Gwent men spared jail after admitting racist posts on Facebook

South Wales Argus: IN COURT: Richard Orzel, 29, of Newport, left, and James Rogers, 21, of Caldicot, who admitted putting ‘corrosive’ comments about a Muslim at prayer on Facebook IN COURT: Richard Orzel, 29, of Newport, left, and James Rogers, 21, of Caldicot, who admitted putting ‘corrosive’ comments about a Muslim at prayer on Facebook

TWO Gwent men escaped a jail sentence yesterday after they admitted writing offensive comments on Facebook.

Cwmbran Magistrates’ Court heard labourer James Rogers, of Deepweir, Caldicot, wrote on his Facebook account on March 25: “What the ****? Just at Magor Services and there was a Muslim rag head praying on a mat. Makes me sick.”

His friend Richard Orzel, a plasterer of Kensington Gardens, Newport, replied to the post writing: “Spit on the ****” to which Rogers replied saying he would have “kicked the **** out of him” if there hadn’t been any CCTV around.

Police were alerted to the posts after two members of the public made complaints.

The friends were then arrested and admitted writing the posts, which have since been removed.

The men yesterday pleaded guilty to making offensive, indecent, obscene or menacing comments on a public electronic communications network on March 25.

Ian George, defending, said the comments were a “bit of banter” between the pair, but they nowrealised the seriousness of the matter and had expressed remorse. He said there was an obvious racial element to the offence, despite it not being contained in the charge, but said the man at Magor Services was not approached or subjected to any violence.

District Judge Richard Williams said the problem with these kinds of messages was that they had a degree of permanence and were capable of being seen by a number of people – at least two of whom made complaints “in a bid to register their displeasure and disgust”.

He said while the man to whom the comments referred to was probably unaware of them, Rogers and Orzel had still put “corrosive and offensive”

words into the public domain which he said caused damage to the wider society.

Rogers, 21, and Orzel, 29, were spared jail and were instead handed 28 days’ imprisonment, suspended for 12 months.

They were each also ordered to complete 200 hours unpaid work and must pay £85 court costs


Public’s help vital in tackling hate crime

SUPERINTENDENT Dave Johnson, who has responsibility for tackling hate crime for Gwent Police, said this prosecution served as a warning to individuals who commit hate crimes including, as in this case, the use of offensive language via social media messaging, that they are not immune to prosecution and will be identified.

He said: “It is heartening to know that we were alerted to this offence by concerned members of the public. It is widely acknowledged that hate crime is under-reported and, while we work very closely with our partners to encourage reporting so crimes can be investigated and the victim given the support they need, the assistance we get from the community in bringing these offences to our attention is invaluable.

“We would encourage anyone who has been a victim of hate crime or has any knowledge of a hate crime to report it to police on 101.”


EDITORIAL COMMENT: ‘Banter’ is no defence

AN INCREASING number of people are being brought before the courts for posting offensive messages on social media such as Twitter and Facebook.

Gwent men James Rogers and Richard Orzel are the latest – given suspended jail sentences yesterday for posting grossly offensivematerial about a Muslim man seen by Rogers praying atMagor Services on the M4.

Their defence solicitor described the messages between the two men as “a bit of banter” – and therein lies the problem; many people just do not understand what happens when they use social media.

People post messages believing they are only being seen by themselves and their friends. In most cases, the reality is they are publishing their thoughts to the world.

Publishing brings with it a whole host of legal issues. Editors of newspapers or magazines or websites have to stop and think twice about what they publish. So should anyone using social media.

Those who bleat about freedom of speech in these instances are utterly incorrect.

Freedom brings with it responsibility. And giving voice to your thoughts – whether that is by posting of Facebook or shouting in the street – means the laws of the land are applicable to you.

Rogers and Orzel certainly deserved to be brought before the courts for their online rantings.

Sadly they will not be the last to learn such a lesson.

Comments (39)

Please log in to enable comment sorting

9:27am Thu 21 Jun 12

Mervyn James says...

Were they banned FROM Facebook ? A strong message has to be sent out to these people and others on Twitter which is even worse. At present they are a hive of racism and abuse.
Were they banned FROM Facebook ? A strong message has to be sent out to these people and others on Twitter which is even worse. At present they are a hive of racism and abuse. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

12:18pm Thu 21 Jun 12

Jonesy1977 says...

Superintendent Dave Johnson best take a closer look then at joe public who trys to report such things to 101 only to be told in laymons terms to phone someone who actually cares. I have tried on no less than 5 different occasions to report such an untollerable thing just to be "fobbed off" I guess sometimes someone has to be hurt etc. first before such things are looked at, it's all a "CROC"
Superintendent Dave Johnson best take a closer look then at joe public who trys to report such things to 101 only to be told in laymons terms to phone someone who actually cares. I have tried on no less than 5 different occasions to report such an untollerable thing just to be "fobbed off" I guess sometimes someone has to be hurt etc. first before such things are looked at, it's all a "CROC" Jonesy1977
  • Score: 0

12:33pm Thu 21 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

Expressed remorse... yeah right. They're having a good laugh at the whole thing.

Vile, hateful, racist little boys.

No real legal consequences, but the good thing is that everyone who has read this article (and other related ones) can now recognise them for who they are and exactly what they are.
Expressed remorse... yeah right. They're having a good laugh at the whole thing. Vile, hateful, racist little boys. No real legal consequences, but the good thing is that everyone who has read this article (and other related ones) can now recognise them for who they are and exactly what they are. Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

2:44pm Thu 21 Jun 12

bridlington1 says...

As if we didn`t know where the two complaints came from....!!!
As if we didn`t know where the two complaints came from....!!! bridlington1
  • Score: 0

5:27pm Thu 21 Jun 12

jones11 says...

I could'nt agree more with the comment from Thughes111, newport dave im guesssing your squeaky clean and have never broken the law in your life! I think its absurd that you think that these two individuals are 'vile', i would be more concerned with peadophiles, rapists and murderers who roam the streets.
I could'nt agree more with the comment from Thughes111, newport dave im guesssing your squeaky clean and have never broken the law in your life! I think its absurd that you think that these two individuals are 'vile', i would be more concerned with peadophiles, rapists and murderers who roam the streets. jones11
  • Score: 0

6:48pm Thu 21 Jun 12

CM1 says...

Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.
Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest. CM1
  • Score: 0

7:10pm Thu 21 Jun 12

jones11 says...

CM1 I do not think an individuals views reflects their intelligence, very childish comment.
CM1 I do not think an individuals views reflects their intelligence, very childish comment. jones11
  • Score: 0

7:17pm Thu 21 Jun 12

chris227 says...

BRING BACK HANGING - A suspended sentence for a couple of immature remarks on facebook good god. This is the same court that fined a man £50 for a street robbery of a mobile phone a couple of months ago!!
BRING BACK HANGING - A suspended sentence for a couple of immature remarks on facebook good god. This is the same court that fined a man £50 for a street robbery of a mobile phone a couple of months ago!! chris227
  • Score: 0

7:41pm Thu 21 Jun 12

mark1985 says...

to....newport dave and cm1.

I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www.
dailymail.co.uk/news
/article-2055365/Pop
py-burning-Muslims-p
lan-new-hell-heroes-
demonstration-Novemb
er-11.html
to....newport dave and cm1. I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www. dailymail.co.uk/news /article-2055365/Pop py-burning-Muslims-p lan-new-hell-heroes- demonstration-Novemb er-11.html mark1985
  • Score: 0

7:56pm Thu 21 Jun 12

CM1 says...

Nope...mate.

A person's views do not reflect their intelligence?? Really, what does?

Afraid I don't take articles in the Mail very seriously but you could take the view that there are interesting parallels.
Nope...mate. A person's views do not reflect their intelligence?? Really, what does? Afraid I don't take articles in the Mail very seriously but you could take the view that there are interesting parallels. CM1
  • Score: 0

8:21pm Thu 21 Jun 12

rules4oneandrulesforothers says...

Newport Dave..you are a joke.. Newport Dave have you got children? I would like you to do something for me... Imagine your child, or the most important person in your life... Right are you ready ? you child/important person , they go out to war to fight for you and your country.. every day you hope and pray nothing bad happens to him / her.
Then one day you get a knock on the door ! Theres a man standing at your door wearing Army uniform.. They start by saying. we are very sorry but your son/ daughter have been killed. blown up by a bomb .
Then a week later he / her is brought back home in a coffin to the town of Wootton Bassett, then while you and you family are they watching the most important thing in your life come past you in a woodern box..
In the crowd you hear cheering and claping.. cheering and claping for joy.. Its not his friends or family.......Its the Nationality he /she was fighting a war against .. Now how does that work....do they get locked up NO, All this have totally blown out of proportion these two young lads dont deserve this .. I am not racist but do i believe whats good for the goose is good for the Gander...All what should have happen is a slap on the wrist...
Newport Dave..you are a joke.. Newport Dave have you got children? I would like you to do something for me... Imagine your child, or the most important person in your life... Right are you ready ? you child/important person , they go out to war to fight for you and your country.. every day you hope and pray nothing bad happens to him / her. Then one day you get a knock on the door ! Theres a man standing at your door wearing Army uniform.. They start by saying. we are very sorry but your son/ daughter have been killed. blown up by a bomb . Then a week later he / her is brought back home in a coffin to the town of Wootton Bassett, then while you and you family are they watching the most important thing in your life come past you in a woodern box.. In the crowd you hear cheering and claping.. cheering and claping for joy.. Its not his friends or family.......Its the Nationality he /she was fighting a war against .. Now how does that work....do they get locked up NO, All this have totally blown out of proportion these two young lads dont deserve this .. I am not racist but do i believe whats good for the goose is good for the Gander...All what should have happen is a slap on the wrist... rules4oneandrulesforothers
  • Score: 0

8:44pm Thu 21 Jun 12

Ellisknox says...

I reckon you should all grow up. This was a very very harsh sentence for these two individuals. Look at what has been done to Britain and certain people getting away with it, burnin of Poppy's etc
I reckon you should all grow up. This was a very very harsh sentence for these two individuals. Look at what has been done to Britain and certain people getting away with it, burnin of Poppy's etc Ellisknox
  • Score: 0

9:26pm Thu 21 Jun 12

jones11 says...

CM1 wrote:
Nope...mate.

A person's views do not reflect their intelligence?? Really, what does?

Afraid I don't take articles in the Mail very seriously but you could take the view that there are interesting parallels.
why comment on the article then?! Just because a person has a view on one subject that has been put in the public eye that you dont agree with how does that make them 'thick'?! look at Enoch Powell...
[quote][p][bold]CM1[/bold] wrote: Nope...mate. A person's views do not reflect their intelligence?? Really, what does? Afraid I don't take articles in the Mail very seriously but you could take the view that there are interesting parallels.[/p][/quote]why comment on the article then?! Just because a person has a view on one subject that has been put in the public eye that you dont agree with how does that make them 'thick'?! look at Enoch Powell... jones11
  • Score: 0

9:29pm Thu 21 Jun 12

jones11 says...

mark1985 wrote:
to....newport dave and cm1.

I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www.

dailymail.co.uk/news

/article-2055365/Pop

py-burning-Muslims-p

lan-new-hell-heroes-

demonstration-Novemb

er-11.html
Well said!
[quote][p][bold]mark1985[/bold] wrote: to....newport dave and cm1. I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www. dailymail.co.uk/news /article-2055365/Pop py-burning-Muslims-p lan-new-hell-heroes- demonstration-Novemb er-11.html[/p][/quote]Well said! jones11
  • Score: 0

10:14pm Thu 21 Jun 12

CM1 says...

You are not a racist but when you say, "what's good for the goose is good for the gander", I assume you mean that because the person at Magor Services was a Muslim, it would have been acceptable for that person to have been physically attacked?

Do all Welsh people shag sheep? Do you hate all Germans because of Hitler? Hate would appear to be a common factor.

If someone is so intelligent that they believe that all people of the same race, creed and religion are the same then I will happily comment. Why not comment on the article? What has Enoch Powell got to do with this case?
You are not a racist but when you say, "what's good for the goose is good for the gander", I assume you mean that because the person at Magor Services was a Muslim, it would have been acceptable for that person to have been physically attacked? Do all Welsh people shag sheep? Do you hate all Germans because of Hitler? Hate would appear to be a common factor. If someone is so intelligent that they believe that all people of the same race, creed and religion are the same then I will happily comment. Why not comment on the article? What has Enoch Powell got to do with this case? CM1
  • Score: 0

11:31pm Thu 21 Jun 12

username2 says...

CM1 please don't try to bring any kind of rational thought or considered opinion to the Argus forums, it's just not welcome (!)
CM1 please don't try to bring any kind of rational thought or considered opinion to the Argus forums, it's just not welcome (!) username2
  • Score: -2

11:43pm Thu 21 Jun 12

CM1 says...

Ha ha, quality post...you have a point! However...

To those espousing the spurious argument of Muslim fundamentalism and disgracefully relate the death of UK soldiers to justify the racism in this case, I ask this simple question; do you believe that all Muslims believe that it is acceptable to burn poppies and chant abuse at returning soldiers?
Ha ha, quality post...you have a point! However... To those espousing the spurious argument of Muslim fundamentalism and disgracefully relate the death of UK soldiers to justify the racism in this case, I ask this simple question; do you believe that all Muslims believe that it is acceptable to burn poppies and chant abuse at returning soldiers? CM1
  • Score: 0

12:53am Fri 22 Jun 12

Cymro57 says...

I wonder if a police caution would have been a cheaper and more appropriate option in this case?
I wonder if a police caution would have been a cheaper and more appropriate option in this case? Cymro57
  • Score: 0

6:05am Fri 22 Jun 12

Hevsym says...

Tha main message to these two yobs is that at least two of their facebook 'friends' or at least two people that know them well enough to take a look at their facebook pages reported them. It was their peers that were disgusted by what they wrote. Hopefully, they will learn from this.
Tha main message to these two yobs is that at least two of their facebook 'friends' or at least two people that know them well enough to take a look at their facebook pages reported them. It was their peers that were disgusted by what they wrote. Hopefully, they will learn from this. Hevsym
  • Score: 0

8:30am Fri 22 Jun 12

Mervyn James says...

Censorship is coming, it is because people are using the anonymity of the net under freedom of speech racism gets support, why should we NOT address it ? Wait until YOU are on the end of some sub-normal nerd on social sites rants, or they persecute/groom your kids, than say do not support censors or moderation.
Censorship is coming, it is because people are using the anonymity of the net under freedom of speech racism gets support, why should we NOT address it ? Wait until YOU are on the end of some sub-normal nerd on social sites rants, or they persecute/groom your kids, than say do not support censors or moderation. Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

10:28am Fri 22 Jun 12

james jackson says...

A young man saying his prayers should be commended and the two thugs got what they deserved.
Last summer two young boys (and they were boys) were sentenced to FOUR years in prison, for commenting on the riots.
They weren't involved in the riots, they just made silly comments on Facebook.
No previous record, no history of violence. And then the political editor of one of the country's "leading" broadsheets said the boys deserved to be raped in prison.
What a country!
A young man saying his prayers should be commended and the two thugs got what they deserved. Last summer two young boys (and they were boys) were sentenced to FOUR years in prison, for commenting on the riots. They weren't involved in the riots, they just made silly comments on Facebook. No previous record, no history of violence. And then the political editor of one of the country's "leading" broadsheets said the boys deserved to be raped in prison. What a country! james jackson
  • Score: 0

12:38pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

jones11 wrote:
I could'nt agree more with the comment from Thughes111, newport dave im guesssing your squeaky clean and have never broken the law in your life! I think its absurd that you think that these two individuals are 'vile', i would be more concerned with peadophiles, rapists and murderers who roam the streets.
So we only need to go after Peadophiles and rapists and murderers?
Okay, let's let all the racist people who post the disgusting filth like these boys did get away with it. Yep, that'll really help. Well done.

You clearly have some serious issues if you think things like that should have no consequences. The BNP would love you.
[quote][p][bold]jones11[/bold] wrote: I could'nt agree more with the comment from Thughes111, newport dave im guesssing your squeaky clean and have never broken the law in your life! I think its absurd that you think that these two individuals are 'vile', i would be more concerned with peadophiles, rapists and murderers who roam the streets.[/p][/quote]So we only need to go after Peadophiles and rapists and murderers? Okay, let's let all the racist people who post the disgusting filth like these boys did get away with it. Yep, that'll really help. Well done. You clearly have some serious issues if you think things like that should have no consequences. The BNP would love you. Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

12:50pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

CM1 wrote:
Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.
Beautifully put CM1.

Someone kneeling on a mat praying makes someone sick and if there were no cctv he'd have had the **** kicked out of him.

We are clearly dealing with two really nice boys here. Incredible to see people trying (and failing badly) to defend the indefensible.
[quote][p][bold]CM1[/bold] wrote: Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.[/p][/quote]Beautifully put CM1. Someone kneeling on a mat praying makes someone sick and if there were no cctv he'd have had the **** kicked out of him. We are clearly dealing with two really nice boys here. Incredible to see people trying (and failing badly) to defend the indefensible. Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

12:55pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

mark1985 wrote:
to....newport dave and cm1.

I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www.

dailymail.co.uk/news

/article-2055365/Pop

py-burning-Muslims-p

lan-new-hell-heroes-

demonstration-Novemb

er-11.html
Seen that before Mark. They are clearly just as bad as any other racist. Still doesn't excuse the remarks made by these two clowns.

Are you saying that the behaviour of someone else excuses everything?

A racist is a racist regardless of skin colour or religion.
[quote][p][bold]mark1985[/bold] wrote: to....newport dave and cm1. I think you two are going a bit overboard on here for a silly comment made on a social networking site, im not a racist but just take a look at this and tell me what you think....http://www. dailymail.co.uk/news /article-2055365/Pop py-burning-Muslims-p lan-new-hell-heroes- demonstration-Novemb er-11.html[/p][/quote]Seen that before Mark. They are clearly just as bad as any other racist. Still doesn't excuse the remarks made by these two clowns. Are you saying that the behaviour of someone else excuses everything? A racist is a racist regardless of skin colour or religion. Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

1:14pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

rules4oneandrulesfor
others
wrote:
Newport Dave..you are a joke.. Newport Dave have you got children? I would like you to do something for me... Imagine your child, or the most important person in your life... Right are you ready ? you child/important person , they go out to war to fight for you and your country.. every day you hope and pray nothing bad happens to him / her.
Then one day you get a knock on the door ! Theres a man standing at your door wearing Army uniform.. They start by saying. we are very sorry but your son/ daughter have been killed. blown up by a bomb .
Then a week later he / her is brought back home in a coffin to the town of Wootton Bassett, then while you and you family are they watching the most important thing in your life come past you in a woodern box..
In the crowd you hear cheering and claping.. cheering and claping for joy.. Its not his friends or family.......Its the Nationality he /she was fighting a war against .. Now how does that work....do they get locked up NO, All this have totally blown out of proportion these two young lads dont deserve this .. I am not racist but do i believe whats good for the goose is good for the Gander...All what should have happen is a slap on the wrist...
So you are saying it's alright to post racist comments because of someone else doing it?

You only have to look at the Westboro Baptist Church in America to see how insane people can be. The people in your scenario are no different. People who want to hate for whatever reason (religion, colour, politics etc).

The point is that just because nutters elsewhere do it doesn't mean we should all join in.

As for the last bit, a slap on the wrist does no good. The state society is in will tell you that. Nobody is afraid of the law anymore (and for good reason).
[quote][p][bold]rules4oneandrulesfor others[/bold] wrote: Newport Dave..you are a joke.. Newport Dave have you got children? I would like you to do something for me... Imagine your child, or the most important person in your life... Right are you ready ? you child/important person , they go out to war to fight for you and your country.. every day you hope and pray nothing bad happens to him / her. Then one day you get a knock on the door ! Theres a man standing at your door wearing Army uniform.. They start by saying. we are very sorry but your son/ daughter have been killed. blown up by a bomb . Then a week later he / her is brought back home in a coffin to the town of Wootton Bassett, then while you and you family are they watching the most important thing in your life come past you in a woodern box.. In the crowd you hear cheering and claping.. cheering and claping for joy.. Its not his friends or family.......Its the Nationality he /she was fighting a war against .. Now how does that work....do they get locked up NO, All this have totally blown out of proportion these two young lads dont deserve this .. I am not racist but do i believe whats good for the goose is good for the Gander...All what should have happen is a slap on the wrist...[/p][/quote]So you are saying it's alright to post racist comments because of someone else doing it? You only have to look at the Westboro Baptist Church in America to see how insane people can be. The people in your scenario are no different. People who want to hate for whatever reason (religion, colour, politics etc). The point is that just because nutters elsewhere do it doesn't mean we should all join in. As for the last bit, a slap on the wrist does no good. The state society is in will tell you that. Nobody is afraid of the law anymore (and for good reason). Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

1:54pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Gareth says...

It's so sad to see the direction of debate on this forum.

Actually, it's not debate at all is it. It's a news article designed to draw in comments from the polarised readers: a) the "i'm not racist but will justify those who are racist"; and b) "their own fault, so throw away the key".

The SWA did it last year, got the same angry arguments, and ended up pulling the comments section because thought that personal attacks and swearing were a good substitute for reasoned grown-up argument.

So we're back here again; and stories like this will ensure that no reasonable debate - with people giving reasoned arguments for their view, or willing to listen to a critique or others' arguments - will ever happen.
It's so sad to see the direction of debate on this forum. Actually, it's not debate at all is it. It's a news article designed to draw in comments from the polarised readers: a) the "i'm not racist but will justify those who are racist"; and b) "their own fault, so throw away the key". The SWA did it last year, got the same angry arguments, and ended up pulling the comments section because thought that personal attacks and swearing were a good substitute for reasoned grown-up argument. So we're back here again; and stories like this will ensure that no reasonable debate - with people giving reasoned arguments for their view, or willing to listen to a critique or others' arguments - will ever happen. Gareth
  • Score: 0

1:56pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Howie' says...

Newport Dave, well said mate I agree with everything you have posted. I do not understand the mentality of anyone trying to stick up for those two idiots especially as they seem to acknowledge they committed a crime by pleading guilty. If they learn nothing else from this case & I seriously doubt they will, I think they wont be rushing to put their obscene views on Facebook anytime soon.
Newport Dave, well said mate I agree with everything you have posted. I do not understand the mentality of anyone trying to stick up for those two idiots especially as they seem to acknowledge they committed a crime by pleading guilty. If they learn nothing else from this case & I seriously doubt they will, I think they wont be rushing to put their obscene views on Facebook anytime soon. Howie'
  • Score: 0

2:04pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Croesychick says...

What a pair of Plonkers......I wonder what their Employers made of the situation?....
What a pair of Plonkers......I wonder what their Employers made of the situation?.... Croesychick
  • Score: 0

2:27pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Kevin Ward - Editor says...

Unfortunately - and perhaps ironically given the subject matter of the story - we have had to delete a number of comments due to unacceptable language being used.
Posters should remember that when they register to comment on this site they sign up to our terms and conditions.
Please read them. If you are unable to post without breaking these terms and conditions then please do not post on this site.
Thank you.

Kevin Ward
EDITOR
SOUTH WALES ARGUS
Unfortunately - and perhaps ironically given the subject matter of the story - we have had to delete a number of comments due to unacceptable language being used. Posters should remember that when they register to comment on this site they sign up to our terms and conditions. Please read them. If you are unable to post without breaking these terms and conditions then please do not post on this site. Thank you. Kevin Ward EDITOR SOUTH WALES ARGUS Kevin Ward - Editor
  • Score: 0

3:19pm Fri 22 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

Kevin Ward - Editor wrote:
Unfortunately - and perhaps ironically given the subject matter of the story - we have had to delete a number of comments due to unacceptable language being used.
Posters should remember that when they register to comment on this site they sign up to our terms and conditions.
Please read them. If you are unable to post without breaking these terms and conditions then please do not post on this site.
Thank you.

Kevin Ward
EDITOR
SOUTH WALES ARGUS
No problem with that Mr Editor.

Personally I'm more than happy to leave a lot of the stuff up there as it speaks volumes about the person who writes it and they always end up looking stupid. However, on this site the T&Cs are clear, and, unlike a sports forum, there are limits.

When subject matter such as this topic appears, there will invariably be people who can't convey their thoughts without letting slip, especially when they are possibly close freinds or relatives of the subjects (or the subjects themselves in certain cases).
[quote][p][bold]Kevin Ward - Editor[/bold] wrote: Unfortunately - and perhaps ironically given the subject matter of the story - we have had to delete a number of comments due to unacceptable language being used. Posters should remember that when they register to comment on this site they sign up to our terms and conditions. Please read them. If you are unable to post without breaking these terms and conditions then please do not post on this site. Thank you. Kevin Ward EDITOR SOUTH WALES ARGUS[/p][/quote]No problem with that Mr Editor. Personally I'm more than happy to leave a lot of the stuff up there as it speaks volumes about the person who writes it and they always end up looking stupid. However, on this site the T&Cs are clear, and, unlike a sports forum, there are limits. When subject matter such as this topic appears, there will invariably be people who can't convey their thoughts without letting slip, especially when they are possibly close freinds or relatives of the subjects (or the subjects themselves in certain cases). Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

12:03pm Sat 23 Jun 12

Mervyn James says...

Ellisknox wrote:
I reckon you should all grow up. This was a very very harsh sentence for these two individuals. Look at what has been done to Britain and certain people getting away with it, burnin of Poppy's etc
I agree there are abusers that get away with it, this doesn't mean what is good for the goose etc, that makes us as bad as them. we should blame where appropriately, Europea, and the Human rights freedom to abuse for some, laws....
[quote][p][bold]Ellisknox[/bold] wrote: I reckon you should all grow up. This was a very very harsh sentence for these two individuals. Look at what has been done to Britain and certain people getting away with it, burnin of Poppy's etc[/p][/quote]I agree there are abusers that get away with it, this doesn't mean what is good for the goose etc, that makes us as bad as them. we should blame where appropriately, Europea, and the Human rights freedom to abuse for some, laws.... Mervyn James
  • Score: 0

6:38pm Sat 23 Jun 12

CM1 says...

Sometimes you just have to call a knuckle-dragger a knuckle-dragger I'm afraid. These people need to understand that those with any modicum of intelligence will simply not accept this behaviour.
Sometimes you just have to call a knuckle-dragger a knuckle-dragger I'm afraid. These people need to understand that those with any modicum of intelligence will simply not accept this behaviour. CM1
  • Score: 0

3:19am Sun 24 Jun 12

iandfox says...

CM1 wrote:
Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.
I wonder if there was no cctv would they have done anything,my guess is no and it was just bravardo on their part.Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way.As for praying in a car park,why?.Anyone who wants to openly pray to a make believe deity does not deserve but is open to ridicule and comments.I don't mean only their god,religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths.I am not excusing their actions but this was taken to far.A warning would have been enough and the remarks removed.
[quote][p][bold]CM1[/bold] wrote: Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.[/p][/quote]I wonder if there was no cctv would they have done anything,my guess is no and it was just bravardo on their part.Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way.As for praying in a car park,why?.Anyone who wants to openly pray to a make believe deity does not deserve but is open to ridicule and comments.I don't mean only their god,religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths.I am not excusing their actions but this was taken to far.A warning would have been enough and the remarks removed. iandfox
  • Score: 0

5:35pm Tue 26 Jun 12

pds says...

iandfox wrote:
CM1 wrote:
Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.
I wonder if there was no cctv would they have done anything,my guess is no and it was just bravardo on their part.Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way.As for praying in a car park,why?.Anyone who wants to openly pray to a make believe deity does not deserve but is open to ridicule and comments.I don't mean only their god,religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths.I am not excusing their actions but this was taken to far.A warning would have been enough and the remarks removed.
iandfox wrote:Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way


Their exact words are quoted in the article above. Not much room for "taking them the wrong way" I think.

iandfox wrote:As for praying in a car park,why?


Because the religion dictates that followers should pray at set times of the day. If this fella happened to be driving at such a time, he would probably have planned his journey to ensure he could pull over at the services for prayer time. Is that so unreasonable that violence should be suggested?


iandfox wrote: religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths


Does that mean we are entitled to threaten Aled Jones when he presents Songs of Praise on TV? Or perhaps we should ban rugby supporters from clasping their hands together during a match?
[quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]CM1[/bold] wrote: Clearly these 'kids' are not the sharpest tools in the box. Unfortunately there is not much that can be done when people are simply too thick to grasp sense. If someone kneeling on a mat makes you "sick" then you probably need to book an appointment with a psychiatrist soonest.[/p][/quote]I wonder if there was no cctv would they have done anything,my guess is no and it was just bravardo on their part.Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way.As for praying in a car park,why?.Anyone who wants to openly pray to a make believe deity does not deserve but is open to ridicule and comments.I don't mean only their god,religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths.I am not excusing their actions but this was taken to far.A warning would have been enough and the remarks removed.[/p][/quote][quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote:Hasn't everyone at some point made a comment about something or someone that doesn't concern them that could be,if overheard,taken the wrong way[/p][/quote] Their exact words are quoted in the article above. Not much room for "taking them the wrong way" I think. [quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote:As for praying in a car park,why?[/p][/quote] Because the religion dictates that followers should pray at set times of the day. If this fella happened to be driving at such a time, he would probably have planned his journey to ensure he could pull over at the services for prayer time. Is that so unreasonable that violence should be suggested? [quote][p][bold]iandfox[/bold] wrote: religion should be exercised in private,this applies to all faiths[/p][/quote] Does that mean we are entitled to threaten Aled Jones when he presents Songs of Praise on TV? Or perhaps we should ban rugby supporters from clasping their hands together during a match? pds
  • Score: 0

11:15pm Tue 26 Jun 12

Jonesy1977 says...

No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??
No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else?? Jonesy1977
  • Score: 0

2:40pm Wed 27 Jun 12

Newport Dave says...

Jonesy1977 wrote:
No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??
So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations.
There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law.
Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony?
Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public.
Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not.
[quote][p][bold]Jonesy1977[/bold] wrote: No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??[/p][/quote]So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations. There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law. Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony? Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public. Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not. Newport Dave
  • Score: 0

3:06pm Wed 27 Jun 12

Gareth says...

Newport Dave wrote:
Jonesy1977 wrote:
No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??
So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations.
There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law.
Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony?
Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public.
Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not.
Careful fella, you've lapsed into reasoned, coherent argument.

Remember: this is a SWA comments section. Just shout, scream and point your finger at someone who is different and blame them for something. Anything.
[quote][p][bold]Newport Dave[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jonesy1977[/bold] wrote: No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??[/p][/quote]So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations. There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law. Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony? Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public. Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not.[/p][/quote]Careful fella, you've lapsed into reasoned, coherent argument. Remember: this is a SWA comments section. Just shout, scream and point your finger at someone who is different and blame them for something. Anything. Gareth
  • Score: 0

12:04am Thu 28 Jun 12

CM1 says...

Indeed, it doesn't take long to expose the rampant hypocrisy and lack of reasoned thought in such views.
Indeed, it doesn't take long to expose the rampant hypocrisy and lack of reasoned thought in such views. CM1
  • Score: 0

11:51am Sat 30 Jun 12

Jonesy1977 says...

Gareth wrote:
Newport Dave wrote:
Jonesy1977 wrote:
No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??
So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations.
There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law.
Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony?
Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public.
Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not.
Careful fella, you've lapsed into reasoned, coherent argument.

Remember: this is a SWA comments section. Just shout, scream and point your finger at someone who is different and blame them for something. Anything.
Lol :-) I guess some if not all of you needs to find something else to do with your time, everyone knows what i'm saying and i'm sure it doesn't have to be scrutinised and replied to, cause YOUR opinions don't mean Jack to me as i'm sure mine don't mean Jack to you. The bottom line is if you or me saw a man praying on a prayer mat in the middle of a car park somewhere we'd think he/she was Crazy but we would let him/her get on with it so why all these silly wastes of time commenting on what was ultimately deserved punishment for these two lads (and yes this will be the last time i comment on here) thank you and have a nice life everyone :-)
[quote][p][bold]Gareth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Newport Dave[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jonesy1977[/bold] wrote: No....we just simply turn over the T.V. Channel lol, But Seriously I also Believe What i Believe, Whether it's Religion, or Just life in general and i dont show myself up by pushing any of this onto others so why cant anyone else??[/p][/quote]So, following that logic, we should have no Christmas trees or decorations on public display in shops and streets or even in house windows where they can be seen from the outside (these things are offensive to certain other religions). Likewise with hot cross buns which also have religious connotations. There are MANY things that would not be allowed if you went down that road. If people can't accept religious (and racial) diversity, they need to stay at home with the curtains shut, as freedom of religious expression is not against the law. Should our funerals also be done behind big curtains up the cemetery just incase someone passing by is offended by our religious ceremony? Should we make it illegal for the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses to talk to people in the streets and shopping centres for the purpose of practising and broadcasting their religion, and of course you'd then have to ban the Salvation Army from doing all the good work they do in public. Unless you want to live in what would become akin to Nazi Germany, you HAVE to let people the freedom to express and practise their religion in public whether you have religious beliefs of your own or not.[/p][/quote]Careful fella, you've lapsed into reasoned, coherent argument. Remember: this is a SWA comments section. Just shout, scream and point your finger at someone who is different and blame them for something. Anything.[/p][/quote]Lol :-) I guess some if not all of you needs to find something else to do with your time, everyone knows what i'm saying and i'm sure it doesn't have to be scrutinised and replied to, cause YOUR opinions don't mean Jack to me as i'm sure mine don't mean Jack to you. The bottom line is if you or me saw a man praying on a prayer mat in the middle of a car park somewhere we'd think he/she was Crazy but we would let him/her get on with it so why all these silly wastes of time commenting on what was ultimately deserved punishment for these two lads (and yes this will be the last time i comment on here) thank you and have a nice life everyone :-) Jonesy1977
  • Score: 0

Comments are closed on this article.

click2find

About cookies

We want you to enjoy your visit to our website. That's why we use cookies to enhance your experience. By staying on our website you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more about the cookies we use.

I agree