Ebbw Vale benefit cheat falsely claimed £70,000

Katie Stroud leaving Cardiff Crown Court

Katie Stroud leaving Cardiff Crown Court

First published in News
Last updated

A BENEFITS cheat who falsely claimed more than £70,000 escaped going to prison.

Katie Stroud, 35, of Cendl Crescent, Ebbw Vale, was found out after a tip-off from a neighbour.

When Blaenau Gwent Council officers visited the house she claimed to be living in, they found only a kettle in the kitchen.

They conducted surveillance on the house on Bevan Crescent and only saw her go to the house once in three weeks.

Judge Thomas Crowther QC said: “Cheats are corrosive to the benefits system. People resent paying money which is paid out to the undeserving, and people feeling resentful wrongly categorise genuine claimants as undeserving. Furthermore, of course, money is diverted from the needy.”

He accepted Stroud’s initial claim for working tax credits in 2003 had been legitimate but said “things went wrong for you after that, badly so.”

The court heard Stroud had suffered family tragedy, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.

Judge Crowther said the fact which stopped him imposing a prison term was because she is a carer.

Stroud was found guilty at Gwent Magistrates’ Court of failing to notify a change in circumstances affecting benefit payments, which allowed her to falsely claim housing benefit and council tax benefit for a house on Honeyfield Road and later Bevan Crescent in Rassau, when she was actually living with her mother.

She then pleaded guilty to a further six counts of failing to disclose changes in circumstances, which allowed her to falsely claim Working Tax Credits, Income Support and Employment Support Allowance.

The first claim after she should have notified the authorities of a change in circumstance was made in July 2003 and the offending went on until September 2012, Cardiff Crown Court heard.

Stroud wrongly obtained £48,545.95 in working tax credits, £5,705.54 in Council Tax benefit and £16,241.68 in housing benefit, a court heard.

As the houses were owned by the local authority, housing benefit was paid back to the council.

Hywel Hughes, defending, said considering this and the fact the defendant was working for some of the time she claimed working tax credits so would have been entitled to some benefits, the total loss to the public purse was around £48,000.

Stroud was given suspended prison sentences of 12 months for each offence. She was also given a condition of 12 months supervision.

Comments (135)

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7:35am Mon 3 Feb 14

rightsideup says...

Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!.
Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!. rightsideup
  • Score: 40

8:06am Mon 3 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

rightsideup wrote:
Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!.
More to the point, will still be eligible to claim benefits.
[quote][p][bold]rightsideup[/bold] wrote: Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!.[/p][/quote]More to the point, will still be eligible to claim benefits. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 33

8:17am Mon 3 Feb 14

Bobevans says...

AS usual no real punishment. The judges comments in my view are daft ,"as the house was owned by the local council the Housing benefit went to the Council" Well she deprived some one of that social home .
AS usual no real punishment. The judges comments in my view are daft ,"as the house was owned by the local council the Housing benefit went to the Council" Well she deprived some one of that social home . Bobevans
  • Score: 38

8:37am Mon 3 Feb 14

Woodgnome says...

She has stolen from everyone who pays tax. Where does she think her benefits come from?
She has stolen from everyone who pays tax. Where does she think her benefits come from? Woodgnome
  • Score: 33

11:08am Mon 3 Feb 14

davidcp says...

If I stole that much I'd go to prison, because I work in a 'position of responsibility'.
As usual, the 'one law for the rich' theory actually REVERSES with benefit cheats!
If I stole that much I'd go to prison, because I work in a 'position of responsibility'. As usual, the 'one law for the rich' theory actually REVERSES with benefit cheats! davidcp
  • Score: 36

12:47pm Mon 3 Feb 14

kez1968 says...

she has post traumatic stress, was that before or after they caught her? oh living with her mother and shes a carer, so I bet she was having full housing benefit for the house she didn't need oh I might add stopping a more deserving family living there, carer allowance for her Mam, and most likely full disability for her ailments, she must have been minted, don't feel sorry for her, she robbed all us taxpayers and should have been sent down.
she has post traumatic stress, was that before or after they caught her? oh living with her mother and shes a carer, so I bet she was having full housing benefit for the house she didn't need oh I might add stopping a more deserving family living there, carer allowance for her Mam, and most likely full disability for her ailments, she must have been minted, don't feel sorry for her, she robbed all us taxpayers and should have been sent down. kez1968
  • Score: 31

1:03pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Abertillery29 says...

What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother. Abertillery29
  • Score: 23

1:08pm Mon 3 Feb 14

richie55 says...

Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop??? richie55
  • Score: 15

2:29pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
[quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question. Dai Rear
  • Score: 7

2:31pm Mon 3 Feb 14

dinnerlady52 says...

What is the point of again wasting tax payers money by taking these people to court if they are not going to be punished. She knew what she was doing and again excuses were made to cover them up. The law and courts are an **** and show no deterrent to others, we should all jump on the bandwagon, use the same excuses, and when we are used as examples by being given a jail sentence all appeal against it saying " so and so done the same and didn't go to prison " why me ? The law cant be seen to pick and choose who gets sentenced, the same crime had been committed so all be treated the same .
What is the point of again wasting tax payers money by taking these people to court if they are not going to be punished. She knew what she was doing and again excuses were made to cover them up. The law and courts are an **** and show no deterrent to others, we should all jump on the bandwagon, use the same excuses, and when we are used as examples by being given a jail sentence all appeal against it saying " so and so done the same and didn't go to prison " why me ? The law cant be seen to pick and choose who gets sentenced, the same crime had been committed so all be treated the same . dinnerlady52
  • Score: 12

3:54pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Bobevans says...

So she goes of almost without punishment having pocketed £70,000
Mo wonder benefits fraud is rife, The chances of being caught is low and if caught you just get a slap on the wrist

I expect she has been filing her boots at the food bank as well
So she goes of almost without punishment having pocketed £70,000 Mo wonder benefits fraud is rife, The chances of being caught is low and if caught you just get a slap on the wrist I expect she has been filing her boots at the food bank as well Bobevans
  • Score: 6

4:12pm Mon 3 Feb 14

blackandamber says...

So she's actually got away scot free after stealing £70k of the tax payers money. As I've said before nobody is guilty of anything any more
So she's actually got away scot free after stealing £70k of the tax payers money. As I've said before nobody is guilty of anything any more blackandamber
  • Score: 7

4:20pm Mon 3 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Sounds like a good trade to me, Benefit Cheat....
Sounds like a good trade to me, Benefit Cheat.... welshmen
  • Score: 7

4:22pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

blackandamber wrote:
So she's actually got away scot free after stealing £70k of the tax payers money. As I've said before nobody is guilty of anything any more
Yet the government quotes 'accurate' figures that say with some authority that fraud is minuscule. Both this case and the last one reported in the SW Argus for collossal sums had been going on for ten years plus. So, if no one checks and just keeps doling taxpayer money out freehand, how can they know the scale of the fraud? The truth is they have no idea.
[quote][p][bold]blackandamber[/bold] wrote: So she's actually got away scot free after stealing £70k of the tax payers money. As I've said before nobody is guilty of anything any more[/p][/quote]Yet the government quotes 'accurate' figures that say with some authority that fraud is minuscule. Both this case and the last one reported in the SW Argus for collossal sums had been going on for ten years plus. So, if no one checks and just keeps doling taxpayer money out freehand, how can they know the scale of the fraud? The truth is they have no idea. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 7

4:24pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
rightsideup wrote:
Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!.
More to the point, will still be eligible to claim benefits.
Also, nothing in the report states that she has to pay it back.
If this is the case then she has basically got away with it.
Taxpayers money down the drain again.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]rightsideup[/bold] wrote: Claimed £70K falsely and does'nt get a custodial sentence!.[/p][/quote]More to the point, will still be eligible to claim benefits.[/p][/quote]Also, nothing in the report states that she has to pay it back. If this is the case then she has basically got away with it. Taxpayers money down the drain again. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: 8

4:31pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

It is little wonder that people try and avoid paying tax when it is wasted in this manner on bogus claimants.
These would be the same people berating the companies avoiding tax.
Or the MP's for fiddling their expenses.
This case just demonstrates that crime does pay and very well if you can get away with it over a length of time as this person did.
It is little wonder that people try and avoid paying tax when it is wasted in this manner on bogus claimants. These would be the same people berating the companies avoiding tax. Or the MP's for fiddling their expenses. This case just demonstrates that crime does pay and very well if you can get away with it over a length of time as this person did. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: 3

5:45pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Floppy backed says...

"The court heard Stroud had suffered family tragedy, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and Post Traumatic Stress Disorder"

That is no relevance once again the family solicitor is making excuses how does OCD make you claim? Many of us have had family tragedy doesn't make up go out and permit crime and as for PTSD again no relevance obviously she knew what she was doing and purposely claiming through fraud that is not a sign of someone who is mentally disturbed!

I am glad we work our socks off here and my lane is full of pot holes just proves that its the 'social' drainers of this country who are sucking the blood out of the system while they live a life of luxury - thanks to us tax payers!
"The court heard Stroud had suffered family tragedy, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and Post Traumatic Stress Disorder" That is no relevance once again the family solicitor is making excuses how does OCD make you claim? Many of us have had family tragedy doesn't make up go out and permit crime and as for PTSD again no relevance obviously she knew what she was doing and purposely claiming through fraud that is not a sign of someone who is mentally disturbed! I am glad we work our socks off here and my lane is full of pot holes just proves that its the 'social' drainers of this country who are sucking the blood out of the system while they live a life of luxury - thanks to us tax payers! Floppy backed
  • Score: 2

6:10pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 9

6:18pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Umm1972 says...

She walks around thinking she's god gift, well it's all out now, benefit cheat, go out and earn and pay your bills the proper way you scum bag, but she should be made to pay it back
She walks around thinking she's god gift, well it's all out now, benefit cheat, go out and earn and pay your bills the proper way you scum bag, but she should be made to pay it back Umm1972
  • Score: 13

6:26pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

There are bigger problems in the UK than Katie Stroud check it out, copy and paste this into your browser:

http://www.ukuncut.o
rg.uk/media/W1siZiIs
IjUxM2NiZmE0YjAxOTFm
MDAwMzAwMDBmMyJdXQ/p
hilip-green-poster.j
pg
There are bigger problems in the UK than Katie Stroud check it out, copy and paste this into your browser: http://www.ukuncut.o rg.uk/media/W1siZiIs IjUxM2NiZmE0YjAxOTFm MDAwMzAwMDBmMyJdXQ/p hilip-green-poster.j pg Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: -3

6:37pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
Is he breaking the law then? She did.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.[/p][/quote]Is he breaking the law then? She did. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 1

6:44pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
Is he breaking the law then? She did.
Your right he did not but in my books he did.
Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.[/p][/quote]Is he breaking the law then? She did.[/p][/quote]Your right he did not but in my books he did. Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 1

6:51pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne


ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
Is he breaking the law then? She did.
Your right he did not but in my books he did.
Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most.
Really? Taxes paid by companies are a business cost like any other. Who do you think pays them in the end? We do. Companies pass them onto customers, along with labour and raw material, business rates etc. There's no such thing as free money. Unless you're the woman in the story that is. And we paid that too.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.[/p][/quote]Is he breaking the law then? She did.[/p][/quote]Your right he did not but in my books he did. Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most.[/p][/quote]Really? Taxes paid by companies are a business cost like any other. Who do you think pays them in the end? We do. Companies pass them onto customers, along with labour and raw material, business rates etc. There's no such thing as free money. Unless you're the woman in the story that is. And we paid that too. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 7

7:00pm Mon 3 Feb 14

rightsideup says...

The prosecution should appeal the leniency of this sentence!...........
..
The prosecution should appeal the leniency of this sentence!........... .. rightsideup
  • Score: 10

7:18pm Mon 3 Feb 14

LlanmartinAnti-Christ says...

David Gauke Treasury minister not only wants to clamp down on tradesmen doing cash and not declaring, and quite right to.

The same David Guake who wife works for LexisNexis specialising in corporate tax . Yes thats right Tax Dodging.

Bet that makes for interesting pillow talk, wonder if it's declared in Members interests ?
David Gauke Treasury minister not only wants to clamp down on tradesmen doing cash and not declaring, and quite right to. The same David Guake who wife works for LexisNexis specialising in corporate tax . Yes thats right Tax Dodging. Bet that makes for interesting pillow talk, wonder if it's declared in Members interests ? LlanmartinAnti-Christ
  • Score: 2

7:21pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne



ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
Is he breaking the law then? She did.
Your right he did not but in my books he did.
Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most.
Really? Taxes paid by companies are a business cost like any other. Who do you think pays them in the end? We do. Companies pass them onto customers, along with labour and raw material, business rates etc. There's no such thing as free money. Unless you're the woman in the story that is. And we paid that too.
Except that there are many large companies that pay no tax through legal loopholes.
Its absolute twaddle to think all the tax dodged money gets passed on to customers and this does no favours to small businesses that are trying to compete on an un level playing field that’s why our towns are dying because corporate greed is taking all.
The one thing that links the two people mentioned together is greed its not clever its just pure GREED.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.[/p][/quote]Is he breaking the law then? She did.[/p][/quote]Your right he did not but in my books he did. Thats whats wrong with this country one rule for some another for the privilaged wealthy and you dont have to be a mathmatician to tell whos costing us the most.[/p][/quote]Really? Taxes paid by companies are a business cost like any other. Who do you think pays them in the end? We do. Companies pass them onto customers, along with labour and raw material, business rates etc. There's no such thing as free money. Unless you're the woman in the story that is. And we paid that too.[/p][/quote]Except that there are many large companies that pay no tax through legal loopholes. Its absolute twaddle to think all the tax dodged money gets passed on to customers and this does no favours to small businesses that are trying to compete on an un level playing field that’s why our towns are dying because corporate greed is taking all. The one thing that links the two people mentioned together is greed its not clever its just pure GREED. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

7:59pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punnished but
Who s costing us the most benefit cheats?
And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon?

Joe blogs used to run a little café but these days he's unhappy because the playing field has become very un even!

Starbucks is one of the largest coffee chains in the UK, and the second largest café or restaurant chain in the world after McDonald's. Yet, in the last three years they’ve paid no corporation tax at all, despite making sales of £1.2bn. Over the last 14 years they’ve only paid £8.6m in corporation tax.

Starbucks managed to pay no taxes by shifting money around between Starbucks companies in different countries, so that its accounts show it made a loss in the UK. Because of the way they’ve done this inside their global corporate empire no one knows exactly how much tax Starbucks should have paid. Comparing Starbucks to other similar US based multinationals, McDonald’s had a tax bill of over £80m on £3.6bn of UK sales. Kentucky Fried Chicken, incurred taxes of £36m on £1.1bn pounds in UK sales.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punnished but Who s costing us the most benefit cheats? And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon? Joe blogs used to run a little café but these days he's unhappy because the playing field has become very un even! Starbucks is one of the largest coffee chains in the UK, and the second largest café or restaurant chain in the world after McDonald's. Yet, in the last three years they’ve paid no corporation tax at all, despite making sales of £1.2bn. Over the last 14 years they’ve only paid £8.6m in corporation tax. Starbucks managed to pay no taxes by shifting money around between Starbucks companies in different countries, so that its accounts show it made a loss in the UK. Because of the way they’ve done this inside their global corporate empire no one knows exactly how much tax Starbucks should have paid. Comparing Starbucks to other similar US based multinationals, McDonald’s had a tax bill of over £80m on £3.6bn of UK sales. Kentucky Fried Chicken, incurred taxes of £36m on £1.1bn pounds in UK sales. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

8:04pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but
Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats?
And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon?

Sally Worker used to run a little greengrocers but these days he's unhappy because the playing field has become very un even!

Tesco control 30% of the UK grocery market and have over 2,000 stores in the UK. In 2010 they made a profit of £3.4bn, yet they will still go to great lengths to avoid paying tax. Using complex legal structures Tesco has avoided stamp duty land tax to the tune of £90-£100m and £23m in stamp duty.

Tesco has its headquarters in the sleepy Hertfordshire town of Cheshunt. Something else that you can find there is Cheshunt Overseas, a limited liability partnership that has enabled Tesco to avoid £16m in tax through overseas business rules.

The sums Tesco has avoided may not be as much as Peter Green , but hey, every little helps!
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats? And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon? Sally Worker used to run a little greengrocers but these days he's unhappy because the playing field has become very un even! Tesco control 30% of the UK grocery market and have over 2,000 stores in the UK. In 2010 they made a profit of £3.4bn, yet they will still go to great lengths to avoid paying tax. Using complex legal structures Tesco has avoided stamp duty land tax to the tune of £90-£100m and £23m in stamp duty. Tesco has its headquarters in the sleepy Hertfordshire town of Cheshunt. Something else that you can find there is Cheshunt Overseas, a limited liability partnership that has enabled Tesco to avoid £16m in tax through overseas business rules. The sums Tesco has avoided may not be as much as Peter Green , but hey, every little helps! Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 1

8:09pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but
Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats?
And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon?

Janet and John used to run a little local pharmacy but these days they are unhappy because the playing field has become very un even!

In June 2008, after more than a century and a half in the UK, Boots moved out of the country to Switzerland. The British household name had been acquired, along with its company, Alliance Boots, in Europe’s largest private equity deal in 2007, thanks to £9.3bn of borrowing from banks and other investors. Interest payments on the Alliance Boots debt in 2008 were so large they wiped out profit in the UK – and the tax that used to go with it. HMRC rules allowed the company to set interest payments on its debt against profits for tax purposes, a benefit to investors that has helped to drive equity deals.

Ten years ago the Boots group generally paid about one-third of its profits in UK tax. The revenue could expect a tax charge around £120-£150m each year.

Then came the move to the low-tax Swiss canton of Zug. After huge interest payments, its worldwide profits last year were £475m. It is hard to see which parts of the company are now making what, but the cash flow statement for the year to March 2010 shows that just £14m was recorded as the tax charge on those profits – that is, just 3% of profits.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats? And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon? Janet and John used to run a little local pharmacy but these days they are unhappy because the playing field has become very un even! In June 2008, after more than a century and a half in the UK, Boots moved out of the country to Switzerland. The British household name had been acquired, along with its company, Alliance Boots, in Europe’s largest private equity deal in 2007, thanks to £9.3bn of borrowing from banks and other investors. Interest payments on the Alliance Boots debt in 2008 were so large they wiped out profit in the UK – and the tax that used to go with it. HMRC rules allowed the company to set interest payments on its debt against profits for tax purposes, a benefit to investors that has helped to drive equity deals. Ten years ago the Boots group generally paid about one-third of its profits in UK tax. The revenue could expect a tax charge around £120-£150m each year. Then came the move to the low-tax Swiss canton of Zug. After huge interest payments, its worldwide profits last year were £475m. It is hard to see which parts of the company are now making what, but the cash flow statement for the year to March 2010 shows that just £14m was recorded as the tax charge on those profits – that is, just 3% of profits. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 2

8:13pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

8:16pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

I just cant see whos costing us more?

Diageo (Johnnie Walker Scotch)
Diageo plc has its headquarters in Henrietta Place, central London, and its £3.6m-a-year chief executive, Paul Walsh, lives in Sussex. The drinks giant has 6,500 workers in Britain, mostly making and selling scotch. Their famous Johnnie Walker brand, blended in Kilmarnock, is exported all over the world. But this British firm has been paying very little UK corporation tax, relatively speaking. Despite average annual profits of almost £2bn over the last decade, its accounts disclose a mere £43m a year in average UK corporation tax charges. This is little more than 2% of its profits. The tax bill would be nearer £144m a year if it reflected Diageo's actual physical UK presence rather than the present system of taxing only those financial profits said to arise in this country.
I just cant see whos costing us more? Diageo (Johnnie Walker Scotch) Diageo plc has its headquarters in Henrietta Place, central London, and its £3.6m-a-year chief executive, Paul Walsh, lives in Sussex. The drinks giant has 6,500 workers in Britain, mostly making and selling scotch. Their famous Johnnie Walker brand, blended in Kilmarnock, is exported all over the world. But this British firm has been paying very little UK corporation tax, relatively speaking. Despite average annual profits of almost £2bn over the last decade, its accounts disclose a mere £43m a year in average UK corporation tax charges. This is little more than 2% of its profits. The tax bill would be nearer £144m a year if it reflected Diageo's actual physical UK presence rather than the present system of taxing only those financial profits said to arise in this country. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 3

8:27pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but
Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats?
And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon?
The Tory government want you to focus on the likes of Katie Stroud because it leads you away from the real problems this country faces and takes the heat off the rich and privileged who get away with dodging their way out of paying tax.

For the last ten years Vodafone have been fighting tooth and nail to avoid paying the UK government around £6bn in tax. Court case followed court case, and eventually HM Revenue and Customs won a decisive victory. Vodafone were on the ropes and all that was needed was a couple more government knocks to finally make the communication giant pay up. But instead of forcing through the deal, the exchequer, run by George Osborne, let Vodafone off. It was one of the most shameless, blatant and costly examples of corporate-government cronyism in years. But at a time when the government are insisting upon massive cuts in public spending, the deal is particularly hard to swallow.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats? And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon? The Tory government want you to focus on the likes of Katie Stroud because it leads you away from the real problems this country faces and takes the heat off the rich and privileged who get away with dodging their way out of paying tax. For the last ten years Vodafone have been fighting tooth and nail to avoid paying the UK government around £6bn in tax. Court case followed court case, and eventually HM Revenue and Customs won a decisive victory. Vodafone were on the ropes and all that was needed was a couple more government knocks to finally make the communication giant pay up. But instead of forcing through the deal, the exchequer, run by George Osborne, let Vodafone off. It was one of the most shameless, blatant and costly examples of corporate-government cronyism in years. But at a time when the government are insisting upon massive cuts in public spending, the deal is particularly hard to swallow. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

8:48pm Mon 3 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done.... welshmen
  • Score: -4

8:51pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Umm1972 says...

Ha now I know why she was driving around in a 60 plate white car...ha ha stroud caught at last, now pay it back...
Ha now I know why she was driving around in a 60 plate white car...ha ha stroud caught at last, now pay it back... Umm1972
  • Score: 6

9:01pm Mon 3 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man.
Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form.

Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....[/p][/quote]I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man. Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form. Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: -4

11:19pm Mon 3 Feb 14

michellegwent12 says...

Wont be sticking her nose up to people anymore, think shes better thab every one else.well **** hit the fan now hasnt it lady muck
Wont be sticking her nose up to people anymore, think shes better thab every one else.well **** hit the fan now hasnt it lady muck michellegwent12
  • Score: 7

11:59pm Mon 3 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne


ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man.
Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form.

Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck
I wont be voting for Labour Traitors, Conservative Traitors, Liberal Traitors, the Unions and Business's can destroy a Country as well as Build one, neither any of the above can do the positive, they are all trying to make THEIR fortunes while they seek to fool the Tax Payer in thinking they care for our Country.

The only people who have that right are our Soldiers, and our Government have to be publicly pilloried before they help our injured Soldiers with housing and their mental needs, on coming back from a war that even the Traitorous Afghan leader says we have failed his Country, our Soldiers should never have been sent to Afghanistan, it's nothing to do with our Country neither is Syria, the Media have to stop trying to Guilt trip the British public into sending our Soldiers yet again to sort out an Islamic Problem, Islam is there and surround's Syria, let those Oil Rich Countries commit their Soldiers to Allha, NOT ours....

By the sound of your last post your a Labour voter, and as you say they stand for the working man, well if you believe that your to far gone to post with, bye bye....
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....[/p][/quote]I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man. Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form. Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck[/p][/quote]I wont be voting for Labour Traitors, Conservative Traitors, Liberal Traitors, the Unions and Business's can destroy a Country as well as Build one, neither any of the above can do the positive, they are all trying to make THEIR fortunes while they seek to fool the Tax Payer in thinking they care for our Country. The only people who have that right are our Soldiers, and our Government have to be publicly pilloried before they help our injured Soldiers with housing and their mental needs, on coming back from a war that even the Traitorous Afghan leader says we have failed his Country, our Soldiers should never have been sent to Afghanistan, it's nothing to do with our Country neither is Syria, the Media have to stop trying to Guilt trip the British public into sending our Soldiers yet again to sort out an Islamic Problem, Islam is there and surround's Syria, let those Oil Rich Countries commit their Soldiers to Allha, NOT ours.... By the sound of your last post your a Labour voter, and as you say they stand for the working man, well if you believe that your to far gone to post with, bye bye.... welshmen
  • Score: -6

7:23am Tue 4 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

7:29am Tue 4 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

LlanmartinAnti-Chris
t
wrote:
David Gauke Treasury minister not only wants to clamp down on tradesmen doing cash and not declaring, and quite right to.

The same David Guake who wife works for LexisNexis specialising in corporate tax . Yes thats right Tax Dodging.

Bet that makes for interesting pillow talk, wonder if it's declared in Members interests ?
I'm struggling to see the difference between tax lawyers, accountants and comparethemarket.com
. They all use their expertise to minimise what you pay legally. The real issue is that taking nearly half of the economy in tax and then having politicians squander it is daft. Whatever companies pay in tax still has to come from us, they can only get it from the people who buy their services.
[quote][p][bold]LlanmartinAnti-Chris t[/bold] wrote: David Gauke Treasury minister not only wants to clamp down on tradesmen doing cash and not declaring, and quite right to. The same David Guake who wife works for LexisNexis specialising in corporate tax . Yes thats right Tax Dodging. Bet that makes for interesting pillow talk, wonder if it's declared in Members interests ?[/p][/quote]I'm struggling to see the difference between tax lawyers, accountants and comparethemarket.com . They all use their expertise to minimise what you pay legally. The real issue is that taking nearly half of the economy in tax and then having politicians squander it is daft. Whatever companies pay in tax still has to come from us, they can only get it from the people who buy their services. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 1

8:20am Tue 4 Feb 14

Bobevans says...

welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
There is nothing the government can do which is why they have done nothing. corporation tax is an EU tax and these companies fully comply with the law on it
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....[/p][/quote]There is nothing the government can do which is why they have done nothing. corporation tax is an EU tax and these companies fully comply with the law on it Bobevans
  • Score: -5

8:45am Tue 4 Feb 14

Mervyn James says...

richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
[quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue. Mervyn James
  • Score: 3

8:45am Tue 4 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

Bobevans wrote:
welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne


ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
There is nothing the government can do which is why they have done nothing. corporation tax is an EU tax and these companies fully comply with the law on it
Quite right. The US has been just as unsuccessful at trying to get money out of its biggest darling company.
http://mobile.reuter
s.com/article/idUSBR
E99E0PD20131015?irpc
=932
[quote][p][bold]Bobevans[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....[/p][/quote]There is nothing the government can do which is why they have done nothing. corporation tax is an EU tax and these companies fully comply with the law on it[/p][/quote]Quite right. The US has been just as unsuccessful at trying to get money out of its biggest darling company. http://mobile.reuter s.com/article/idUSBR E99E0PD20131015?irpc =932 Llanmartinangel
  • Score: 1

11:29am Tue 4 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Mervyn James wrote:
richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
Well said Mervyn. I also watched the programme and it was nice to hear some TRUE facts coming out for a change instead of all the 'scrounger' labels and demonising of people on benefits .The majority of people on benefits have worked or are in work and paid taxes and therefore have, or are, contributing to the state. I've been saying the same facts on here for months and been vilified by some for pointing out the truth. Well, tax evasion costs this country billions and billions of pounds. Much higher than the welfare bill, and yet that seems to be ok with some. Well its not ok with me.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.[/p][/quote]Well said Mervyn. I also watched the programme and it was nice to hear some TRUE facts coming out for a change instead of all the 'scrounger' labels and demonising of people on benefits .The majority of people on benefits have worked or are in work and paid taxes and therefore have, or are, contributing to the state. I've been saying the same facts on here for months and been vilified by some for pointing out the truth. Well, tax evasion costs this country billions and billions of pounds. Much higher than the welfare bill, and yet that seems to be ok with some. Well its not ok with me. endthelies
  • Score: 4

11:34am Tue 4 Feb 14

endthelies says...

69.9 BILLION pound a year lost in tax evasion. And lets not forget, you pay higher tax from your pay packet to make up for that lost revenue. It may be legal but its immoral. Stealing from the country, just as this woman has done.
69.9 BILLION pound a year lost in tax evasion. And lets not forget, you pay higher tax from your pay packet to make up for that lost revenue. It may be legal but its immoral. Stealing from the country, just as this woman has done. endthelies
  • Score: 6

11:38am Tue 4 Feb 14

Templar05 says...

Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union . Templar05
  • Score: -4

12:05pm Tue 4 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
[quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right. endthelies
  • Score: 8

12:50pm Tue 4 Feb 14

GardenVarietyMushroom says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Abertillery29 wrote:
What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment?
Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen?
If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her.
When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants.


It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.
Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.
What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined.

However just to balance things up and put it into perspective.
What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment?
For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong.
Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for:
The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students
Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses.
Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax.

In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.
Oh, let's not forget other examples - like Kieth (vaseline) Vaz, who in 2009 claimed £75,000 in expenses for his secondf home when he already has a family home only twelve miles from parliament.

Did he get locked up I wonder? Pretty sure he didn't.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Abertillery29[/bold] wrote: What exactly does a benefit cheat have to do to get imprisonment? Why is it so rare for benefit cheats to be ordered to repay the money they have stolen? If an ordinary thief had stolen this money they would probably be imprisoned so why not her. When are these judges and the Ministry of Justice going to start giving out sentences that reflect the harm that she and others cause to legitimate claimants. It would be easy to find a carer for her mother.[/p][/quote]Sentencing guidelines say that this is not as serious an offence as stealing the 70K from her mam. I can't see it myself, but that's the answer to your question.[/p][/quote]What she did was wrong full stop and should be fined. However just to balance things up and put it into perspective. What exactly does a multi-billionaire businessman, who runs some of the biggest names on British high streets. have to do to get a fine or imprisonment? For the attention of Dai and others who think the working class are scum and does not belive the upper classes ever put at foot wong. Check out Philip Green his £285m tax dodge could pay for: The full, hiked up £9,000 fees for almost 32,000 students Pay the salaries of 20,000 NHS nurses. Philip Green is not a non-dom. He lives in the UK. He works in the UK. He pays tax on his salary in the UK. All seems to be in order. Until you realise that Philip Green does not actually own any of the Arcadia group that he spends every day running. Instead, it is in the name of his wife who has not done a single day’s work for the company. Mrs Green lives in Monaco, where she pays not a penny of income tax. In 2005 Philip Green awarded himself £1.2bn, the biggest paycheck in British corporate history. But this dividend payout was channeled through a network of offshore accounts, via tax havens in Jersey and eventually to Green’s wife’s Monaco bank account. The dodge saved Green, and cost the tax payer, close to £300m. This tax arrangement remains in place. Any time it takes his fancy, Green can pay himself huge sums of money without having to pay any tax.[/p][/quote]Oh, let's not forget other examples - like Kieth (vaseline) Vaz, who in 2009 claimed £75,000 in expenses for his secondf home when he already has a family home only twelve miles from parliament. Did he get locked up I wonder? Pretty sure he didn't. GardenVarietyMushroom
  • Score: 9

3:48pm Tue 4 Feb 14

no cheese says...

Disgusting, she will end up paying it back out of benefits so government paying themselves back yet again. No wonder we are skint.
Disgusting, she will end up paying it back out of benefits so government paying themselves back yet again. No wonder we are skint. no cheese
  • Score: -4

3:50pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Radio Wales says...

I am amazed at the naivety of some of the commentators here who are screaming for repayment of wrongly claimed benefits.
The law says EVERYONE is entitled to a minimum level of income to live in Britain today.
That is what you get in benefits today, the minimum!
If a repayment order was made then that would mean she would have to be paid extra in benefits in order to be able to repay the debt.
Given the administrative overheads that would be incurred in working out the amounts needed and supervising the payments, as well as accounting for the process, I would imaging the court would have decided to settle for not throwing good money after bad and gone for the cheaper option.
Anyway it averaged about £4,300 a year so compared to some MP's 200 metre taxi bills for similar periods, it was not so big a deal in the overall scheme of things
I am amazed at the naivety of some of the commentators here who are screaming for repayment of wrongly claimed benefits. The law says EVERYONE is entitled to a minimum level of income to live in Britain today. That is what you get in benefits today, the minimum! If a repayment order was made then that would mean she would have to be paid extra in benefits in order to be able to repay the debt. Given the administrative overheads that would be incurred in working out the amounts needed and supervising the payments, as well as accounting for the process, I would imaging the court would have decided to settle for not throwing good money after bad and gone for the cheaper option. Anyway it averaged about £4,300 a year so compared to some MP's 200 metre taxi bills for similar periods, it was not so big a deal in the overall scheme of things Radio Wales
  • Score: 2

3:59pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

Mervyn James wrote:
richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
Landlords upping rents month after month?
You are talking through your a**e again.
I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark.
I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system.
'Two wrongs don't make a right' either.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.[/p][/quote]Landlords upping rents month after month? You are talking through your a**e again. I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark. I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system. 'Two wrongs don't make a right' either. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: -3

5:08pm Tue 4 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
Landlords upping rents month after month?
You are talking through your a**e again.
I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark.
I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system.
'Two wrongs don't make a right' either.
Cymru Am Beth replying to LMA:

"Landlords upping rents month after month?
You are talking through your a**e again.
I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark.
I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system.
'Two wrongs don't make a right' either."

I say:
If you want to see who makes millions on renting, you have look no further than the Housing so called Charities in Gwent, £1100 +vat a month for a two bed standard bungalow, that was in 2011, last year a local housing Charity is going to spend £111 Million on their housing stock £18,000 a unit, these are the money makers, they house immigrants and asylum seekers and other social tenants , the Bungalow I mentioned had housed an immigrant for six months, £6732.00 paid by the Tax payer, the private sector are not the rent hikers, I know private renters, in the last 5 years their rates have come down from £550.00 to £500.00 for two bed housing per month, I would like to know how much housing benefit is being paid to the Charity Housing Associations, "MILLIONS a year....
[quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.[/p][/quote]Landlords upping rents month after month? You are talking through your a**e again. I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark. I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system. 'Two wrongs don't make a right' either.[/p][/quote]Cymru Am Beth replying to LMA: "Landlords upping rents month after month? You are talking through your a**e again. I rent out property in the Newport area and I am getting less now than 15 years ago, but don't let the truth get in the way of a totally inaccurate remark. I also pay my tax, so I am not pleased when people fiddle the system. 'Two wrongs don't make a right' either." I say: If you want to see who makes millions on renting, you have look no further than the Housing so called Charities in Gwent, £1100 +vat a month for a two bed standard bungalow, that was in 2011, last year a local housing Charity is going to spend £111 Million on their housing stock £18,000 a unit, these are the money makers, they house immigrants and asylum seekers and other social tenants , the Bungalow I mentioned had housed an immigrant for six months, £6732.00 paid by the Tax payer, the private sector are not the rent hikers, I know private renters, in the last 5 years their rates have come down from £550.00 to £500.00 for two bed housing per month, I would like to know how much housing benefit is being paid to the Charity Housing Associations, "MILLIONS a year.... welshmen
  • Score: -4

5:15pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
And tax evaders get prison for much less cash. Not to mention vast penalties. Your next good point?
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]And tax evaders get prison for much less cash. Not to mention vast penalties. Your next good point? Dai Rear
  • Score: -8

5:23pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot.
"Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life"
like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing.

Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot. "Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life" like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing. Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 8

5:59pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Diary of a benefit scrounger! Tory Tricks
If ever there has been an issue so poorly reported, with so much ignorance and so many lies, the current "welfare" debate must be it.
“I've been edited to make me look like a "shirker"

Check it out:
http://diaryofabenef
itscrounger.blogspot
.co.uk/2014/02/the-b
ig-benefits-row.html
Diary of a benefit scrounger! Tory Tricks If ever there has been an issue so poorly reported, with so much ignorance and so many lies, the current "welfare" debate must be it. “I've been edited to make me look like a "shirker" Check it out: http://diaryofabenef itscrounger.blogspot .co.uk/2014/02/the-b ig-benefits-row.html Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

6:04pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

RE: The Big Benefits Row on Channel 5

Dear Edwina, On n silencing disabled person voice .
Check it out:

http://agirlcalledja
ck.com/2014/02/04/de
ar-edwina-thankyou-f
or-last-night-i-hope
-it-was-as-good-for-
you-as-it-was-for-me
-bigbenefitsrow/
RE: The Big Benefits Row on Channel 5 Dear Edwina, On n silencing disabled person voice . Check it out: http://agirlcalledja ck.com/2014/02/04/de ar-edwina-thankyou-f or-last-night-i-hope -it-was-as-good-for- you-as-it-was-for-me -bigbenefitsrow/ Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

6:17pm Tue 4 Feb 14

GardenVarietyMushroom says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Diary of a benefit scrounger! Tory Tricks
If ever there has been an issue so poorly reported, with so much ignorance and so many lies, the current "welfare" debate must be it.
“I've been edited to make me look like a "shirker"

Check it out:
http://diaryofabenef

itscrounger.blogspot

.co.uk/2014/02/the-b

ig-benefits-row.html
Good blog.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Diary of a benefit scrounger! Tory Tricks If ever there has been an issue so poorly reported, with so much ignorance and so many lies, the current "welfare" debate must be it. “I've been edited to make me look like a "shirker" Check it out: http://diaryofabenef itscrounger.blogspot .co.uk/2014/02/the-b ig-benefits-row.html[/p][/quote]Good blog. GardenVarietyMushroom
  • Score: 7

6:18pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne



ss
wrote:
Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more?

Walkers Crisps
This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.
Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties.

What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes.

This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....
I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man.
Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form.

Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck
I wont be voting for Labour Traitors, Conservative Traitors, Liberal Traitors, the Unions and Business's can destroy a Country as well as Build one, neither any of the above can do the positive, they are all trying to make THEIR fortunes while they seek to fool the Tax Payer in thinking they care for our Country.

The only people who have that right are our Soldiers, and our Government have to be publicly pilloried before they help our injured Soldiers with housing and their mental needs, on coming back from a war that even the Traitorous Afghan leader says we have failed his Country, our Soldiers should never have been sent to Afghanistan, it's nothing to do with our Country neither is Syria, the Media have to stop trying to Guilt trip the British public into sending our Soldiers yet again to sort out an Islamic Problem, Islam is there and surround's Syria, let those Oil Rich Countries commit their Soldiers to Allha, NOT ours....

By the sound of your last post your a Labour voter, and as you say they stand for the working man, well if you believe that your to far gone to post with, bye bye....
The Army is launching a £3m recruitment campaign aimed at boosting both the regular and reserve forces with cut price soldiers this is after savagely reducing the armed forces through cuts, this is the Tory response to unemployment, working poor and zero hours.
A poll commissioned by the Army to mark the campaign's launch suggested that 23% of people were not satisfied with their current career.When asked what was missing 30% said a decent salary; 27% said excellent training and personal development; 25% said a challenging and exciting role; 35% said UK and overseas travel; and 18% said getting paid while getting qualifications.
The research, carried out by OnePoll, surveyed 2,000 people in December 2013.

Some young lads (and indeed these days girls) clearly want to be soldiers but many have in the past chosen this path out of sheer lack of decent local job prospects.
Most young people however just want jobs in the communities they grew up in with a decent wage.
The coalition government of today are letting our youth fall through the cracks in our culture.

The privileged people who present themselves as pillars of the community and constantly attack the working class are the same people who would send them all off to war to defend wealth and then have the cheek to honour the ones that survive as hero’s.
The vast majority of soldiers in wars and conflicts both past and present are from working class backgrounds.
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: Greed Geed Greed who is costing us more? Walkers Crisps This famous crisp manufacturer markets itself as quintessentially British: the fields, the soil, the potatoes, the farmers, the factories and of course, Gary Linker. Something less British about Walkers is their profits, which are channelled to Switzerland. An investigation by the Guardian showed their avoidance tactics go back to 1999 when the business suddenly became a Swiss company. In the initial year the move meant we lost £10m in tax; in subsequent years it has been closer to £20m a year. HMRC went after them and they gave £40m back, less than a third of what we would have received had they kept the profits here.[/p][/quote]Tax dodging, what your revealing here is morally wrong, but unfortunately Lawful in our Country, the Lib Con Government rely on business's to fund their Party coffers, the Labour Party rely on the Big Unions, and what comes with that funding, is how to repay back the ones that donate to these three parties. What you have posted is the way Governments have achieved this time and time again, all Governments have had plenty of time to stop these loop holes in our tax laws, but haven't, the £14.00 bedroom tax was implemented within months, why, because the poor don't give to the parties coffers, this makes the Government look like their doing what the voters want, cutting Benefits, this will attract support for their party when Election time comes. This Country needs a Party that doesn't rely on handouts by Tax dodgers and Unions, until that day nothing will change, they all might promise but none will deliver....Just like the Bankers, hot air, but nothing done....[/p][/quote]I’m not telling anyone which way to vote but Tory/Dems and Ukip are not the answer they are the problem and as for Unions from what I can see is they are the few standing up for the working man. Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form. Why dont you take your argument out on the streets and talk to small traders and see how far you get ... good luck[/p][/quote]I wont be voting for Labour Traitors, Conservative Traitors, Liberal Traitors, the Unions and Business's can destroy a Country as well as Build one, neither any of the above can do the positive, they are all trying to make THEIR fortunes while they seek to fool the Tax Payer in thinking they care for our Country. The only people who have that right are our Soldiers, and our Government have to be publicly pilloried before they help our injured Soldiers with housing and their mental needs, on coming back from a war that even the Traitorous Afghan leader says we have failed his Country, our Soldiers should never have been sent to Afghanistan, it's nothing to do with our Country neither is Syria, the Media have to stop trying to Guilt trip the British public into sending our Soldiers yet again to sort out an Islamic Problem, Islam is there and surround's Syria, let those Oil Rich Countries commit their Soldiers to Allha, NOT ours.... By the sound of your last post your a Labour voter, and as you say they stand for the working man, well if you believe that your to far gone to post with, bye bye....[/p][/quote]The Army is launching a £3m recruitment campaign aimed at boosting both the regular and reserve forces with cut price soldiers this is after savagely reducing the armed forces through cuts, this is the Tory response to unemployment, working poor and zero hours. A poll commissioned by the Army to mark the campaign's launch suggested that 23% of people were not satisfied with their current career.When asked what was missing 30% said a decent salary; 27% said excellent training and personal development; 25% said a challenging and exciting role; 35% said UK and overseas travel; and 18% said getting paid while getting qualifications. The research, carried out by OnePoll, surveyed 2,000 people in December 2013. Some young lads (and indeed these days girls) clearly want to be soldiers but many have in the past chosen this path out of sheer lack of decent local job prospects. Most young people however just want jobs in the communities they grew up in with a decent wage. The coalition government of today are letting our youth fall through the cracks in our culture. The privileged people who present themselves as pillars of the community and constantly attack the working class are the same people who would send them all off to war to defend wealth and then have the cheek to honour the ones that survive as hero’s. The vast majority of soldiers in wars and conflicts both past and present are from working class backgrounds. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 13

6:21pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Mervyn James wrote:
richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
RE C5, check out Diary of a benifits scronger:

http://diaryofabenef
itscrounger.blogspot
.co.uk/2014/02/the-b
ig-benefits-row.html
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.[/p][/quote]RE C5, check out Diary of a benifits scronger: http://diaryofabenef itscrounger.blogspot .co.uk/2014/02/the-b ig-benefits-row.html Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 7

6:24pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Mervyn James wrote:
richie55 wrote:
Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???
After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.
Diary of a Benefit Scrounger

Check it out:

http://diaryofabenef
itscrounger.blogspot
.co.uk/2014/02/the-b
ig-benefits-row.html
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]richie55[/bold] wrote: Hardly a week goes by without stories like this making the news and very, very few offenders are sent to prison. Until the courts start treating these offences as serious and sending people to prison they will just continue and continue. If I was fiddling the benefits system right now and seeing weak punishments like this handed out what incentive is there for me to stop???[/p][/quote]After the debacle of C5's TV program last night, a lo there need a reality check, less than 1% of ALL benefit claimants are fraudulent, that means 99% are genuine, but still demonized by the idiots who don't understand statistics, don't read the DWP's own read outs, and prefer to label everyone the same. The rabid advocates of "Benefit claimant deprive hard working people..." were wrong too, many WERE working people having to claim because their wage didn't cover their commute let alone their rents, and 44% of all benefits went to older people, who needed more help and support because we are all living longer, what next a cull at retirement age ? No-one addressed the tax fiddlers, the bankers, or the landlords ripping off the state by upping rents month after month.... who cost us more than any state benefit fiddle... It is right to expose the fiddles, it is wrong to not put any perspective on this issue.[/p][/quote]Diary of a Benefit Scrounger Check it out: http://diaryofabenef itscrounger.blogspot .co.uk/2014/02/the-b ig-benefits-row.html Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

6:32pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
And tax evaders get prison for much less cash. Not to mention vast penalties. Your next good point?
Yeah they make an example of a few its good PR just to reassure the public alls fair!
But we all know its NOT and we all know who's costing us more and who's getting the biggest kicking.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]And tax evaders get prison for much less cash. Not to mention vast penalties. Your next good point?[/p][/quote]Yeah they make an example of a few its good PR just to reassure the public alls fair! But we all know its NOT and we all know who's costing us more and who's getting the biggest kicking. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

7:26pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant.
Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems.

You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind)
Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot!

....
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant. Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems. You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind) Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot! .... Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 9

8:00pm Tue 4 Feb 14

helper7 says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant.
Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems.

You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind)
Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot!

....
There are millions of us Dai, millions of us!!
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant. Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems. You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind) Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot! ....[/p][/quote]There are millions of us Dai, millions of us!! helper7
  • Score: 8

9:48pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Astroboy says...

I wonder if she'll have to give back her 2010 Audi.
I wonder if she'll have to give back her 2010 Audi. Astroboy
  • Score: -2

7:15am Wed 5 Feb 14

jimmysmith says...

Astroboy wrote:
I wonder if she'll have to give back her 2010 Audi.
no doubt youl be on the phone again if she doesnt .
[quote][p][bold]Astroboy[/bold] wrote: I wonder if she'll have to give back her 2010 Audi.[/p][/quote]no doubt youl be on the phone again if she doesnt . jimmysmith
  • Score: 5

7:58am Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot.
"Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life"
like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing.

Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was.
I've actually no doubt we both came from a background of working parents. If yours didn't encourage you to work hard, study and get on then that's a pity, not something to gloat about.. I've no idea what Mr Saville's parents encouraged . I haven't been chasing his personal representatives for compo and I frankly have no idea why, in your "working class socialist " brain he appears to be germane to an article about a useless woman whom our wonderful State felt was really worth bunging oodles of cash to.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot. "Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life" like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing. Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was.[/p][/quote]I've actually no doubt we both came from a background of working parents. If yours didn't encourage you to work hard, study and get on then that's a pity, not something to gloat about.. I've no idea what Mr Saville's parents encouraged . I haven't been chasing his personal representatives for compo and I frankly have no idea why, in your "working class socialist " brain he appears to be germane to an article about a useless woman whom our wonderful State felt was really worth bunging oodles of cash to. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

8:06am Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 7

8:08am Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 8

8:09am Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant.
Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems.

You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind)
Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot!

....
Where does this bilge come from? If your "working class socialist friends" are all uniform ,all play football as badly, or well, as each other, none can play a musical instrument, or all can, i.e. all "equal", then you're living in a parallel universe and they (your "working class friends") are androids. Check the back of their heads for rivets.
In passing if your mum and dad had encouraged you to get an education you'd be a little more sceptical about your Oxbridge educated socialist hierarchy. Are the Milibands and Tristrams much different from the Ozzies and Daves? Pigs and farmers dear boy.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Brilliant Dai Absolutly Brilliant. Talk about thick! Ants are workers and"soldiers Dai so if that’s how you see the working class I’m very happy that you'v seen sense because ants stick together for the common good, their success in so many environments has been attributed to their social organisation and their ability to modify habitats, tap resources, and defend themselves against enemies,Ant societies have good communication between individuals, and an ability to solve complex problems. You must see yourself Dai as king of the jungle? Lion maybe (in your own mind) Lions have few friends and even their family members turn against them in the end and they often get hunted down and shot! ....[/p][/quote]Where does this bilge come from? If your "working class socialist friends" are all uniform ,all play football as badly, or well, as each other, none can play a musical instrument, or all can, i.e. all "equal", then you're living in a parallel universe and they (your "working class friends") are androids. Check the back of their heads for rivets. In passing if your mum and dad had encouraged you to get an education you'd be a little more sceptical about your Oxbridge educated socialist hierarchy. Are the Milibands and Tristrams much different from the Ozzies and Daves? Pigs and farmers dear boy. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

8:23am Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
Surely by voting UKIP your "working class" (we're all working class; how many rentiers have you ever heard of, since 1914?) play straight into socialist hands and guarantee us another session like 97-2010. Wonder who we'll be conned into invading this time.
You apparently would prefer your money to go into this woman's hands than pay a plumber in cash.
I think you're Boxer from Animal Farm.
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.[/p][/quote]Surely by voting UKIP your "working class" (we're all working class; how many rentiers have you ever heard of, since 1914?) play straight into socialist hands and guarantee us another session like 97-2010. Wonder who we'll be conned into invading this time. You apparently would prefer your money to go into this woman's hands than pay a plumber in cash. I think you're Boxer from Animal Farm. Dai Rear
  • Score: -5

8:45am Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Actually Milk, I've skimread a bit of your stuff and you're actually Snowball, aren't you? Watch out for the ice pick.
Actually Milk, I've skimread a bit of your stuff and you're actually Snowball, aren't you? Watch out for the ice pick. Dai Rear
  • Score: -9

8:51am Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
Surely by voting UKIP your "working class" (we're all working class; how many rentiers have you ever heard of, since 1914?) play straight into socialist hands and guarantee us another session like 97-2010. Wonder who we'll be conned into invading this time.
You apparently would prefer your money to go into this woman's hands than pay a plumber in cash.
I think you're Boxer from Animal Farm.
Not me Dai -not that stupid.
You really are wound up Dai you lonely soul.
If brains were dynamite you wouldn’t have enough to blow your nose.
End of.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.[/p][/quote]Surely by voting UKIP your "working class" (we're all working class; how many rentiers have you ever heard of, since 1914?) play straight into socialist hands and guarantee us another session like 97-2010. Wonder who we'll be conned into invading this time. You apparently would prefer your money to go into this woman's hands than pay a plumber in cash. I think you're Boxer from Animal Farm.[/p][/quote]Not me Dai -not that stupid. You really are wound up Dai you lonely soul. If brains were dynamite you wouldn’t have enough to blow your nose. End of. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 4

8:56am Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
"Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form."
But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think.
If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.
Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot.
"Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life"
like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing.

Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was.
I've actually no doubt we both came from a background of working parents. If yours didn't encourage you to work hard, study and get on then that's a pity, not something to gloat about.. I've no idea what Mr Saville's parents encouraged . I haven't been chasing his personal representatives for compo and I frankly have no idea why, in your "working class socialist " brain he appears to be germane to an article about a useless woman whom our wonderful State felt was really worth bunging oodles of cash to.
Just one more Dai, what makes you think Im out of work? what makes you think Iv never achieved anything? what makes you think Im poor?
Dont assume Dai you look a fool enough allready
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: "Ed Milliband wants a cap on so called handouts to make funding more equal but Cameron wants it only if its set ridiculously high so you can see clearly Cameron does not want equality in any form." But, being human beings, with brains, we're not "equal" in any way. Little point in coming out of the sea and heaving ourselves up on to 2 limbs if our ambition was simply to be dependent on others, I think. If you want to be an ant, have equality. I'm glad I can sing and be happy and, I hope, unlike most welfare dependents, make others happy too.[/p][/quote]Talking through your backside again Dai, theres no point in having laws and rules if the wealthy and privillaged are allowed to use their old school tie and masonic contacts to avoide living by them. I would rather be with my circle of working class socialist friends any day than join your false lot. "Some are born great, some achieve greatness, and some have greatness thrust upon them and many are denied a start in life" like I said before Brains aren’t everything Dai, And in your case they’re nothing. Half the country thought Jimmy Saville with his OBE to be a pillar of the community but that was before we all realised what a **** **** he was.[/p][/quote]I've actually no doubt we both came from a background of working parents. If yours didn't encourage you to work hard, study and get on then that's a pity, not something to gloat about.. I've no idea what Mr Saville's parents encouraged . I haven't been chasing his personal representatives for compo and I frankly have no idea why, in your "working class socialist " brain he appears to be germane to an article about a useless woman whom our wonderful State felt was really worth bunging oodles of cash to.[/p][/quote]Just one more Dai, what makes you think Im out of work? what makes you think Iv never achieved anything? what makes you think Im poor? Dont assume Dai you look a fool enough allready Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

10:12am Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts.
I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts. Dai Rear
  • Score: -7

10:19am Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts.
Your so funny, sad but funny.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts.[/p][/quote]Your so funny, sad but funny. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

10:37am Wed 5 Feb 14

topdog99 says...

Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news” topdog99
  • Score: 6

11:21am Wed 5 Feb 14

helper7 says...

topdog99 wrote:
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar.
And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.
[quote][p][bold]topdog99[/bold] wrote: Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news”[/p][/quote]Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar. And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either. helper7
  • Score: 4

12:15pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

helper7 wrote:
topdog99 wrote:
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar.
And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.
Vote Labour for more misery.
They wrecked the economy during their thirteen years in power and they will return to wreck it again as they always do.
I forgot, it was a world problem that precipitated the crash and nothing to do with Blair/Brown and his cronies.
However I don't suppose that benefit claimants will worry about that for a minute.
Milliband will look after them and just impose more taxes on contributors to pay for it.
What a bunch of losers as a nation in Wales we seem to be.
Not much in the way of entrepreneurship in this part of the world, just a lot of
no hopers spouting off left wing views.
[quote][p][bold]helper7[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]topdog99[/bold] wrote: Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news”[/p][/quote]Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar. And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.[/p][/quote]Vote Labour for more misery. They wrecked the economy during their thirteen years in power and they will return to wreck it again as they always do. I forgot, it was a world problem that precipitated the crash and nothing to do with Blair/Brown and his cronies. However I don't suppose that benefit claimants will worry about that for a minute. Milliband will look after them and just impose more taxes on contributors to pay for it. What a bunch of losers as a nation in Wales we seem to be. Not much in the way of entrepreneurship in this part of the world, just a lot of no hopers spouting off left wing views. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: -4

12:27pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

helper7 wrote:
topdog99 wrote:
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar.
And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.
Interesting bravado but not supported by the facts. Union membership is declining and, in a recent poll, a surprisingly large number of those in unions supported the Cons or UKIP. Unions represent around 20% of workers at best. Perhaps the likes of Bob (I earn £140,00 p.a. and live in a council house cos I'm working class) Crow aren't doing them any favours.
[quote][p][bold]helper7[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]topdog99[/bold] wrote: Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news”[/p][/quote]Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar. And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.[/p][/quote]Interesting bravado but not supported by the facts. Union membership is declining and, in a recent poll, a surprisingly large number of those in unions supported the Cons or UKIP. Unions represent around 20% of workers at best. Perhaps the likes of Bob (I earn £140,00 p.a. and live in a council house cos I'm working class) Crow aren't doing them any favours. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -4

1:13pm Wed 5 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party....

YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark.

Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant)

I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion....
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.[/p][/quote]First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party.... YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark. Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant) I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion.... welshmen
  • Score: -2

1:47pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

helper7 wrote:
topdog99 wrote:
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar.
And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.
Not only that but union members of the socialist party, all 79 million of you. "Vote early, vote often" was the watchword of Sinn Fein/IRA but I'm sure postal voting will enable you to ensure a Miliband Century.
Congratulations. Your literacy skills ("both" of you) seem very similar to Milk. I think you are all Milk under pseudonyms.. I understand. Must be lonely being the only one in the village who still believes the socialist twaddle.
P.S. if it helps, it's "out-manoeuvred"
[quote][p][bold]helper7[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]topdog99[/bold] wrote: Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news”[/p][/quote]Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar. And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.[/p][/quote]Not only that but union members of the socialist party, all 79 million of you. "Vote early, vote often" was the watchword of Sinn Fein/IRA but I'm sure postal voting will enable you to ensure a Miliband Century. Congratulations. Your literacy skills ("both" of you) seem very similar to Milk. I think you are all Milk under pseudonyms.. I understand. Must be lonely being the only one in the village who still believes the socialist twaddle. P.S. if it helps, it's "out-manoeuvred" Dai Rear
  • Score: -2

2:04pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

An interesting thought or two on Socialism.
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
An interesting thought or two on Socialism. 1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. 2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. 3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. 4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it! 5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -2

3:14pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Mervyn James says...

Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......
Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing...... Mervyn James
  • Score: -11

4:57pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......
Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42%
What can I get? please let on , clever Merv.
Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting.
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......[/p][/quote]Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42% What can I get? please let on , clever Merv. Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting. Dai Rear
  • Score: -4

5:02pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party....

YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark.

Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant)

I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion....
Dumbing it down for Dai Rear because its easier for the class war scum bag to understand.

Diarrhea is hereditary apparently and its in Dai's genes
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.[/p][/quote]First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party.... YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark. Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant) I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion....[/p][/quote]Dumbing it down for Dai Rear because its easier for the class war scum bag to understand. Diarrhea is hereditary apparently and its in Dai's genes Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 4

5:04pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Dai Rear wrote:
I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts.
Dumbing it down for Dai Rear because its easier for the class war scum bag to understand.

Diarrhea is hereditary apparently and its in Dai's genes
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: I don't think anything Milk, except that you say you're a Trotskyite. You are very aggressive and have no sense of humour. You probably are in a dead end job because your literacy skills are poor but that's an inference. The other statements are facts.[/p][/quote]Dumbing it down for Dai Rear because its easier for the class war scum bag to understand. Diarrhea is hereditary apparently and its in Dai's genes Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

5:24pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Are you a guillotine knitter Milk, my little socialist? Take time off from the knitting to learn decent repartee, why don't you. The above is , well, grim, even by your modest standards.
But back to the point. Welfarism as espoused by the economically illiterate Brown (only real job a 6th form college teacher) is destructive and corrupt and not even very valuable in terms of Labour votes, since the dependent class tends not to vote for anyone.
Are you a guillotine knitter Milk, my little socialist? Take time off from the knitting to learn decent repartee, why don't you. The above is , well, grim, even by your modest standards. But back to the point. Welfarism as espoused by the economically illiterate Brown (only real job a 6th form college teacher) is destructive and corrupt and not even very valuable in terms of Labour votes, since the dependent class tends not to vote for anyone. Dai Rear
  • Score: -5

5:44pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

welshmen wrote:
Milkmanofhumankindne

ss
wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Templar05 wrote:
Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .
That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.
Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more.
“Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute”

If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting.
Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity.
Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few.
It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up.

Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you.

Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes.
Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down!
However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list.
The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed.
Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
They are the problem not the solution.
And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.
First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party....

YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark.

Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant)

I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion....
Dont assume Dai your making yourself look a fool again.
I’m not an immigrant! but so what if I was.
Much to you disappointment I’m not out of work or on any benefits! But so what if I was.
I have worked for a large national company for many years and worked self employed for over 25 years! but so what if I had not.
My family have all had good educations and been to some of the best universities in the land but so what. Iv also worked proudly in the community as a volunteer but so what if I had not.
I have family members in Private Schooling! So what

You have made a lot of assumptions and made yourself look a fool.
I think I know you better than you know me but I’m not going to waste my time pointing it out because I think its plain for everyone to see.

Ukip’s manifesto is a collection of promises selected, seemingly, on the basis of twenty things that really annoy people, with no inkling of implementation method or any costings; a wish list for The Annoyed.

Scared of immigrants? Vote Ukip Dai will

Ukip is part of the group Europe of Freedom and Democracy (EFD). The group includes representatives of the Danish People’s Party, the True Finns Party, the Dutch SGP and the infamous Italian Lega Nord – all of them far-right. Dont be fooled.
Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled.
Ukip wont help the ordinary man on the street Dont Be Fooled.

..
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Templar05[/bold] wrote: Add that money to all the benefit cheats that haven't been caught = large legal crime syndicate. They would only be missing a union .[/p][/quote]That's the point. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. Its not right.[/p][/quote]Calling all ants Dont accept it get organised. Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but be under no illusion this government want you to focus on the likes of her when there are many others costing society much much more. “Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute” If your on a low wage,cant get a job or simply want our society to be respectful and honest to the majority and not the few then make darn sure your on the electoral registrar because the privileged and wealthy would rather you not be and would rather you think there’s no point in voting. Take a tip from the humble hard working Ant (see other posts) get organised have respect for your fellow citizen and don’t be afraid to join the national union of ants despite what others may tell you because the one thing greedy individuals and governments for the rich are afraid of is unity. Will this change everything? Hell no but it will improve things for the many and not just the few. It will probably always be a struggle but us Ants never give up. Or you could play into the hands of the mainly Tory run media and believe everything that’s presented to you. Attacking the poor just because they are poor is pathetic, there are bigger crooks much higher up that are getting away with not paying their share through carefully constructed loopholes. Unemployment today has been repackaged we are told Unemployment is down! However now we have people only doing a few hours a week to keep them off the unemployed list. The truth is The Working Poor are the new unemployed. Ukip are not the solution they are the problem, If anybody thinks that they will help the working class by setting on immigrants and creating jobs and reducing crime then think again. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. They are the problem not the solution. And yet despite this, the party attracts widespread working class support. The average Kipper is more likely to have finished education at 16 or under than voters of the three main parties and is less likely to be university-educated or have an income over £40,000. In explaining the UKIP phenomenon, the media enjoys waxing lyrical about disillusioned right-wing Tory voters, but far more interesting is the class background of many of the UKIP’s prospective voters: these are conservatives but with very little to be conservative about or just masses of people who have been insidiously misled DONT BE FOOLED they are just disgruntled Tories.[/p][/quote]First of Milk I would like to say sorry if your not a Traitor supporter of the Labour Party.... YES lets have the Labour Party BACK, they totally demoralised this Country to near BANKRUPTCY, imported 13 MILLION foreigners from anywhere, started two WARS where no one won, killed hundreds of thousands of MUSLIMS, not withstanding hundreds of our brave Soldiers, left us with the biggest national debt of all TIME, your Labour Party had thirteen years to fill the LOOP HOLES in our TAX system but they failed at that to, the BRITISH people were treated LIKE ANTS by your Marxist Labour Party, fed scraps, given the RED elixir of MARXIST brainwashing Party to drink and kept in the dark. Your posts seem to lean towards another Labour Government, if that is true, your either an immigrant or a Milliband wan-a-be, what did your hero Blair do, made £Millions on the deaths of thousands of fellow humans, put over a Million of our young on the dole, made the poor poorer, yet you class, you and your mates as Socialists, the same as Blair and the rest of the traitors to our Country, who also wanted to get rid of " the English are not worth saving as a RACE" as your friend Jack Straw said on one of his trips to get more Immigrant's to flood our Country. (who is an Immigrant) I hope the Marxist loving Labour Party your posts seem to defend never ever get in to Government again, you say UKIP are the Problem, are you sure, they are not in power, but compared to your Marxist Labour party I WOULD trust them for four years to run our Country, even trust the WI too, unlike your Marxist Labour Party, couldn't trust them to throw a party in a brewery, anyone and I mean anyone who VOTES for the Labour Party at the next election needs putting up against a wall and SHOT because they are and WERE THE PROBLEM, but that's just my opinion....[/p][/quote]Dont assume Dai your making yourself look a fool again. I’m not an immigrant! but so what if I was. Much to you disappointment I’m not out of work or on any benefits! But so what if I was. I have worked for a large national company for many years and worked self employed for over 25 years! but so what if I had not. My family have all had good educations and been to some of the best universities in the land but so what. Iv also worked proudly in the community as a volunteer but so what if I had not. I have family members in Private Schooling! So what You have made a lot of assumptions and made yourself look a fool. I think I know you better than you know me but I’m not going to waste my time pointing it out because I think its plain for everyone to see. Ukip’s manifesto is a collection of promises selected, seemingly, on the basis of twenty things that really annoy people, with no inkling of implementation method or any costings; a wish list for The Annoyed. Scared of immigrants? Vote Ukip Dai will Ukip is part of the group Europe of Freedom and Democracy (EFD). The group includes representatives of the Danish People’s Party, the True Finns Party, the Dutch SGP and the infamous Italian Lega Nord – all of them far-right. Dont be fooled. Nigel Farage is a former stockbroker and the leader of a party which represents the interests of the white and well-heeled. Ukip wont help the ordinary man on the street Dont Be Fooled. .. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 10

6:40pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Stevenboy says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
An interesting thought or two on Socialism.
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
Undeniable logic. Good post.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: An interesting thought or two on Socialism. 1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. 2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. 3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. 4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it! 5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.[/p][/quote]Undeniable logic. Good post. Stevenboy
  • Score: 1

7:08pm Wed 5 Feb 14

letsgobarbie says...

Dai Rear wrote:
helper7 wrote:
topdog99 wrote:
Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim.
Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown!
“just rejoice at that news”
Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar.
And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.
Not only that but union members of the socialist party, all 79 million of you. "Vote early, vote often" was the watchword of Sinn Fein/IRA but I'm sure postal voting will enable you to ensure a Miliband Century.
Congratulations. Your literacy skills ("both" of you) seem very similar to Milk. I think you are all Milk under pseudonyms.. I understand. Must be lonely being the only one in the village who still believes the socialist twaddle.
P.S. if it helps, it's "out-manoeuvred"
Didnt think we were being marked out of 1o for our spelin
shatting myself larping u sadz barstewards
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]helper7[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]topdog99[/bold] wrote: Its been very entertaining, Mr Rear has been totally out maneuvered and made to look dim. Its very encouraging for the good working class folk who seem to be getting back to their roots and finding their working class boot again. Its enough to make one want to give up Quaffing Champagne and indulge oneself in a pint of Newcastle Brown! “just rejoice at that news”[/p][/quote]Yes we are finding our boot, there are millions of us and we are getting organized and we are joining unions again and we will collectively work together and make sure we are on the electoral registrar. And we will boot out this Tory government and we wont be fooled by Ukip either.[/p][/quote]Not only that but union members of the socialist party, all 79 million of you. "Vote early, vote often" was the watchword of Sinn Fein/IRA but I'm sure postal voting will enable you to ensure a Miliband Century. Congratulations. Your literacy skills ("both" of you) seem very similar to Milk. I think you are all Milk under pseudonyms.. I understand. Must be lonely being the only one in the village who still believes the socialist twaddle. P.S. if it helps, it's "out-manoeuvred"[/p][/quote]Didnt think we were being marked out of 1o for our spelin shatting myself larping u sadz barstewards letsgobarbie
  • Score: 6

7:25pm Wed 5 Feb 14

letsgobarbie says...

UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz
UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz letsgobarbie
  • Score: 8

8:01pm Wed 5 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Stevenboy wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
An interesting thought or two on Socialism.
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
Undeniable logic. Good post.
The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong.
[quote][p][bold]Stevenboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: An interesting thought or two on Socialism. 1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. 2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. 3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. 4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it! 5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.[/p][/quote]Undeniable logic. Good post.[/p][/quote]The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong. endthelies
  • Score: -1

8:08pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Mervyn James says...

Dai Rear wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......
Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42%
What can I get? please let on , clever Merv.
Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting.
I don't believe it frankly, if you ever married had a child you would have claimed a benefit, or if you were ever unemployed etc. you must be the sole person in the UK who has never claimed a thing. You better hope you never develop a serious illness or you will be claiming for certain, the point is the benefits are there to assist those who for a variety of reasons cannot manage, (Which can be any of us let's face it). We all know there is a small percentage exploited the fact,the majority don't. If you list every fiddler the Argus has ever printed about it is insignificant compared with (A) The people that don't fiddle the system,and (B) Those who aren't claiming and should be,and (C) fails to include corporate tax dodgers, politicians, and swindling Bankers for whom we will all be paying till buggery...... and dwarfs any fraud the poor got up to....The message being never steal anything small. Most of those are the elderly, IDS is trying to rip off now by removing bus passes, cold weather payments and care support. They lived too long, we gotta do something about that.....Anyone who thinks claiming is easy as obviously never tried to ! It is bull manure the credo "We will ensure only those who deserve benefits get them..." they changed the criteria to "No-one is entitled to the benefits..."
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......[/p][/quote]Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42% What can I get? please let on , clever Merv. Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting.[/p][/quote]I don't believe it frankly, if you ever married had a child you would have claimed a benefit, or if you were ever unemployed etc. you must be the sole person in the UK who has never claimed a thing. You better hope you never develop a serious illness or you will be claiming for certain, the point is the benefits are there to assist those who for a variety of reasons cannot manage, (Which can be any of us let's face it). We all know there is a small percentage exploited the fact,the majority don't. If you list every fiddler the Argus has ever printed about it is insignificant compared with (A) The people that don't fiddle the system,and (B) Those who aren't claiming and should be,and (C) fails to include corporate tax dodgers, politicians, and swindling Bankers for whom we will all be paying till buggery...... and dwarfs any fraud the poor got up to....The message being never steal anything small. Most of those are the elderly, IDS is trying to rip off now by removing bus passes, cold weather payments and care support. They lived too long, we gotta do something about that.....Anyone who thinks claiming is easy as obviously never tried to ! It is bull manure the credo "We will ensure only those who deserve benefits get them..." they changed the criteria to "No-one is entitled to the benefits..." Mervyn James
  • Score: -4

8:14pm Wed 5 Feb 14

endthelies says...

All very true Mervyn and well put as usual.
All very true Mervyn and well put as usual. endthelies
  • Score: -1

8:32pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but
Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats?
And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon?
The Tory government want you to focus on the likes of Katie Stroud because it leads you away from the real problems this country faces and takes the heat off the rich and privileged who get away with dodging their way out of paying tax.

Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to.

The Tories and would rather you the working class did not vote and they would rather you believe in Coronation Street capers than in the real world. It would suit them very well as most greedy Tories rarely fail and are less apathetic. In the event that you pick yourself up and try to make a difference they have set you the Ukip trap and many will be fooled.
They are disgruntled Tories and worse Don’t Be Fooled Bite The Ballot.
If you don’t vote you will be ignored.

Labour has suggested including electoral registration forms in all official letters sent to young people, such as national insurance numbers and driving licence applications, in an effort to boost voter numbers. That does not mean you need to vote Labour but it does mean at least one party is trying to reach out to everyone so whoever you vote for first make sure your registered.
Katie Stroud was wrong full stop and should be punished but Who s costing us the most? benefit cheats? And who’s killing our towns and villages- Tesco? Walmart? Amazon? The Tory government want you to focus on the likes of Katie Stroud because it leads you away from the real problems this country faces and takes the heat off the rich and privileged who get away with dodging their way out of paying tax. Benefit fraud, compared to tax evasion is absolutely minute, but people in this country will except the tax evaders yet subject benefit claimants to such awful words as scroungers, when the absolute majority are not and are rightfully claiming benefits that they are fully entitled to. The Tories and would rather you the working class did not vote and they would rather you believe in Coronation Street capers than in the real world. It would suit them very well as most greedy Tories rarely fail and are less apathetic. In the event that you pick yourself up and try to make a difference they have set you the Ukip trap and many will be fooled. They are disgruntled Tories and worse Don’t Be Fooled Bite The Ballot. If you don’t vote you will be ignored. Labour has suggested including electoral registration forms in all official letters sent to young people, such as national insurance numbers and driving licence applications, in an effort to boost voter numbers. That does not mean you need to vote Labour but it does mean at least one party is trying to reach out to everyone so whoever you vote for first make sure your registered. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 6

8:36pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Bite the Ballot.

http://bitetheballot
.co.uk/
Bite the Ballot. http://bitetheballot .co.uk/ Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 5

10:52pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

endthelies wrote:
Stevenboy wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
An interesting thought or two on Socialism.
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
Undeniable logic. Good post.
The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong.
What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Stevenboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: An interesting thought or two on Socialism. 1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. 2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. 3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. 4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it! 5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.[/p][/quote]Undeniable logic. Good post.[/p][/quote]The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong.[/p][/quote]What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -2

8:02am Thu 6 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

Mervyn James wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
Mervyn James wrote:
Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......
Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42%
What can I get? please let on , clever Merv.
Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting.
I don't believe it frankly, if you ever married had a child you would have claimed a benefit, or if you were ever unemployed etc. you must be the sole person in the UK who has never claimed a thing. You better hope you never develop a serious illness or you will be claiming for certain, the point is the benefits are there to assist those who for a variety of reasons cannot manage, (Which can be any of us let's face it). We all know there is a small percentage exploited the fact,the majority don't. If you list every fiddler the Argus has ever printed about it is insignificant compared with (A) The people that don't fiddle the system,and (B) Those who aren't claiming and should be,and (C) fails to include corporate tax dodgers, politicians, and swindling Bankers for whom we will all be paying till buggery...... and dwarfs any fraud the poor got up to....The message being never steal anything small. Most of those are the elderly, IDS is trying to rip off now by removing bus passes, cold weather payments and care support. They lived too long, we gotta do something about that.....Anyone who thinks claiming is easy as obviously never tried to ! It is bull manure the credo "We will ensure only those who deserve benefits get them..." they changed the criteria to "No-one is entitled to the benefits..."
Mervyn, we're getting confused over tenses here. Yes I HAVE claimed Family Allowance, even Family Income Supplement. I've paid it back in trumps. I'd agree with you that that's what it's about, a temporary safety net, not a way of life. In passing my sons in law are ineligible for Family Allowance because they work very hard and very long hours.
You may bang on as much as you will about successful people being rewarded but the fact is that had it not been for clever people who make things and dig them up from the bowels of the earth we would still be going to starve this summer because the weather will have halved the crop. If humanity consisted of those like Stroud we'd still have flippers. I agree about the bus passes etc-if you've paid enough to cover them in tax in your working life. If not, everyone has families and friends. In short the State exists to extract our money from us, filter a chunk of it out for its acolytes and funnel the rest back as it deems fit, i.e. Stroud £oodles me £-40%.
I don't think that a disinterested observer would see that as rational and productive. But thank you for a sensible response. Refreshing after the Neanderthal Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
[quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mervyn James[/bold] wrote: Most of the posters here would not be out of place knitting at the guillotine ! What a horrible lot they are and so uninformed too, with mob rule, it goes with the territory. Everyone has benefits so we are all scroungers, frauds, and 'robbing' the workers. If you are going to demonise at least do it properly. Who cares what a 5th rate TV channel does ? they are after what they got petty sensationalism and more viewers, cutting journalism it isn't. facts were incidental, and distorted to fit the program, posters here need to get out more and STOP claiming benefits themselves, people in glass housing......[/p][/quote]Merv. I've missed out. I get nowt from the State and it takes a hefty 40% of my cash over a fairly modest sum. Lucky I'm old, else it'd be 42% What can I get? please let on , clever Merv. Can I get welfare dosh for knitting guillotines? Darn it. Should have listened at school when they taught knitting.[/p][/quote]I don't believe it frankly, if you ever married had a child you would have claimed a benefit, or if you were ever unemployed etc. you must be the sole person in the UK who has never claimed a thing. You better hope you never develop a serious illness or you will be claiming for certain, the point is the benefits are there to assist those who for a variety of reasons cannot manage, (Which can be any of us let's face it). We all know there is a small percentage exploited the fact,the majority don't. If you list every fiddler the Argus has ever printed about it is insignificant compared with (A) The people that don't fiddle the system,and (B) Those who aren't claiming and should be,and (C) fails to include corporate tax dodgers, politicians, and swindling Bankers for whom we will all be paying till buggery...... and dwarfs any fraud the poor got up to....The message being never steal anything small. Most of those are the elderly, IDS is trying to rip off now by removing bus passes, cold weather payments and care support. They lived too long, we gotta do something about that.....Anyone who thinks claiming is easy as obviously never tried to ! It is bull manure the credo "We will ensure only those who deserve benefits get them..." they changed the criteria to "No-one is entitled to the benefits..."[/p][/quote]Mervyn, we're getting confused over tenses here. Yes I HAVE claimed Family Allowance, even Family Income Supplement. I've paid it back in trumps. I'd agree with you that that's what it's about, a temporary safety net, not a way of life. In passing my sons in law are ineligible for Family Allowance because they work very hard and very long hours. You may bang on as much as you will about successful people being rewarded but the fact is that had it not been for clever people who make things and dig them up from the bowels of the earth we would still be going to starve this summer because the weather will have halved the crop. If humanity consisted of those like Stroud we'd still have flippers. I agree about the bus passes etc-if you've paid enough to cover them in tax in your working life. If not, everyone has families and friends. In short the State exists to extract our money from us, filter a chunk of it out for its acolytes and funnel the rest back as it deems fit, i.e. Stroud £oodles me £-40%. I don't think that a disinterested observer would see that as rational and productive. But thank you for a sensible response. Refreshing after the Neanderthal Milkmanofhumankindne ss Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

9:54am Thu 6 Feb 14

Mervyn James says...

I think ,most of the posters here are plants from the daily mail or Tories. Mob rule, rabid generalizations, and a total; inability to understand facts unless it suits their weird assumptions on fairness. If theyaren't at the welsh language they are demonsising old people, sick people, unemployed, our young people, and the disabled. People who are starving on benefits get it too. And they advertise the UK as a standard on human rights. Half of these posters are a concern as the mind-set appears to make hate a perfectly valid expression at others less fortunate than they are. As soon as a fraud is identified out from under their rocks they come to attack anyone who is in range.
I think ,most of the posters here are plants from the daily mail or Tories. Mob rule, rabid generalizations, and a total; inability to understand facts unless it suits their weird assumptions on fairness. If theyaren't at the welsh language they are demonsising old people, sick people, unemployed, our young people, and the disabled. People who are starving on benefits get it too. And they advertise the UK as a standard on human rights. Half of these posters are a concern as the mind-set appears to make hate a perfectly valid expression at others less fortunate than they are. As soon as a fraud is identified out from under their rocks they come to attack anyone who is in range. Mervyn James
  • Score: -2

10:08am Thu 6 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

That's quite schizophrenic Merv , I'm afraid. Last post you're sensible and this time it's all ad hominem rubbish. Other views than yours are perfectly capable of having been formed over a lifetime, and indeed formed during professional dealings with the Strouds of this world and they aren't about "demonsising" anyone.
It's not about "fortunate"; I guess you're old enough and occidental enough to know that "fortune" plays very little part. You may have noticed many contractors' vans going past you daily which bear the name of a man whose upbringing was hardly "fortunate" but who made a success of his life.
The large, constantly interfering, State is , to use a horrid cliché, not fit for purpose and the fact that the Strouds of the world think they're "owed" sums up that dysfunctionality. I won't abuse your socialist views. They're a faith like any other , but accept that other views exist and are not wrong, or blasphemous.
That's quite schizophrenic Merv , I'm afraid. Last post you're sensible and this time it's all ad hominem rubbish. Other views than yours are perfectly capable of having been formed over a lifetime, and indeed formed during professional dealings with the Strouds of this world and they aren't about "demonsising" anyone. It's not about "fortunate"; I guess you're old enough and occidental enough to know that "fortune" plays very little part. You may have noticed many contractors' vans going past you daily which bear the name of a man whose upbringing was hardly "fortunate" but who made a success of his life. The large, constantly interfering, State is , to use a horrid cliché, not fit for purpose and the fact that the Strouds of the world think they're "owed" sums up that dysfunctionality. I won't abuse your socialist views. They're a faith like any other , but accept that other views exist and are not wrong, or blasphemous. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

10:11am Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Stevenboy wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
An interesting thought or two on Socialism.
1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity.
2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.
3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.
4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it!
5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.
Undeniable logic. Good post.
The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong.
What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.
that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Stevenboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: An interesting thought or two on Socialism. 1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. 2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. 3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. 4. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it! 5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.[/p][/quote]Undeniable logic. Good post.[/p][/quote]The thing is that only a very small minority of people on benefits have never worked. Most are pensioners, or working and receiving tax benefits. Most people on benefits have worked and paid into the system. These people are doing nothing wrong by claiming what they are entitled to. Don't think otherwise because of the propaganda you've been fed by this government. Read the facts for yourselves and get some perspective on the situation. I've said this once before but I'll say it again. Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong.[/p][/quote]What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.[/p][/quote]that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day. endthelies
  • Score: 1

10:14am Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?
And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here? endthelies
  • Score: 2

10:39am Thu 6 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

endthelies wrote:
And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?
It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?[/p][/quote]It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -3

10:51am Thu 6 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

" Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong."
"What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day."
No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe.
" Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong." "What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day." No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

11:48am Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?
It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.
Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?[/p][/quote]It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.[/p][/quote]Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present. endthelies
  • Score: 2

11:50am Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Dai Rear wrote:
" Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong."
"What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day."
No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe.
People are NOT getting their rightful benefits. Disabled benefits in particular have been altered to such an extreme that genuinely ill and sick people are dying in the process of trying to get what they should be entitled to.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: " Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong." "What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day." No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe.[/p][/quote]People are NOT getting their rightful benefits. Disabled benefits in particular have been altered to such an extreme that genuinely ill and sick people are dying in the process of trying to get what they should be entitled to. endthelies
  • Score: 2

11:50am Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Dai Rear wrote:
" Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong."
"What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day."
No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe.
People are NOT getting their rightful benefits. Disabled benefits in particular have been altered to such an extreme that genuinely ill and sick people are dying in the process of trying to get what they should be entitled to.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: " Nine BILLION a year lost through tax avoidance, for which more tax is deducted from pay-packets to make up for this lost revenue and yet its the people who need the most support in this country who are being demonised. Its wrong." "What? That post isn't about benefits, it's a view on socialism. Might be an idea to read it again.that it might be, but it doesn't apply in this instance because its not happening and its not even near to happening. Unless you count the bankers and the tax evaders who steal from the country every day." No it's not deducted from wage-packets. That's the "finite quantum of spend" fallacy. Ever hear of Quantitative Easing? No one is being "demonised" (oh surely you can do better than keep using this dreadful boring badge-of -the-lefty word). They're still getting their cash, aren't they? It's the Strouds people don't like, but more to the point it's the bl**dy demoralisation that welfarism causes, that people, quite rightly, resent. And that actually includes dependents, contrary to what those of the socialist faith may believe.[/p][/quote]People are NOT getting their rightful benefits. Disabled benefits in particular have been altered to such an extreme that genuinely ill and sick people are dying in the process of trying to get what they should be entitled to. endthelies
  • Score: 4

12:02pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?
It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.
Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present.
Still missing the point. I used the child benefit example as one of disincentifising wealth makers. Think much bigger endthelies. Your support for the genuinely disabled does you credit but vast amounts of government waste, both within the welfare budget and elsewhere are unsustainable. In order to fund all these things they are having to dig ever deeper into people's wallets. Devolution and foreign aid are two examples. If you must bring it back to benefits though then the welfare system is not working. If it was, why would I have people declining full time job offers because they would lose this or that benefit (often housing benefit)? Yet those in genuine need struggle. The central point of this whole story though is, if Stroud could get away unchecked for ten years then anyone who claims they have a handle on the system is just plain lying. And an ever increasing tax take to cover up mismanagement is stupid. Whoever pays.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?[/p][/quote]It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.[/p][/quote]Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present.[/p][/quote]Still missing the point. I used the child benefit example as one of disincentifising wealth makers. Think much bigger endthelies. Your support for the genuinely disabled does you credit but vast amounts of government waste, both within the welfare budget and elsewhere are unsustainable. In order to fund all these things they are having to dig ever deeper into people's wallets. Devolution and foreign aid are two examples. If you must bring it back to benefits though then the welfare system is not working. If it was, why would I have people declining full time job offers because they would lose this or that benefit (often housing benefit)? Yet those in genuine need struggle. The central point of this whole story though is, if Stroud could get away unchecked for ten years then anyone who claims they have a handle on the system is just plain lying. And an ever increasing tax take to cover up mismanagement is stupid. Whoever pays. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -3

12:05pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking! endthelies
  • Score: 3

12:09pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?
It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.
Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present.
Still missing the point. I used the child benefit example as one of disincentifising wealth makers. Think much bigger endthelies. Your support for the genuinely disabled does you credit but vast amounts of government waste, both within the welfare budget and elsewhere are unsustainable. In order to fund all these things they are having to dig ever deeper into people's wallets. Devolution and foreign aid are two examples. If you must bring it back to benefits though then the welfare system is not working. If it was, why would I have people declining full time job offers because they would lose this or that benefit (often housing benefit)? Yet those in genuine need struggle. The central point of this whole story though is, if Stroud could get away unchecked for ten years then anyone who claims they have a handle on the system is just plain lying. And an ever increasing tax take to cover up mismanagement is stupid. Whoever pays.
The majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. should they not get what they are rightfully entitled to? I agree with you though that Stroud deserves punishment, as do all benefit cheats because it makes it easy for the government to point the finger at benefit claimants as being the biggest drain on this country, when its not true.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: And as for saying your little statement had nothing to do with benefits, please, give me some credit! Why else did you put it on here?[/p][/quote]It was actually a response to Dai and Milkman who had widened the discussion out to political principles. As for 'it's not happening here', I'm afraid it is. Even the so called Tory government are doing it. Who did they take child benefits off? Not the Mick Philpotts who are using it to fund an idle lifestyle but the people working hard to make a bit extra. The point of that post is that Socialism is fatally flawed. Once you reach a point where everyone gets the same, i.e. a flattened out society, there is no longer any incentive for those who seek greater rewards for greater effort. Where do you get your money from then? On top of 45% tax, high achievers from now on have also to pay off student loans. Add NI and other taxes to that and the incentive to do well is being stripped away. Yet it is still possible to pull £26k p.a. tax free without getting out of bed. That is bonkers.[/p][/quote]Aghh so your post was pointed at people on benefits then. But you've also lost the point of the discussion. The fact is the majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. Therefore, you're analogy of 'when half the people get the idea they do not have to work because the other half is paying' is wrong and does not apply to the present.[/p][/quote]Still missing the point. I used the child benefit example as one of disincentifising wealth makers. Think much bigger endthelies. Your support for the genuinely disabled does you credit but vast amounts of government waste, both within the welfare budget and elsewhere are unsustainable. In order to fund all these things they are having to dig ever deeper into people's wallets. Devolution and foreign aid are two examples. If you must bring it back to benefits though then the welfare system is not working. If it was, why would I have people declining full time job offers because they would lose this or that benefit (often housing benefit)? Yet those in genuine need struggle. The central point of this whole story though is, if Stroud could get away unchecked for ten years then anyone who claims they have a handle on the system is just plain lying. And an ever increasing tax take to cover up mismanagement is stupid. Whoever pays.[/p][/quote]The majority of people on benefits have paid or are still paying into the system. should they not get what they are rightfully entitled to? I agree with you though that Stroud deserves punishment, as do all benefit cheats because it makes it easy for the government to point the finger at benefit claimants as being the biggest drain on this country, when its not true. endthelies
  • Score: 3

12:48pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view. Dai Rear
  • Score: -6

1:11pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Our QA payments went to the BANKS. It won't work if we give it to the banks. It may work if it was given to the individuals who are entitled to it and then that money goes into our shops etc. It was proven in Aus that their payments to people went towards luxury goods, because it was a cash payment that was a bonus for these people. The money went into circulation that way. Now, why can't we have that here. Q.A payments are being made in this country but, in my opinion, its going to the wrong place. Give it to the people of the country and let it circulate that way.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Our QA payments went to the BANKS. It won't work if we give it to the banks. It may work if it was given to the individuals who are entitled to it and then that money goes into our shops etc. It was proven in Aus that their payments to people went towards luxury goods, because it was a cash payment that was a bonus for these people. The money went into circulation that way. Now, why can't we have that here. Q.A payments are being made in this country but, in my opinion, its going to the wrong place. Give it to the people of the country and let it circulate that way. endthelies
  • Score: 1

1:13pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

(you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )
(you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) ) endthelies
  • Score: 3

1:30pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Dai Rear says...

endthelies wrote:
(you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )
I know nothing of QA Ma'am.
So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts?
There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: (you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )[/p][/quote]I know nothing of QA Ma'am. So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts? There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member. Dai Rear
  • Score: -8

1:38pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
(you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )
I know nothing of QA Ma'am.
So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts?
There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member.
That post is totally ridiculous. I'm trying to have a meaningful discussion but you seem incapable. You were the one that brought up Q.A and I gave my opinion and now you're annoyed at me for giving it. Don't post things if you don't want others opinions on it. I never mentioned Arthur Daley or anything, just the facts of Q.A and where its paid and how its been paid in other countries.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: (you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )[/p][/quote]I know nothing of QA Ma'am. So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts? There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member.[/p][/quote]That post is totally ridiculous. I'm trying to have a meaningful discussion but you seem incapable. You were the one that brought up Q.A and I gave my opinion and now you're annoyed at me for giving it. Don't post things if you don't want others opinions on it. I never mentioned Arthur Daley or anything, just the facts of Q.A and where its paid and how its been paid in other countries. endthelies
  • Score: 4

1:47pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: 0

2:07pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
The thing is Cymru, that QA could have been paid to the masses in this country but we chose not to. We chose to pay it to the banks who save it so the money doesn't get into circulation. I haven't attacked anyone who appears to be doing better than me. I would however, argue that QA does not belong to the 5% but belongs to the ordinary taxpayer. Just my opinion though but there you go. You would obviously rather your cash be paid to the banks.
[quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]The thing is Cymru, that QA could have been paid to the masses in this country but we chose not to. We chose to pay it to the banks who save it so the money doesn't get into circulation. I haven't attacked anyone who appears to be doing better than me. I would however, argue that QA does not belong to the 5% but belongs to the ordinary taxpayer. Just my opinion though but there you go. You would obviously rather your cash be paid to the banks. endthelies
  • Score: 3

2:30pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
[quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -2

3:05pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world. endthelies
  • Score: 0

3:53pm Thu 6 Feb 14

welshmen says...

letsgobarbie wrote:
UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz
Yes if your white your a racist, go's with out saying only whites are racist's....
[quote][p][bold]letsgobarbie[/bold] wrote: UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz[/p][/quote]Yes if your white your a racist, go's with out saying only whites are racist's.... welshmen
  • Score: -9

4:00pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.[/p][/quote]Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -2

4:05pm Thu 6 Feb 14

welshmen says...

endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
This i believe would be the best way to pump real money into our economy, but what if five million people were chosen to receive £1Million pound each, attached to that would be, they would have to have a new house built by local builders in their area, a new car, all new carpets white goods etc and all British made....
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]This i believe would be the best way to pump real money into our economy, but what if five million people were chosen to receive £1Million pound each, attached to that would be, they would have to have a new house built by local builders in their area, a new car, all new carpets white goods etc and all British made.... welshmen
  • Score: -6

4:14pm Thu 6 Feb 14

welshmen says...

letsgobarbie wrote:
UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz
Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP....
[quote][p][bold]letsgobarbie[/bold] wrote: UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz[/p][/quote]Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP.... welshmen
  • Score: -8

5:26pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.
Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.[/p][/quote]Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.[/p][/quote]Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense? endthelies
  • Score: -4

5:32pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

endthelies wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
(you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )
I know nothing of QA Ma'am.
So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts?
There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member.
That post is totally ridiculous. I'm trying to have a meaningful discussion but you seem incapable. You were the one that brought up Q.A and I gave my opinion and now you're annoyed at me for giving it. Don't post things if you don't want others opinions on it. I never mentioned Arthur Daley or anything, just the facts of Q.A and where its paid and how its been paid in other countries.
He is incapable, Its no good talking to Dai he’s wound up and full of his own foolish assumptions.
He as assumed I’m an immigrant,probably thinks I’m coloured thinks I’m a Trotskyite and a snowball? that doesn’t cut any ice with me. He thinks I’m in a dead end job or rather he would like me to be, he thinks I must be on benefits I’m not but so what if I was, he has complimented me on being an ant!. He says I have poor literacy skills! Big deal so what.


I would settle for all that anyday rather than be what he clearly is and I don’t think I need say more because Dai has done it all by himself and done the Kippers no favours.
The one thing that gets up his nose is that people with the opposite views to him have the right to vote like he does.

Oh I nearly forgot Dai says I have no sense of humour!

Did you know: Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the jeans
Boom Boom!!
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: (you see I do know a little about Q.A Dai or did you think you were the only one :-) )[/p][/quote]I know nothing of QA Ma'am. So you'd vote for Miliband because he and Balls would print lots of dosh and hand it out. That's the "helicopter theory". Brave one. Would it make a difference if Arthur Daley printed the dosh in his lock up and went out and bought a lot of motors for his car lot? Or Mr Balls used it to buy 48" collar shirts? There's nothing actually preventing anyone applying for a job in a bank so it's difficult to see why the lefties get so stressed about the organisations. Hardly like having to have a dad who was a printer before you can be an NGA member.[/p][/quote]That post is totally ridiculous. I'm trying to have a meaningful discussion but you seem incapable. You were the one that brought up Q.A and I gave my opinion and now you're annoyed at me for giving it. Don't post things if you don't want others opinions on it. I never mentioned Arthur Daley or anything, just the facts of Q.A and where its paid and how its been paid in other countries.[/p][/quote]He is incapable, Its no good talking to Dai he’s wound up and full of his own foolish assumptions. He as assumed I’m an immigrant,probably thinks I’m coloured thinks I’m a Trotskyite and a snowball? that doesn’t cut any ice with me. He thinks I’m in a dead end job or rather he would like me to be, he thinks I must be on benefits I’m not but so what if I was, he has complimented me on being an ant!. He says I have poor literacy skills! Big deal so what. I would settle for all that anyday rather than be what he clearly is and I don’t think I need say more because Dai has done it all by himself and done the Kippers no favours. The one thing that gets up his nose is that people with the opposite views to him have the right to vote like he does. Oh I nearly forgot Dai says I have no sense of humour! Did you know: Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the jeans Boom Boom!! Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 10

5:52pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

welshmen wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
This i believe would be the best way to pump real money into our economy, but what if five million people were chosen to receive £1Million pound each, attached to that would be, they would have to have a new house built by local builders in their area, a new car, all new carpets white goods etc and all British made....
I think that sounds like a good way of getting the money into the economy (although I'd share it out more) Much better than having the banks save it so they can lose it all (again). As I said before. Aus recipients of the cash mostly spent it on luxury goods. Cars, holidays etc. All that money went through the tills and the profits into businesses. Now I don't pretend to be a financial wiz kid but that makes sense to me whereas the money sitting in our banks and doing nothing really doesn't.
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]This i believe would be the best way to pump real money into our economy, but what if five million people were chosen to receive £1Million pound each, attached to that would be, they would have to have a new house built by local builders in their area, a new car, all new carpets white goods etc and all British made....[/p][/quote]I think that sounds like a good way of getting the money into the economy (although I'd share it out more) Much better than having the banks save it so they can lose it all (again). As I said before. Aus recipients of the cash mostly spent it on luxury goods. Cars, holidays etc. All that money went through the tills and the profits into businesses. Now I don't pretend to be a financial wiz kid but that makes sense to me whereas the money sitting in our banks and doing nothing really doesn't. endthelies
  • Score: 4

6:03pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

welshmen wrote:
letsgobarbie wrote:
UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz
Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP....
Common knolledge to most I think. There is some really bad weather about to hit the UK Weather WARNING all you Kippers take cover there is a storm brewing: http://www.southwale
sargus.co.uk/news/10
981953.Valleys_benef
it_cheat_falsely_cla
imed___70_000/?ref=m
c
[quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]letsgobarbie[/bold] wrote: UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz[/p][/quote]Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP....[/p][/quote]Common knolledge to most I think. There is some really bad weather about to hit the UK Weather WARNING all you Kippers take cover there is a storm brewing: http://www.southwale sargus.co.uk/news/10 981953.Valleys_benef it_cheat_falsely_cla imed___70_000/?ref=m c Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 8

6:05pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Llanmartinangel says...

endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.
Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?
Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.[/p][/quote]Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.[/p][/quote]Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?[/p][/quote]Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success. Llanmartinangel
  • Score: -7

6:06pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
welshmen wrote:
letsgobarbie wrote:
UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz
Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP....
Common knolledge to most I think. There is some really bad weather about to hit the UK Weather WARNING all you Kippers take cover there is a storm brewing: http://www.southwale

sargus.co.uk/news/10

981953.Valleys_benef

it_cheat_falsely_cla

imed___70_000/?ref=m

c
Darn my computer skills.

Here is the weather forcast:
https://soundcloud.c
om/nicholas-pegg/uki
p-shipping-forecast
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]welshmen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]letsgobarbie[/bold] wrote: UKIP for all its denials Is Racist to its core ...u betz[/p][/quote]Why don't you report your racist claim to the Police you know UKIP are racist, after all it is a criminal offence, all YOU need is proof, which I take it you haven't, but the proof of you libelling UKIP is here for every body to see including UKIP....[/p][/quote]Common knolledge to most I think. There is some really bad weather about to hit the UK Weather WARNING all you Kippers take cover there is a storm brewing: http://www.southwale sargus.co.uk/news/10 981953.Valleys_benef it_cheat_falsely_cla imed___70_000/?ref=m c[/p][/quote]Darn my computer skills. Here is the weather forcast: https://soundcloud.c om/nicholas-pegg/uki p-shipping-forecast Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 21

7:17pm Thu 6 Feb 14

endthelies says...

Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.
Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?
Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success.
I have no problem with success myself. I hope my children are successful in whatever they want to achieve, however, success is not measured by money in my opinion. I was a very successful, but not very rich money wise, disability teaching and care assistant. Having said that, I loved my job and would give anything to be fit enough to return but I can't. I'm looking at being in a wheelchair within the next two years but when I needed help from the government because my work medically retired me (although I fought it for 12 months) I found I had to fight and fight to get any kind of benefit. I have paid into the system for 33 years but it took two years to get any help and only then by going to a tribunal. Maybe now people will understand why I get so upset when people call people on benefits scroungers. Ive worked with, and now ironically, I am ,a disabled person..
[quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.[/p][/quote]Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.[/p][/quote]Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?[/p][/quote]Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success.[/p][/quote]I have no problem with success myself. I hope my children are successful in whatever they want to achieve, however, success is not measured by money in my opinion. I was a very successful, but not very rich money wise, disability teaching and care assistant. Having said that, I loved my job and would give anything to be fit enough to return but I can't. I'm looking at being in a wheelchair within the next two years but when I needed help from the government because my work medically retired me (although I fought it for 12 months) I found I had to fight and fight to get any kind of benefit. I have paid into the system for 33 years but it took two years to get any help and only then by going to a tribunal. Maybe now people will understand why I get so upset when people call people on benefits scroungers. Ive worked with, and now ironically, I am ,a disabled person.. endthelies
  • Score: 2

10:52pm Thu 6 Feb 14

J90hyd says...

So what has been spent with our "the tax payers" money........Make her work!
lazy!!!
So what has been spent with our "the tax payers" money........Make her work! lazy!!! J90hyd
  • Score: -13

10:20am Sun 9 Feb 14

Milkmanofhumankindness says...

The false Welshguy has been unmasked!! the trail of political Diarrhea gave him away!

Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the Jeans … boom boom

Racism is a constant undercurrent it raises its ugly head in times of trouble then gets smashed down again be decent folk who wont be fooled by their hatred and lies.
The false Welshguy has been unmasked!! the trail of political Diarrhea gave him away! Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the Jeans … boom boom Racism is a constant undercurrent it raises its ugly head in times of trouble then gets smashed down again be decent folk who wont be fooled by their hatred and lies. Milkmanofhumankindness
  • Score: 17

11:20am Sun 9 Feb 14

Cymru Am Beth says...

endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
endthelies wrote:
Llanmartinangel wrote:
Cymru Am Beth wrote:
Dai Rear wrote:
endthelies wrote:
I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking!
Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it?
In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.
Quite.
But we don't do success and ambition in Wales.
We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.
You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.
You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.
Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.
Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?
Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success.
I have no problem with success myself. I hope my children are successful in whatever they want to achieve, however, success is not measured by money in my opinion. I was a very successful, but not very rich money wise, disability teaching and care assistant. Having said that, I loved my job and would give anything to be fit enough to return but I can't. I'm looking at being in a wheelchair within the next two years but when I needed help from the government because my work medically retired me (although I fought it for 12 months) I found I had to fight and fight to get any kind of benefit. I have paid into the system for 33 years but it took two years to get any help and only then by going to a tribunal. Maybe now people will understand why I get so upset when people call people on benefits scroungers. Ive worked with, and now ironically, I am ,a disabled person..
I don't think that anyone would argue with your getting support for your position.
I have a friend who worked hard all his life and was disabled as a result of an accident at work, for which he received no compensation.
By rooting out the fraudsters should mean that there is more money for people like you and him, but unfortunately this isn't the case.
I don't agree that people on benefits are called scroungers per se.
Only the ones that abuse the system such as the person referred to in this article.
It is these people that the anger is vented at not you.
In effect, they are stealing from the very people who are the most entitled to receive benefits. That is, people who have paid into the system like you have.
[quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Llanmartinangel[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Cymru Am Beth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]endthelies[/bold] wrote: I do now a little about quantitate easing Dai. I know that Australian citizens received cash handouts from their government and that ours went straight to the banks! The people gaining from quantitate easing in this country are the richest 5%. Now isn't that shocking![/p][/quote]Australia has almost limitless mineral wealth. We don't. Clearly if you don't think QE works for you, you won't want to vote for Miliband and Balls. Did they not want even more of it? In passing the most successful 5% pay 30% of all income tax. Wales-"Here come a toff. Let's throw a half brick at him" US-"I want to be successful and have a Cadillac" Take your pick. I'll settle for the latter view.[/p][/quote]Quite. But we don't do success and ambition in Wales. We just wallow in our own misery, attacking anyone who appears to be doing better than him or her.[/p][/quote]You have a point. If QA had been paid to everyone in the UK as in Aus, you could predict the Welsh whingers asking why bankers, higher rate taxpayers and wealthy pensioners were getting it. So Shouty Ed Balls would want to recruit civil servants in thousands to means test it. You can't win.[/p][/quote]You can't predict that LMA any more than I could. And for every time someone calls a person of means a 'toff', someone calls someone of a poorer background a whinger or a scrounger. Talk about throwing half a brick at someone because they are wealthy, there are some posters on here that would have people on benefits imprisoned!! Name calling gets you nowhere in this world.[/p][/quote]Yes you can predict it. Just listen to the lobby questioning why wealthy pensioners get freebies. The same illogical mindset exactly.[/p][/quote]Why did you say Ed balls would means test it? Unless, of coarse, you feel Labour are sure of the next election win. Or do you mean IDS would means test it because he's the man of the moment? Bit confused on that statement. Are you speaking in present or future tense?[/p][/quote]Typo. Meant to say Shouty Ed would want it means tested as he's the one with a downer on successful people. That said, governments of all colours are falling over themselves to appear hard on success.[/p][/quote]I have no problem with success myself. I hope my children are successful in whatever they want to achieve, however, success is not measured by money in my opinion. I was a very successful, but not very rich money wise, disability teaching and care assistant. Having said that, I loved my job and would give anything to be fit enough to return but I can't. I'm looking at being in a wheelchair within the next two years but when I needed help from the government because my work medically retired me (although I fought it for 12 months) I found I had to fight and fight to get any kind of benefit. I have paid into the system for 33 years but it took two years to get any help and only then by going to a tribunal. Maybe now people will understand why I get so upset when people call people on benefits scroungers. Ive worked with, and now ironically, I am ,a disabled person..[/p][/quote]I don't think that anyone would argue with your getting support for your position. I have a friend who worked hard all his life and was disabled as a result of an accident at work, for which he received no compensation. By rooting out the fraudsters should mean that there is more money for people like you and him, but unfortunately this isn't the case. I don't agree that people on benefits are called scroungers per se. Only the ones that abuse the system such as the person referred to in this article. It is these people that the anger is vented at not you. In effect, they are stealing from the very people who are the most entitled to receive benefits. That is, people who have paid into the system like you have. Cymru Am Beth
  • Score: -12

5:59pm Sun 9 Feb 14

welshmen says...

Milkmanofhumankindne
ss
wrote:
The false Welshguy has been unmasked!! the trail of political Diarrhea gave him away!

Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the Jeans … boom boom

Racism is a constant undercurrent it raises its ugly head in times of trouble then gets smashed down again be decent folk who wont be fooled by their hatred and lies.
is this post for here or "Ukip Listening", you seem to be getting confused who your insulting, is it the Christian day that your confused about, always try and get that old chestnut out, Racism, when you've lost your argument, then the insults....D--K H--D....
[quote][p][bold]Milkmanofhumankindne ss[/bold] wrote: The false Welshguy has been unmasked!! the trail of political Diarrhea gave him away! Diarrhea is hereditary it runs in the Jeans … boom boom Racism is a constant undercurrent it raises its ugly head in times of trouble then gets smashed down again be decent folk who wont be fooled by their hatred and lies.[/p][/quote]is this post for here or "Ukip Listening", you seem to be getting confused who your insulting, is it the Christian day that your confused about, always try and get that old chestnut out, Racism, when you've lost your argument, then the insults....D--K H--D.... welshmen
  • Score: -13

8:49pm Sun 9 Feb 14

Mervyn James says...

Dai Rear wrote:
That's quite schizophrenic Merv , I'm afraid. Last post you're sensible and this time it's all ad hominem rubbish. Other views than yours are perfectly capable of having been formed over a lifetime, and indeed formed during professional dealings with the Strouds of this world and they aren't about "demonsising" anyone.
It's not about "fortunate"; I guess you're old enough and occidental enough to know that "fortune" plays very little part. You may have noticed many contractors' vans going past you daily which bear the name of a man whose upbringing was hardly "fortunate" but who made a success of his life.
The large, constantly interfering, State is , to use a horrid cliché, not fit for purpose and the fact that the Strouds of the world think they're "owed" sums up that dysfunctionality. I won't abuse your socialist views. They're a faith like any other , but accept that other views exist and are not wrong, or blasphemous.
Quite prepared to accept other views, but NOT interested in a daily mail/Tory hate campaign run by mobs and media. We are talking about helping our most vulnerable not attacking them as on the same level as the very minor percentage of frauds, the DWP says only 1% itself. When did 99 become 1 ? and that isn't a maths question. It's the total absence of fact and Logic that annoys. The attacks are not made with any basis other than envy and hatred for fellow man it seems to me. Whether I am socialist or not has nothing to do with plain mis or disinformation being printed here.
[quote][p][bold]Dai Rear[/bold] wrote: That's quite schizophrenic Merv , I'm afraid. Last post you're sensible and this time it's all ad hominem rubbish. Other views than yours are perfectly capable of having been formed over a lifetime, and indeed formed during professional dealings with the Strouds of this world and they aren't about "demonsising" anyone. It's not about "fortunate"; I guess you're old enough and occidental enough to know that "fortune" plays very little part. You may have noticed many contractors' vans going past you daily which bear the name of a man whose upbringing was hardly "fortunate" but who made a success of his life. The large, constantly interfering, State is , to use a horrid cliché, not fit for purpose and the fact that the Strouds of the world think they're "owed" sums up that dysfunctionality. I won't abuse your socialist views. They're a faith like any other , but accept that other views exist and are not wrong, or blasphemous.[/p][/quote]Quite prepared to accept other views, but NOT interested in a daily mail/Tory hate campaign run by mobs and media. We are talking about helping our most vulnerable not attacking them as on the same level as the very minor percentage of frauds, the DWP says only 1% itself. When did 99 become 1 ? and that isn't a maths question. It's the total absence of fact and Logic that annoys. The attacks are not made with any basis other than envy and hatred for fellow man it seems to me. Whether I am socialist or not has nothing to do with plain mis or disinformation being printed here. Mervyn James
  • Score: -1

9:10pm Sun 9 Feb 14

endthelies says...

In my opinion, you are right Mervyn. The trouble is the constant portrayal of the 'fraudsters' on t.v programmes and press headlines is turning people against their neighbours and making people on benefits out to be the largest and most undeserving waste of government money. Never mind the facts are that this is totally untrue and that most people on benefits have actually paid into the system. I would like to see more programmes on ATOS testing and the people who are dying whilst waiting for their rightful benefits but these people are not given the smallest fraction of airtime.
In my opinion, you are right Mervyn. The trouble is the constant portrayal of the 'fraudsters' on t.v programmes and press headlines is turning people against their neighbours and making people on benefits out to be the largest and most undeserving waste of government money. Never mind the facts are that this is totally untrue and that most people on benefits have actually paid into the system. I would like to see more programmes on ATOS testing and the people who are dying whilst waiting for their rightful benefits but these people are not given the smallest fraction of airtime. endthelies
  • Score: 2

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