wing. Not even close. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

8:06am Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

In the past year or so, we seem to be being fed 'misinformation' by the government attacking certain sections of society and sadly the more gulible are following for it. The following have been attacked, and some continue to be attacked and demonised:

The Unemployed - for not having a job.

Public Sector workers - for having a job

Builders - for cash in hand jobs

The low paid - for claiming tax credits

Pregnant women- who only get pregnant for tax credits

The EEC - for red tape ie: peoples employment rights

But no mention of the Banks, tax dodgers in the city, Vodafone Tory Donars, you get what I mean.
In the past year or so, we seem to be being fed 'misinformation' by the government attacking certain sections of society and sadly the more gulible are following for it. The following have been attacked, and some continue to be attacked and demonised: The Unemployed - for not having a job. Public Sector workers - for having a job Builders - for cash in hand jobs The low paid - for claiming tax credits Pregnant women- who only get pregnant for tax credits The EEC - for red tape ie: peoples employment rights But no mention of the Banks, tax dodgers in the city, Vodafone Tory Donars, you get what I mean. Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

8:10am Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness.

I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past.
And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness. I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past. Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

9:38am Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Mr Angry wrote:
And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness.

I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past.
This: From the Guardian in October
Disability charities have given a cautious welcome to a government announcement that more claimants are receiving maximum, unconditional disability benefit payments, the apparent result of ongoing improvements to the testing system.

The percentage of new claimants receiving unconditional Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) payments has doubled since May 2010, the quarterly statistical release from the Department for Work and Pensions showed.
The quarterly statistical release showed that 54% of new claimants assessed were found to be able to work, while 46% were eligible for the benefit. Those eligible for payments fall into two categories – 26% were put into the support group, classified as too ill or disabled to work. In May 2010, just 10%-11% of claimants were put into this group.

Twenty percent of claimants were put into the work-related activity group, which means they are currently assessed as too ill or disabled to work, but will be expected to have regular Jobcentre meetings to start preparing them for an eventual return to work.

So is your point that we should just go on paying it to people for ever without ever checking if their condition has changed?
[quote][p][bold]Mr Angry[/bold] wrote: And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness. I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past.[/p][/quote]This: From the Guardian in October Disability charities have given a cautious welcome to a government announcement that more claimants are receiving maximum, unconditional disability benefit payments, the apparent result of ongoing improvements to the testing system. The percentage of new claimants receiving unconditional Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) payments has doubled since May 2010, the quarterly statistical release from the Department for Work and Pensions showed. The quarterly statistical release showed that 54% of new claimants assessed were found to be able to work, while 46% were eligible for the benefit. Those eligible for payments fall into two categories – 26% were put into the support group, classified as too ill or disabled to work. In May 2010, just 10%-11% of claimants were put into this group. Twenty percent of claimants were put into the work-related activity group, which means they are currently assessed as too ill or disabled to work, but will be expected to have regular Jobcentre meetings to start preparing them for an eventual return to work. So is your point that we should just go on paying it to people for ever without ever checking if their condition has changed? Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

9:59am Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

The Guy died after being declared fit for work for Christs sake !!!!!
The Guy died after being declared fit for work for Christs sake !!!!! Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

10:07am Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

People have died walking out of hospital having been told they are fine. A tragic mistake but that doesn't alter the basic premise that once someone becomes unfit for work due to illness, they always remain that way. All medical conditions change, some are unpredictable. If we continue to pay disability benefit forever to everyone who develops a medical condition then no-one will be working at all. As a result of the assessments, twice as many people are now being supported.
People have died walking out of hospital having been told they are fine. A tragic mistake but that doesn't alter the basic premise that once someone becomes unfit for work due to illness, they always remain that way. All medical conditions change, some are unpredictable. If we continue to pay disability benefit forever to everyone who develops a medical condition then no-one will be working at all. As a result of the assessments, twice as many people are now being supported. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

10:19am Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

Why dont we just bring build a few gas chambers, then maybe you and Gorbels (duncan smith) will be happy
Why dont we just bring build a few gas chambers, then maybe you and Gorbels (duncan smith) will be happy Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

10:21am Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

I kind of figured that, faced with facts, you'd resort to abuse.
I kind of figured that, faced with facts, you'd resort to abuse. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

10:41am Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

No mate, its you that think that the demonisation of the sick ( who have already been examined by GPs) and the terminally ill are malingering.

You should be ashamed
No mate, its you that think that the demonisation of the sick ( who have already been examined by GPs) and the terminally ill are malingering. You should be ashamed Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

10:57am Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

I never once mentioned malingering. It isn't a GP that determines 'disability' for payment of benefit and never was. Most GPs are unaware of how to manage chronic conditions which is why specialists exist. I would actually pay genuinely disabled people more than they currently get but you can only do that by reviewing cases where it is paid that might improve and can therefore be stopped. No two conditions are the same.
I never once mentioned malingering. It isn't a GP that determines 'disability' for payment of benefit and never was. Most GPs are unaware of how to manage chronic conditions which is why specialists exist. I would actually pay genuinely disabled people more than they currently get but you can only do that by reviewing cases where it is paid that might improve and can therefore be stopped. No two conditions are the same. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

11:01am Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

And who in the name of Christ said anything about the 'terminally ill'? You've resorted to making it up as you go along.
And who in the name of Christ said anything about the 'terminally ill'? You've resorted to making it up as you go along. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

12:50pm Tue 22 Jan 13

Mr Angry says...

There have also been cases of terminaliy ill people such as cancer sufferers being declared 'fit for work' .

There have been many articles regarding this.
There have also been cases of terminaliy ill people such as cancer sufferers being declared 'fit for work' . There have been many articles regarding this. Mr Angry
  • Score: 0

3:06pm Tue 22 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Mr Angry wrote:
No mate, its you that think that the demonisation of the sick ( who have already been examined by GPs) and the terminally ill are malingering.

You should be ashamed
Errr, no! Can you quote where I 'demonised' anybody or made any remark regarding 'terminally ill'? I merely think that anyone who's disability isn't obviously permanent should be regularly reviewed. Everything else you made up.
[quote][p][bold]Mr Angry[/bold] wrote: No mate, its you that think that the demonisation of the sick ( who have already been examined by GPs) and the terminally ill are malingering. You should be ashamed[/p][/quote]Errr, no! Can you quote where I 'demonised' anybody or made any remark regarding 'terminally ill'? I merely think that anyone who's disability isn't obviously permanent should be regularly reviewed. Everything else you made up. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

11:17am Wed 23 Jan 13

Mervyn James says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Mr Angry wrote:
And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness.

I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past.
This: From the Guardian in October
Disability charities have given a cautious welcome to a government announcement that more claimants are receiving maximum, unconditional disability benefit payments, the apparent result of ongoing improvements to the testing system.

The percentage of new claimants receiving unconditional Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) payments has doubled since May 2010, the quarterly statistical release from the Department for Work and Pensions showed.
The quarterly statistical release showed that 54% of new claimants assessed were found to be able to work, while 46% were eligible for the benefit. Those eligible for payments fall into two categories – 26% were put into the support group, classified as too ill or disabled to work. In May 2010, just 10%-11% of claimants were put into this group.

Twenty percent of claimants were put into the work-related activity group, which means they are currently assessed as too ill or disabled to work, but will be expected to have regular Jobcentre meetings to start preparing them for an eventual return to work.

So is your point that we should just go on paying it to people for ever without ever checking if their condition has changed?
I think quoting the Guardian blew it, they aren't a social savvy as they make out.m They have been forced to make 3 public newspaper apologies for getting disabilty articles wrong. Frankly we are all mushrooms, that is, kept in the dark and fed.....
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mr Angry[/bold] wrote: And not forgetting the sick and disabled. There was a person examined by atos and declared fit for work, the day after he died form his illness. I hope that those who labled him scrounger feel proud especially that Dunacn Smith, who by the way has been a dole scrounger himself in the past.[/p][/quote]This: From the Guardian in October Disability charities have given a cautious welcome to a government announcement that more claimants are receiving maximum, unconditional disability benefit payments, the apparent result of ongoing improvements to the testing system. The percentage of new claimants receiving unconditional Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) payments has doubled since May 2010, the quarterly statistical release from the Department for Work and Pensions showed. The quarterly statistical release showed that 54% of new claimants assessed were found to be able to work, while 46% were eligible for the benefit. Those eligible for payments fall into two categories – 26% were put into the support group, classified as too ill or disabled to work. In May 2010, just 10%-11% of claimants were put into this group. Twenty percent of claimants were put into the work-related activity group, which means they are currently assessed as too ill or disabled to work, but will be expected to have regular Jobcentre meetings to start preparing them for an eventual return to work. So is your point that we should just go on paying it to people for ever without ever checking if their condition has changed?[/p][/quote]I think quoting the Guardian blew it, they aren't a social savvy as they make out.m They have been forced to make 3 public newspaper apologies for getting disabilty articles wrong. Frankly we are all mushrooms, that is, kept in the dark and fed..... Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

1:55pm Wed 23 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

I know Mervyn. Had I quoted the same text from The Times or Telegrapgh, Howie would have griped. Had I used the DWP official press release it would have been 'government propoganda'. I decided not to bother with Al Jazeera either as it was just too far flung. Surely there must be a Welsh Language publication read by 6 people and a bilingual hamster that has an authentic take on it?
I know Mervyn. Had I quoted the same text from The Times or Telegrapgh, Howie would have griped. Had I used the DWP official press release it would have been 'government propoganda'. I decided not to bother with Al Jazeera either as it was just too far flung. Surely there must be a Welsh Language publication read by 6 people and a bilingual hamster that has an authentic take on it? Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

3:02pm Wed 23 Jan 13

P C Neilson says...

Haha! Sarcasm much? On that topic, I was speaking to someone yesterday that has stopped buying a certain tabloid paper that we were discussing on here, because of a trend they had noticed for promoting hatred of benefits claimants (yes that person has disability allowance).

I agree that social background and situation has a lot to do with what view we are likely to agree with, the media is a lifeline to finding out what is going on in the world where direct experience is not possible.

We can only arm ourselves with cognitive tools on how to work out what is likely to be true, if I find myself strongly disagreeing with something, it is sometimes helpful for me to scrutinise why.

I realise that we are at the mercy of how accurate or objective the reports are and I try to keep this in mind.

Maybe scepticism is not a natural tool that has much use in day to day life. Maybe scepticism has a negative definition to some.

I'll gladly take conspiracy theories and warped public opinion from time to time in exchange for freedom of expression.
Haha! Sarcasm much? On that topic, I was speaking to someone yesterday that has stopped buying a certain tabloid paper that we were discussing on here, because of a trend they had noticed for promoting hatred of benefits claimants (yes that person has disability allowance). I agree that social background and situation has a lot to do with what view we are likely to agree with, the media is a lifeline to finding out what is going on in the world where direct experience is not possible. We can only arm ourselves with cognitive tools on how to work out what is likely to be true, if I find myself strongly disagreeing with something, it is sometimes helpful for me to scrutinise why. I realise that we are at the mercy of how accurate or objective the reports are and I try to keep this in mind. Maybe scepticism is not a natural tool that has much use in day to day life. Maybe scepticism has a negative definition to some. I'll gladly take conspiracy theories and warped public opinion from time to time in exchange for freedom of expression. P C Neilson
  • Score: 0

3:43pm Thu 24 Jan 13

Howie' says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
I know Mervyn. Had I quoted the same text from The Times or Telegrapgh, Howie would have griped. Had I used the DWP official press release it would have been 'government propoganda'. I decided not to bother with Al Jazeera either as it was just too far flung. Surely there must be a Welsh Language publication read by 6 people and a bilingual hamster that has an authentic take on it?
Very good, I enjoyed that.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: I know Mervyn. Had I quoted the same text from The Times or Telegrapgh, Howie would have griped. Had I used the DWP official press release it would have been 'government propoganda'. I decided not to bother with Al Jazeera either as it was just too far flung. Surely there must be a Welsh Language publication read by 6 people and a bilingual hamster that has an authentic take on it?[/p][/quote]Very good, I enjoyed that. Howie'
  • Score: 0

7:17pm Thu 24 Jan 13

Independentvoter says...

It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system.
It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system. Independentvoter
  • Score: 0

7:46pm Thu 24 Jan 13

Independentvoter says...

Llanmartinangel,

You say that disabled people should be routinely scrutinised for their 'rightful claims to benefit' then you state;

"People have died walking out of hospitals having been told they are fine".

Once again, I dont understand your point.
Llanmartinangel, You say that disabled people should be routinely scrutinised for their 'rightful claims to benefit' then you state; "People have died walking out of hospitals having been told they are fine". Once again, I dont understand your point. Independentvoter
  • Score: 0

9:08am Fri 25 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

Independentvoter wrote:
Llanmartinangel,

You say that disabled people should be routinely scrutinised for their 'rightful claims to benefit' then you state;

"People have died walking out of hospitals having been told they are fine".

Once again, I dont understand your point.
You clearly haven't read the entire thread. Mr Angry quoted a case of a guy dying after an examination by Atos. Medical assessment, as much as we would like it to, cannot be 100% reliable in all cases. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do it. We should strive for better but perfection in medical matters is a pipe-dream. That's all I was saying.
[quote][p][bold]Independentvoter[/bold] wrote: Llanmartinangel, You say that disabled people should be routinely scrutinised for their 'rightful claims to benefit' then you state; "People have died walking out of hospitals having been told they are fine". Once again, I dont understand your point.[/p][/quote]You clearly haven't read the entire thread. Mr Angry quoted a case of a guy dying after an examination by Atos. Medical assessment, as much as we would like it to, cannot be 100% reliable in all cases. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do it. We should strive for better but perfection in medical matters is a pipe-dream. That's all I was saying. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

8:12pm Fri 25 Jan 13

welshmen says...

Most of you are doing what the Government want you to do, that is to argue between each other, lean either left or right, what matters is us, we the people have to find the correct way to get this country back to a world leader in industry, some say disabled and others should be reviewed to cut or stop there benefits, nothing wrong with that only it has to be fair and unbiased.
Most of the Cabinet have never had a " proper job" yet they have the ordacity to tell us there way is the only way to save our country, well as we all know none of them have it in them to save our country, the evil or disease that kills any permanent recovery is "fractional banking" the bankers charge the Government interest on money they "Borrow to keep our economy growing, that's not working in fact we are going backwards.
We need a Government who have the COURAGE to print it's own money and tell the bankers to keep there money and there interest rates.Government are allowed to print it's own money as long it is honoured, it worked for Abraham Lincoln, the "green back" ie one dollar bill,it will work for us, we are told we need lots of houses, the Government can get all of or construction workers back to work, print the money to pay the workers, don't borrow it of the bankers,and the Government can fund other developments in all aspects of business, the cost to private borrowers would be 10% of the money + admin fee, the money would be loaned in stage payments and repaid the same, our disabled, pensioners, young and old alike could live a better life, job centers could be a thing of the past....
one of the Richest Bankers has a personnel wealth of around £500 trillion Dollars,that's Rothschild....
Most of you are doing what the Government want you to do, that is to argue between each other, lean either left or right, what matters is us, we the people have to find the correct way to get this country back to a world leader in industry, some say disabled and others should be reviewed to cut or stop there benefits, nothing wrong with that only it has to be fair and unbiased. Most of the Cabinet have never had a " proper job" yet they have the ordacity to tell us there way is the only way to save our country, well as we all know none of them have it in them to save our country, the evil or disease that kills any permanent recovery is "fractional banking" the bankers charge the Government interest on money they "Borrow to keep our economy growing, that's not working in fact we are going backwards. We need a Government who have the COURAGE to print it's own money and tell the bankers to keep there money and there interest rates.Government are allowed to print it's own money as long it is honoured, it worked for Abraham Lincoln, the "green back" ie one dollar bill,it will work for us, we are told we need lots of houses, the Government can get all of or construction workers back to work, print the money to pay the workers, don't borrow it of the bankers,and the Government can fund other developments in all aspects of business, the cost to private borrowers would be 10% of the money + admin fee, the money would be loaned in stage payments and repaid the same, our disabled, pensioners, young and old alike could live a better life, job centers could be a thing of the past.... one of the Richest Bankers has a personnel wealth of around £500 trillion Dollars,that's Rothschild.... welshmen
  • Score: 0

9:06am Mon 28 Jan 13

Mervyn James says...

Independentvoter wrote:
It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system.
It is the people quoting from red tops and other printed toilet rolls filled with disinformation. If they want details I can give them the official DWP website and 28 disability areas who have taken the whole thing apart line by line. Basically the DLA stops, PIP starts and the assessment assume everyone is lying and you have to prove differently. They foresee challenges will bring the PIP process to a halt, albeit 300K with hearing loss getting DLA will not get any benefit is the present claim.
[quote][p][bold]Independentvoter[/bold] wrote: It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system.[/p][/quote]It is the people quoting from red tops and other printed toilet rolls filled with disinformation. If they want details I can give them the official DWP website and 28 disability areas who have taken the whole thing apart line by line. Basically the DLA stops, PIP starts and the assessment assume everyone is lying and you have to prove differently. They foresee challenges will bring the PIP process to a halt, albeit 300K with hearing loss getting DLA will not get any benefit is the present claim. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

12:33pm Mon 28 Jan 13

coalpicker says...

There are great minds contributing to
these posts. Perhaps one could answer
the question, if some one were to die as
a result of an illness or a disability they
had been claiming for but which benefit
had subsequently been denied them ,
because of the terms of reference being
in operation used by the medical professional ( get them off benefit regardless) would the family of the deceased have a winnable case in
law against the Medic for incompetence or negligence and or
the government , or will the medical professional bomb proof status be applied,giving government the same protection ? Would be an interesting
case for the jackals feeding and getting fat on human rights issues .
There are great minds contributing to these posts. Perhaps one could answer the question, if some one were to die as a result of an illness or a disability they had been claiming for but which benefit had subsequently been denied them , because of the terms of reference being in operation used by the medical professional ( get them off benefit regardless) would the family of the deceased have a winnable case in law against the Medic for incompetence or negligence and or the government , or will the medical professional bomb proof status be applied,giving government the same protection ? Would be an interesting case for the jackals feeding and getting fat on human rights issues . coalpicker
  • Score: 0

12:59pm Mon 28 Jan 13

Llanmartinangel says...

coalpicker wrote:
There are great minds contributing to
these posts. Perhaps one could answer
the question, if some one were to die as
a result of an illness or a disability they
had been claiming for but which benefit
had subsequently been denied them ,
because of the terms of reference being
in operation used by the medical professional ( get them off benefit regardless) would the family of the deceased have a winnable case in
law against the Medic for incompetence or negligence and or
the government , or will the medical professional bomb proof status be applied,giving government the same protection ? Would be an interesting
case for the jackals feeding and getting fat on human rights issues .
Are you referring to the same 'medical profession' who treat you at your GP and in hospitals? I repeat, medicine isn't as exact a science as people would like. A landlord of a pub I use went to A&E complaining of headaches. After a thorough exam and a scan he went back to work, having being told there was nothing that could be found. He died of a stroke later that day. His family are quite sure it could not have been foreseen.Doctors are extremely risk averse and most, despite your views to the contrary, are caring. To say they would just arbitrarily do the government's bidding for the hell of it seems like conspiracy theory to me. There is always the alternative that some of you seem to be suggesting, of course: That once we start paying disability benefit we pay it for life, regardless of the possibility or likelihood of improvement, new effective treatment or recovery.
[quote][p][bold]coalpicker[/bold] wrote: There are great minds contributing to these posts. Perhaps one could answer the question, if some one were to die as a result of an illness or a disability they had been claiming for but which benefit had subsequently been denied them , because of the terms of reference being in operation used by the medical professional ( get them off benefit regardless) would the family of the deceased have a winnable case in law against the Medic for incompetence or negligence and or the government , or will the medical professional bomb proof status be applied,giving government the same protection ? Would be an interesting case for the jackals feeding and getting fat on human rights issues .[/p][/quote]Are you referring to the same 'medical profession' who treat you at your GP and in hospitals? I repeat, medicine isn't as exact a science as people would like. A landlord of a pub I use went to A&E complaining of headaches. After a thorough exam and a scan he went back to work, having being told there was nothing that could be found. He died of a stroke later that day. His family are quite sure it could not have been foreseen.Doctors are extremely risk averse and most, despite your views to the contrary, are caring. To say they would just arbitrarily do the government's bidding for the hell of it seems like conspiracy theory to me. There is always the alternative that some of you seem to be suggesting, of course: That once we start paying disability benefit we pay it for life, regardless of the possibility or likelihood of improvement, new effective treatment or recovery. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 0

1:46pm Mon 28 Jan 13

whatintheworld says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Independentvoter wrote: It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system.
It is the people quoting from red tops and other printed toilet rolls filled with disinformation. If they want details I can give them the official DWP website and 28 disability areas who have taken the whole thing apart line by line. Basically the DLA stops, PIP starts and the assessment assume everyone is lying and you have to prove differently. They foresee challenges will bring the PIP process to a halt, albeit 300K with hearing loss getting DLA will not get any benefit is the present claim.
it's re-assuring knowing this website isn't full of complete numptys. thanks mervyn!
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Independentvoter[/bold] wrote: It is quite obvious that some posters on here haven't got a clue about disabled people, disabilities or the current PIP benefit system.[/p][/quote]It is the people quoting from red tops and other printed toilet rolls filled with disinformation. If they want details I can give them the official DWP website and 28 disability areas who have taken the whole thing apart line by line. Basically the DLA stops, PIP starts and the assessment assume everyone is lying and you have to prove differently. They foresee challenges will bring the PIP process to a halt, albeit 300K with hearing loss getting DLA will not get any benefit is the present claim.[/p][/quote]it's re-assuring knowing this website isn't full of complete numptys. thanks mervyn! whatintheworld
  • Score: 0

Comments are closed on this article.

Send us your news, pictures and videos

Most read stories

Local Info

Enter your postcode, town or place name

About cookies

We want you to enjoy your visit to our website. That's why we use cookies to enhance your experience. By staying on our website you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more about the cookies we use.

I agree