Scarlets 24 Dragons 13

South Wales Argus: Adam Hughes' try was not enough for the Dragons at Parc y Scarlets Adam Hughes' try was not enough for the Dragons at Parc y Scarlets

NEWPORT Gwent Dragons lost their ninth league game in a row against the Scarlets after an inept forward performance in a damp squib of a derby.

What should really worry Darren Edwards’ men is that they were taken apart by a Scarlets eight who hardly set the world on fire.

The Dragons have never won at Parc y Scarlets and if they don’t improve quickly, they never will.

The good news for Welsh rugby - after another terrible Pro 12 advert - is that 19-year-old Scarlets tighthead prop Samson Lee is a top prospect and he tormented the Dragons in the scrum.

The visitors had started well in appalling conditions on a dreadful night in Llanelli and they went into the lead thanks to a beautifully struck penalty from near half way by outside-half Steffan Jones after nine minutes.

But he went from hero to villain in the next few minutes after two of his kicks went out on the full to cost the visitors huge swathes of territory.

Former Dragon Aled Thomas, picked ahead of Wales’ first choice No 10 Rhys Priestland, put the hosts back on level terms with a penalty of his own a few minutes later.

The Scarlets started to get the upper hand with their full back Liam Williams showing characteristic adventure to probe the Dragons’ defence.

On 25 minutes there was a bizarre sequence of events that cost the Dragons dearly and will no doubt feature on Question of Sport’s ‘What Happened Next ?’ sooner rather than later.

Scarlets fly half Thomas looked to have missed an easy penalty but with the visitors sleeping, thinking the kick had gone over, another ex-Dragons in centre Gareth Maule followed up and pounced on the ball.

The game was then stopped for several minutes as referee Nigel Owens asked television match official Gareth Simmonds to rule on whether the penalty had gone through the posts.

When he decided it hadn’t, Owens then asked him to adjudicate if Maule had scored a try with Simmonds giving the Scarlets the thumbs up.

Thomas then really rubbed the Dragons’ noses in it by nailing the touchline conversion.

The Dragons had said before the game they would target the Scarlets’ scrum which is prone to be flaky against the big boys.

But the sad fact is, the visitors aren’t anywhere near the league of the Ospreys front row who shunted last night’s visitors around Parc y Scarlets last month.

With just 30 per cent territory and possession in the first 40 minutes, the Dragons were under terrible pressure and Thomas added two more penalties before half-time, as well as missing another sitter, to give them a well-deserved 16-3 lead.

The second half was just as shocking for the visitors as well as the fans.

The Dragons’ lineout joined their malfunctioning scrum after replacement hooker Hugh Gustafson failed to find his rhythm when he replaced Steve Jones.

Chances were few and far between for the poor Dragons, outside half Steffan Jones fluffing a drop kick attempt in front of the posts just outside the Scarlets 22.

The Dragons however managed to score the first points of another atrocious second period when wing Tom Prydie slotted over a 60th minute penalty to make it 16-6 and keep them in the game.

The Gwent region where given a lifeline when it was the Scarlets’ turn at a defensive calamity when centre Scott Williams made a complete hash of trying to ground a kick through by Dragons full back Dan Evans on the greasy turf.

Adam Hughes followed up well and pounce on the ball to score a try after 63 minutes that was beautifully converted by Prydie.

A panicking Scarlets wondered how on earth they were leading by just three points but disaster struck minutes later for the Dragons when they were again destroyed in the scrum.

After being pushed off their own ball, scrum half Jonathan Evans was sin binned for taking out Josh Turnbull in the ensuing carnage and replacement Priestland kicked an easy penalty.

There was a fairytale return for Scarlet Morgan Stoddart, making his first appearance since a horrendous double leg break sustained playing for Wales against England at Twickenham in a pre-World Cup defeat at Twickenham in August 2011.

The full back/wing nearly scored after a wonderful run before going over in the corner in the 71st minute to eliminate slim Dragons hopes of a comeback.

Comments (37)

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9:38pm Fri 5 Oct 12

Euwan Usami says...

It's a pity that the real talent we have in the side are made to look like mugs every week by a poor pack. We knew it before the season started to be fair. Wonder how many fans we will lose before something is done?
It's a pity that the real talent we have in the side are made to look like mugs every week by a poor pack. We knew it before the season started to be fair. Wonder how many fans we will lose before something is done? Euwan Usami

10:25pm Fri 5 Oct 12

Rugby Warrior Paulo says...

I wish I had something constructive to say. Very amateur display by the Dragons somes it up for me.
I wish I had something constructive to say. Very amateur display by the Dragons somes it up for me. Rugby Warrior Paulo

10:30pm Fri 5 Oct 12

Dai the Milk says...

They actually have some talented (and probably frustrated) backs. No scrum, no really effective lineout. How Samson destroyed their scrum was shocking. A nineteen year old boy. The Scarlets will have a pasting up front next week in Clermont. This puts it all in perspective.
They actually have some talented (and probably frustrated) backs. No scrum, no really effective lineout. How Samson destroyed their scrum was shocking. A nineteen year old boy. The Scarlets will have a pasting up front next week in Clermont. This puts it all in perspective. Dai the Milk

10:51pm Fri 5 Oct 12

mep says...

I dont understand why many of these players are paid for such inept performances week in week out.
It does answer the question of why the 'regions' are all in financial difficulties.
I dont understand why many of these players are paid for such inept performances week in week out. It does answer the question of why the 'regions' are all in financial difficulties. mep

11:37pm Fri 5 Oct 12

Oddjob says...

Close but no cigar. Llanelli are a shadow of their former selves luckily for Gwent.
Close but no cigar. Llanelli are a shadow of their former selves luckily for Gwent. Oddjob

7:32am Sat 6 Oct 12

kalwales@hotmail.com says...

its NOT the players fault its the BOARD & Management Teams Fault, you Fans are being taken for mugs by false promises from the Region Heirarchy and you fans need to do something about it, i have nothing but admiration for the players because teh negativity comeing from above and behind the scenes is affecting the players !!
its NOT the players fault its the BOARD & Management Teams Fault, you Fans are being taken for mugs by false promises from the Region Heirarchy and you fans need to do something about it, i have nothing but admiration for the players because teh negativity comeing from above and behind the scenes is affecting the players !! kalwales@hotmail.com

8:56am Sat 6 Oct 12

East Newport Dave says...

Edwards cannot get it into his skull that the team cannot function without a solid front row. The lines out and scrums were a joke. He recruits in gazelles when we need bulls. He is destroying the region and the longer he stays the more difficult his successor will find it to pull things around. My guess is that Edwards will stay because the WRU have a say. They want the Dragons as a development region and Edwards is the puppet. Edwards and Beale need to be shown the door.
Edwards cannot get it into his skull that the team cannot function without a solid front row. The lines out and scrums were a joke. He recruits in gazelles when we need bulls. He is destroying the region and the longer he stays the more difficult his successor will find it to pull things around. My guess is that Edwards will stay because the WRU have a say. They want the Dragons as a development region and Edwards is the puppet. Edwards and Beale need to be shown the door. East Newport Dave

9:18am Sat 6 Oct 12

exilemike says...

Difficult to be positive,they appear to get worse year on year.Still not got a competitive pack,arguably this region has continually been the worst of the "proper sides" since professional rugby came into being.A period of quiet contemplation followed by a plan to dismantle would be a good idea for the people running the show.The last 10 years have certainly showed they have no clue as to what is required.
Difficult to be positive,they appear to get worse year on year.Still not got a competitive pack,arguably this region has continually been the worst of the "proper sides" since professional rugby came into being.A period of quiet contemplation followed by a plan to dismantle would be a good idea for the people running the show.The last 10 years have certainly showed they have no clue as to what is required. exilemike

9:39am Sat 6 Oct 12

Doberman1 says...

Another week, another inept performance against at best an average side. Non existent scrum pushed around by a lad barely out of school. My feelings on DE are well documented, we can be better than this but he needs to be replaced. I am sure Robert S will point to the officiating shambles in the first half as a catalyst for defeat, but I ask you again Robert please offer me something to suggest I am wrong about DE or are we still playing the waiting game in the hope he will get it right?
Another week, another inept performance against at best an average side. Non existent scrum pushed around by a lad barely out of school. My feelings on DE are well documented, we can be better than this but he needs to be replaced. I am sure Robert S will point to the officiating shambles in the first half as a catalyst for defeat, but I ask you again Robert please offer me something to suggest I am wrong about DE or are we still playing the waiting game in the hope he will get it right? Doberman1

9:58am Sat 6 Oct 12

the dork says...

lousey weather
lousey weather the dork

9:59am Sat 6 Oct 12

Monster Munch McCoy says...

First of all the try that wasn't. Ball hits posts on right hand side and lands 5 to 6 yards behind the goal line on the left hands side. Therefore unless the ball has had more curve than and a very bendy bananna it has gone through the post. I cant believe 4 match officials have not picked that up (totally inept).
However not as inept as the Dragons performance. Scrum constantly in reverse, line out a shambles and no aggression in the tackles. It was men v boys. The Sacrlets were poor and a better team, of which there are plenty, would of put a bucket load more points on us.
Good picture however on TV of DE on his macbook once again. I think the WRU had just sent him an e-mail to congratulate him on pushing the region further down the development path. They have certainly picked the right man for the job.
First of all the try that wasn't. Ball hits posts on right hand side and lands 5 to 6 yards behind the goal line on the left hands side. Therefore unless the ball has had more curve than and a very bendy bananna it has gone through the post. I cant believe 4 match officials have not picked that up (totally inept). However not as inept as the Dragons performance. Scrum constantly in reverse, line out a shambles and no aggression in the tackles. It was men v boys. The Sacrlets were poor and a better team, of which there are plenty, would of put a bucket load more points on us. Good picture however on TV of DE on his macbook once again. I think the WRU had just sent him an e-mail to congratulate him on pushing the region further down the development path. They have certainly picked the right man for the job. Monster Munch McCoy

11:23am Sat 6 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

There were three very poor decisions that went against the Dragons last night. Firstly the try that wasn't then the kick that was touched by a Scarlet which the touch judge correctly indicated to be over rule by the ref on advice from the crowd, have already tweeted the ref on this issue but no response yet (not holding my breath though). Thirdly the Scarlets prop was continuously boring in at right angles and disrupting the Dragons front row. You can say that was because the Dragons front row was weak, but not many front rows can cope with that for long.

Scrums need far stricter control by match officials as there is far too much law breaking going on, balls put in crooked, into the second row, boring in and taking the scrum down when the ball is lost. Just about every side do one or more of the foregoing while the hooker never or at best rarely sticks for the ball because it never goes near them.

Overall the ref had a god game last but was let down very badly by the night TMO. Showed a lot of common sense at the end by really ignoring his t judge's flag for a meaningless offence but had to award a penalty so the t judge was not offended.
There were three very poor decisions that went against the Dragons last night. Firstly the try that wasn't then the kick that was touched by a Scarlet which the touch judge correctly indicated to be over rule by the ref on advice from the crowd, have already tweeted the ref on this issue but no response yet (not holding my breath though). Thirdly the Scarlets prop was continuously boring in at right angles and disrupting the Dragons front row. You can say that was because the Dragons front row was weak, but not many front rows can cope with that for long. Scrums need far stricter control by match officials as there is far too much law breaking going on, balls put in crooked, into the second row, boring in and taking the scrum down when the ball is lost. Just about every side do one or more of the foregoing while the hooker never or at best rarely sticks for the ball because it never goes near them. Overall the ref had a god game last but was let down very badly by the night TMO. Showed a lot of common sense at the end by really ignoring his t judge's flag for a meaningless offence but had to award a penalty so the t judge was not offended. Robert Shillabeer

11:44am Sat 6 Oct 12

Monster Munch McCoy says...

Robert Shillabeer wrote:
There were three very poor decisions that went against the Dragons last night. Firstly the try that wasn't then the kick that was touched by a Scarlet which the touch judge correctly indicated to be over rule by the ref on advice from the crowd, have already tweeted the ref on this issue but no response yet (not holding my breath though). Thirdly the Scarlets prop was continuously boring in at right angles and disrupting the Dragons front row. You can say that was because the Dragons front row was weak, but not many front rows can cope with that for long.

Scrums need far stricter control by match officials as there is far too much law breaking going on, balls put in crooked, into the second row, boring in and taking the scrum down when the ball is lost. Just about every side do one or more of the foregoing while the hooker never or at best rarely sticks for the ball because it never goes near them.

Overall the ref had a god game last but was let down very badly by the night TMO. Showed a lot of common sense at the end by really ignoring his t judge's flag for a meaningless offence but had to award a penalty so the t judge was not offended.
Thanks for you report on the ref. But what do you think of the Dragons performance Darren (sorry Rob)?
[quote][p][bold]Robert Shillabeer[/bold] wrote: There were three very poor decisions that went against the Dragons last night. Firstly the try that wasn't then the kick that was touched by a Scarlet which the touch judge correctly indicated to be over rule by the ref on advice from the crowd, have already tweeted the ref on this issue but no response yet (not holding my breath though). Thirdly the Scarlets prop was continuously boring in at right angles and disrupting the Dragons front row. You can say that was because the Dragons front row was weak, but not many front rows can cope with that for long. Scrums need far stricter control by match officials as there is far too much law breaking going on, balls put in crooked, into the second row, boring in and taking the scrum down when the ball is lost. Just about every side do one or more of the foregoing while the hooker never or at best rarely sticks for the ball because it never goes near them. Overall the ref had a god game last but was let down very badly by the night TMO. Showed a lot of common sense at the end by really ignoring his t judge's flag for a meaningless offence but had to award a penalty so the t judge was not offended.[/p][/quote]Thanks for you report on the ref. But what do you think of the Dragons performance Darren (sorry Rob)? Monster Munch McCoy

12:41pm Sat 6 Oct 12

East Newport Dave says...

As I have said before, if the Dragons were good enough the refereeing would not be an issue. They were well beaten last night and the score flattered them. I foresee a few 50-70 point defeats around the corner. The Dragons are that poor!
As I have said before, if the Dragons were good enough the refereeing would not be an issue. They were well beaten last night and the score flattered them. I foresee a few 50-70 point defeats around the corner. The Dragons are that poor! East Newport Dave

12:45pm Sat 6 Oct 12

East Newport Dave says...

As I have said before, if the Dragons were good enough the refereeing would not be an issue. They were well beaten last night and the score flattered them. I foresee a few 50-70 point defeats around the corner. The Dragons are that poor!
As I have said before, if the Dragons were good enough the refereeing would not be an issue. They were well beaten last night and the score flattered them. I foresee a few 50-70 point defeats around the corner. The Dragons are that poor! East Newport Dave

12:54pm Sat 6 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

Monster munch I was not criticising the ref he is about the only one in the Rabo who does do his job right. But, he did make three mistakes yesterday albeit one was actually the TMO. The pack would work better if they ALL Played in accordance with the laws of the game however. The Scarlets were driving in all night without any correction by the ref, points I have expressed to him but nt ad a reply or even an acknowledgement and don't expect one to be honest.
Monster munch I was not criticising the ref he is about the only one in the Rabo who does do his job right. But, he did make three mistakes yesterday albeit one was actually the TMO. The pack would work better if they ALL Played in accordance with the laws of the game however. The Scarlets were driving in all night without any correction by the ref, points I have expressed to him but nt ad a reply or even an acknowledgement and don't expect one to be honest. Robert Shillabeer

1:03pm Sat 6 Oct 12

Doberman1 says...

Robert Shillabeer wrote:
Monster munch I was not criticising the ref he is about the only one in the Rabo who does do his job right. But, he did make three mistakes yesterday albeit one was actually the TMO. The pack would work better if they ALL Played in accordance with the laws of the game however. The Scarlets were driving in all night without any correction by the ref, points I have expressed to him but nt ad a reply or even an acknowledgement and don't expect one to be honest.
And your thoughts on DE & the team Robert?
Also did anyone notice last week how Dan Lydiate was "walked" off the pitch by the physios, despite having a broken & dislocated ankle, unbeleivable... Professionalism comes in many forms, but never at The Dragons.
[quote][p][bold]Robert Shillabeer[/bold] wrote: Monster munch I was not criticising the ref he is about the only one in the Rabo who does do his job right. But, he did make three mistakes yesterday albeit one was actually the TMO. The pack would work better if they ALL Played in accordance with the laws of the game however. The Scarlets were driving in all night without any correction by the ref, points I have expressed to him but nt ad a reply or even an acknowledgement and don't expect one to be honest.[/p][/quote]And your thoughts on DE & the team Robert? Also did anyone notice last week how Dan Lydiate was "walked" off the pitch by the physios, despite having a broken & dislocated ankle, unbeleivable... Professionalism comes in many forms, but never at The Dragons. Doberman1

1:22pm Sat 6 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years.
They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years. Robert Shillabeer

1:37pm Sat 6 Oct 12

Doberman1 says...

Robert Shillabeer wrote:
They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years.
Robert, with such blinkered perspective on DE and the whole set up I can only think you must be an internal part of it. Your thoughts on Dan and his injury border on the ludicrous, I hope I never require you to administer first aid to me!
[quote][p][bold]Robert Shillabeer[/bold] wrote: They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years.[/p][/quote]Robert, with such blinkered perspective on DE and the whole set up I can only think you must be an internal part of it. Your thoughts on Dan and his injury border on the ludicrous, I hope I never require you to administer first aid to me! Doberman1

2:00pm Sat 6 Oct 12

cwmbran man says...

The Dragons have been a team without a brain for a couple of years, managing to steal defeat from the jaws of victory on many occasions, they are weak in both players and especially management and are a great advert for there being just 3 regions.
The Dragons have been a team without a brain for a couple of years, managing to steal defeat from the jaws of victory on many occasions, they are weak in both players and especially management and are a great advert for there being just 3 regions. cwmbran man

2:02pm Sat 6 Oct 12

cwmbran man says...

On the plus side i am making fortunes backing against them, week in, week out, so would miss the gravy train if its disbanded.
On the plus side i am making fortunes backing against them, week in, week out, so would miss the gravy train if its disbanded. cwmbran man

2:17pm Sat 6 Oct 12

Monster Munch McCoy says...

Robert Shillabeer wrote:
They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years.
Robert, So your summary is that DE is doing the best he can but the team he has got are a load of rubbish?

Also I though we have one of last years Scarlets front row forwards, Iestyn Thomas, in our coaching set up. What insider knowledge did he bring for last night.

If that's right, it shows once again we have a another rookie coach we are giving experience to on the blessing of the WRU to help there development at our expense.
[quote][p][bold]Robert Shillabeer[/bold] wrote: They started to carry Dan off but he walked or rather hobbled to the side lines, perhaps it was his choice, but when a bone is broken carrying him or letting him hobble results in little more damage as the bone is broken. As to the question of DE he works with what he has and I'm sure he feels frustrated sometimes. As to the scrum, the Scarlets have the old Dragons scrum coach and he sure used his insider knowledge when preparing the Scarlets, would not be doing his job if he didn't but that's how it goes sometimes. Pease remember head coaches must work with what they ave and look at the changes other regions have gone through ver the years.[/p][/quote]Robert, So your summary is that DE is doing the best he can but the team he has got are a load of rubbish? Also I though we have one of last years Scarlets front row forwards, Iestyn Thomas, in our coaching set up. What insider knowledge did he bring for last night. If that's right, it shows once again we have a another rookie coach we are giving experience to on the blessing of the WRU to help there development at our expense. Monster Munch McCoy

6:25pm Sat 6 Oct 12

GazzaH says...

Said it before , Steffan Jones just hasn't got it at this level. Regardless of conditions he handed back territory to the Scarlets time and time again. As for the scrums, last nights Argus was effectively a stick to beat us with. Scarlets won;t come up against a poorer scrum again this season. A truly dreadful advert for the Pro 12.
Said it before , Steffan Jones just hasn't got it at this level. Regardless of conditions he handed back territory to the Scarlets time and time again. As for the scrums, last nights Argus was effectively a stick to beat us with. Scarlets won;t come up against a poorer scrum again this season. A truly dreadful advert for the Pro 12. GazzaH

8:51pm Sat 6 Oct 12

SWBorderer says...

I agree with Robert on his comments about the scrum, Lee was scrummaging illegally all evening, and I have been banging on about putting the ball in staight all season. Also, what happened to the Law that says the scrum must be stationary before the ball is put in.

Having said that, there is no excuse for the way we played, Stefan's kicking out of hand was abysmal, he is obviously out of his depth. The only people who haven't known for two years that our front row is too weak are the people responsible for organising the side.

I can't see any way we can improve with Edwards in charge, he is blind to the problems and appears to have little tactical awareness apart from throw the ball anywhere.

Robert, your comments about Dan's injury are mystifying, with the bone broken, the only support for the ankle is the tendons which can be even more serious if damaged, there is no way he should have been allowed to put any weight on that ankle. If the Dragons can't afford proper medical care, perhaps they could all sell their Mac books to raise the cash.

I shall be watching my Grandson's U14's tomorrow and I expect to see more skill and tactical awareness than I saw from the Dragons.
I agree with Robert on his comments about the scrum, Lee was scrummaging illegally all evening, and I have been banging on about putting the ball in staight all season. Also, what happened to the Law that says the scrum must be stationary before the ball is put in. Having said that, there is no excuse for the way we played, Stefan's kicking out of hand was abysmal, he is obviously out of his depth. The only people who haven't known for two years that our front row is too weak are the people responsible for organising the side. I can't see any way we can improve with Edwards in charge, he is blind to the problems and appears to have little tactical awareness apart from throw the ball anywhere. Robert, your comments about Dan's injury are mystifying, with the bone broken, the only support for the ankle is the tendons which can be even more serious if damaged, there is no way he should have been allowed to put any weight on that ankle. If the Dragons can't afford proper medical care, perhaps they could all sell their Mac books to raise the cash. I shall be watching my Grandson's U14's tomorrow and I expect to see more skill and tactical awareness than I saw from the Dragons. SWBorderer

11:02pm Sat 6 Oct 12

silurix says...

We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge.
We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge. silurix

3:05pm Sun 7 Oct 12

number12 says...

I'd like to see you carry the beast that is Dan Lydiate off the pitch (y)
I'd like to see you carry the beast that is Dan Lydiate off the pitch (y) number12

5:21pm Sun 7 Oct 12

dereksboy says...

Not surprised Derek Simmonds didn't give that obvious penalty decision ! I can remember when he used to ref Newport I'm surprised he gave us that try. What's the point of a TMO if they can't make the right decision. Guess where he's from?
Not surprised Derek Simmonds didn't give that obvious penalty decision ! I can remember when he used to ref Newport I'm surprised he gave us that try. What's the point of a TMO if they can't make the right decision. Guess where he's from? dereksboy

10:26am Mon 8 Oct 12

dalesman1666 says...

Dereksboy So yet again this week it was not only the referees fault it was also the tmo.Do you know how silly you sound, The dragons can only be described as the weakest region in wales.The clock is ticking.
The best way to watch the dragons is with a remote in your hand +with one click there gone.
Dereksboy So yet again this week it was not only the referees fault it was also the tmo.Do you know how silly you sound, The dragons can only be described as the weakest region in wales.The clock is ticking. The best way to watch the dragons is with a remote in your hand +with one click there gone. dalesman1666

1:44pm Mon 8 Oct 12

dereksboy says...

I was not commenting on the poor display by the Dragons but on the pathetic verdict by the TMO when the ball clearly went over as was proved on Scrum V.Perhaps if the WRU were a little more generous with their payments Dragons might be able to sign some decent players. Read Mr. Moffett's comments.
I was not commenting on the poor display by the Dragons but on the pathetic verdict by the TMO when the ball clearly went over as was proved on Scrum V.Perhaps if the WRU were a little more generous with their payments Dragons might be able to sign some decent players. Read Mr. Moffett's comments. dereksboy

2:26pm Mon 8 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

silurix wrote:
We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge.
Silurex you are quite right more money is needed at all four regions but when you look at the facilities coming on stream at Rodney Parade there is some improvement in that area and without having to get into more debt than can be managed thanks to Mr Brown and his know how. On Scrum V last night there was talk about the lack of money being put in by the WRU in year that saw them make £62 million profit without putting much back into the regional game and hence the Premiership/Champion
ship level. It seems they pay out the minimum to lower level clubs rather than the higher levels out of some unknown reasons. The lower level clubs need financial support yes but it should be shared out better. £40 million shared out by the four regions, premiership, championship and the various divisions that make up Welsh rugby on a balanced basis will do more to strengthen Welsh rugby that a big fat bank balance at the top in Wales.
[quote][p][bold]silurix[/bold] wrote: We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge.[/p][/quote]Silurex you are quite right more money is needed at all four regions but when you look at the facilities coming on stream at Rodney Parade there is some improvement in that area and without having to get into more debt than can be managed thanks to Mr Brown and his know how. On Scrum V last night there was talk about the lack of money being put in by the WRU in year that saw them make £62 million profit without putting much back into the regional game and hence the Premiership/Champion ship level. It seems they pay out the minimum to lower level clubs rather than the higher levels out of some unknown reasons. The lower level clubs need financial support yes but it should be shared out better. £40 million shared out by the four regions, premiership, championship and the various divisions that make up Welsh rugby on a balanced basis will do more to strengthen Welsh rugby that a big fat bank balance at the top in Wales. Robert Shillabeer

2:35pm Mon 8 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

silurix wrote:
We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge.
Silurex you are quite right more money is needed at all four regions but when you look at the facilities coming on stream at Rodney Parade there is some improvement in that area and without having to get into more debt than can be managed thanks to Mr Brown and his know how. On Scrum V last night there was talk about the lack of money being put in by the WRU in year that saw them make £62 million profit without putting much back into the regional game and hence the Premiership/Champion
ship level. It seems they pay out the minimum to lower level clubs rather than the higher levels out of some unknown reasons. The lower level clubs need financial support yes but it should be shared out better. £40 million shared out by the four regions, premiership, championship and the various divisions that make up Welsh rugby on a balanced basis will do more to strengthen Welsh rugby that a big fat bank balance at the top in Wales.
[quote][p][bold]silurix[/bold] wrote: We lost the services of Luke Charteris, Aled Brew, Lloyd Burns, Jason Tovey, Tom Willis and Gavin Thomas for this season. With all due respect , the replacements may eventually make the grade , but they have not done so yet. Can't fault their effort last night , but the skill levels on display, with a few exceptions , were of a poor standard. Quality will sometimes see you through bad patches , but the Dragons don't have enough of it - they need to overperform every week just to stand still. I think that was why Tony Brown was asking for more resources for the regions from the WRU. He knows that the Dragons will be up against it without the extra quality that only more cash will make possible. I think "plucky losers" is the only title we can win this season as things stand. Whether a new coach would make any difference is a matter of opinion. Its possible, but not guaranteed. The same financial constraints would apply to whoever was in charge.[/p][/quote]Silurex you are quite right more money is needed at all four regions but when you look at the facilities coming on stream at Rodney Parade there is some improvement in that area and without having to get into more debt than can be managed thanks to Mr Brown and his know how. On Scrum V last night there was talk about the lack of money being put in by the WRU in year that saw them make £62 million profit without putting much back into the regional game and hence the Premiership/Champion ship level. It seems they pay out the minimum to lower level clubs rather than the higher levels out of some unknown reasons. The lower level clubs need financial support yes but it should be shared out better. £40 million shared out by the four regions, premiership, championship and the various divisions that make up Welsh rugby on a balanced basis will do more to strengthen Welsh rugby that a big fat bank balance at the top in Wales. Robert Shillabeer

3:06pm Mon 8 Oct 12

silurix says...

I agree with you on the funding issue Robert. Not so long ago the finances of the WRU were in a chaotic state so they had to be careful with funding levels. But the debt problem seems to be under control now so they have more leeway. As Mike Cuddy says, it was the regions' benefactors who kept professional rugby afloat during the difficult times. The WRU should acknowledge this by greater generosity now that they have the means to do so. Some credit must be given to Mr Lewis for overseeing this recovery but it would also help if he exercised more control over his tongue and behaved in a more professional manner when engaged in dialogue with those with whom he has to do business.
I agree with you on the funding issue Robert. Not so long ago the finances of the WRU were in a chaotic state so they had to be careful with funding levels. But the debt problem seems to be under control now so they have more leeway. As Mike Cuddy says, it was the regions' benefactors who kept professional rugby afloat during the difficult times. The WRU should acknowledge this by greater generosity now that they have the means to do so. Some credit must be given to Mr Lewis for overseeing this recovery but it would also help if he exercised more control over his tongue and behaved in a more professional manner when engaged in dialogue with those with whom he has to do business. silurix

3:18pm Mon 8 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

Sliurix there is an old saying attack when your argument is at it's weakest and that is what Mr Lewis is doing. There is no case for the WRU to put £62 million away in the bank while the rest of the game is struggling to manage on minor handouts. If Rugby in Wales is to go from strength to strength the basic funding needs to be shared better with the food store of the National side, the regions and the championship and for them to get better the lower or starting levels need to be looked after as well as the national coffers. The long awaited review should hopefully put a better understanding of the issues of finance forward but when is it to be published or is there something in it that shows the WRU in a bad light I wonder.
Sliurix there is an old saying attack when your argument is at it's weakest and that is what Mr Lewis is doing. There is no case for the WRU to put £62 million away in the bank while the rest of the game is struggling to manage on minor handouts. If Rugby in Wales is to go from strength to strength the basic funding needs to be shared better with the food store of the National side, the regions and the championship and for them to get better the lower or starting levels need to be looked after as well as the national coffers. The long awaited review should hopefully put a better understanding of the issues of finance forward but when is it to be published or is there something in it that shows the WRU in a bad light I wonder. Robert Shillabeer

8:22pm Mon 8 Oct 12

Keith Barnett says...

The WRU won't start doing anything until Wales start losing. Which in my opinion will start at the next 6 nations. Too many good players abroad now. Those that are left with Dragons and Blues are with struggling regions and the good players will clear off from them soon.
The WRU need to invest in the Regions before they spiral out of existence
It's about funding and the Welsh Regions are the poorest in the Northern Hemisphere
The WRU won't start doing anything until Wales start losing. Which in my opinion will start at the next 6 nations. Too many good players abroad now. Those that are left with Dragons and Blues are with struggling regions and the good players will clear off from them soon. The WRU need to invest in the Regions before they spiral out of existence It's about funding and the Welsh Regions are the poorest in the Northern Hemisphere Keith Barnett

12:12am Tue 9 Oct 12

Robert Shillabeer says...

Perhaps you have some valid points Kieth, but until the report is published we won't know how it will go. The two Welsh internationals the Dragons have are not diverted by the big money I don't think so sre more homely boys and could well stay in Wales even if they go to another region, but would that mean more pay? Welsh. Rugby is at a cross roads, the report must put more back into Welsh rugby or it wil fall back to where it was twenty years ago, struggling to produce good players and losing ground to the opposition big time.
Perhaps you have some valid points Kieth, but until the report is published we won't know how it will go. The two Welsh internationals the Dragons have are not diverted by the big money I don't think so sre more homely boys and could well stay in Wales even if they go to another region, but would that mean more pay? Welsh. Rugby is at a cross roads, the report must put more back into Welsh rugby or it wil fall back to where it was twenty years ago, struggling to produce good players and losing ground to the opposition big time. Robert Shillabeer

1:25pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Euwan Usami says...

I think in the short term it will aid the Welsh side; The WRU will still pick players playing abroad, improving thier game while the Pro12 is forced to blood younsters that also improve and come through at the same time. Long term the standard may drop in Wales as a result but, in all honesty I dont think anyone can predict the future long term in Wales anyway.
I think in the short term it will aid the Welsh side; The WRU will still pick players playing abroad, improving thier game while the Pro12 is forced to blood younsters that also improve and come through at the same time. Long term the standard may drop in Wales as a result but, in all honesty I dont think anyone can predict the future long term in Wales anyway. Euwan Usami

10:39am Sat 3 Nov 12

Laugh a minute says...

Well I have to say what a shambles! No player anywhere in the world takes the field with the intention of having a bad game. The players may not be at that level, it may be down to fitness, conditioning, game structure, belief, player buy in, etc, but no player purposely to have a bad game.

Lets look at the DoR - for me he is the man appointed to oversee all of those elements and quite frankly he is no where near it. In the modern era of professional sport you do not need a DoR who is steeped in rugby history or tradition (aka Crosskeys and Newbridge) you need professionals from the commercial world who understand how to measure demand of the modern game, design your approaches to satisfy demand, select the right people, players, coaches, medical backup, analysts who have an edge, not happy with the status quo, never standing still and thinking outside the box. Steve Jobs of Apple said "get up every morning with vigour and surround yourself with talented people" exactly the same in sport. don't moan about money, resources, players, produce your own, set new standards, don't follow other regions look at what the best in the world are doing and do it better. Unfortunately we have the current incumbent Beale and his ill matched team of coaches and support staff all looking over their shoulder to see who to blame, The Board, The DoR, The Coaches, The Players, The WRU, The Name, I could go on and on, read the postings it will follow the pattern laid out above.

Quite simply guys, we have employed the wrong person who is not equipped to do the job. He in turn has appointed the wrong Team of coaches, medics etc, who invariably will set poor standards because that's all they know, which in turn promotes the wrong culture, hence the results.

So in essence Beale is out of there tomorrow, and for the good of Gwent don't appoint an imbecile like Kingsley Jones, (look at Phil Davies a replica model, who will get the boot from Cardiff in the not to distant future) search for the right person irrespective of their rugby backgrounds, do they have the right characteristics, FTSE 100 experience, large budgets and Large P & L exposure, turnaround experience, relationship management for sponsorship and marketing, demonstrable record of selecting talented people and proof of delivering the required outcomes. I sincerely hope the Board of the Dragons or WRU read this for the good of the game in Gwent and ultimately Wales
Well I have to say what a shambles! No player anywhere in the world takes the field with the intention of having a bad game. The players may not be at that level, it may be down to fitness, conditioning, game structure, belief, player buy in, etc, but no player purposely to have a bad game. Lets look at the DoR - for me he is the man appointed to oversee all of those elements and quite frankly he is no where near it. In the modern era of professional sport you do not need a DoR who is steeped in rugby history or tradition (aka Crosskeys and Newbridge) you need professionals from the commercial world who understand how to measure demand of the modern game, design your approaches to satisfy demand, select the right people, players, coaches, medical backup, analysts who have an edge, not happy with the status quo, never standing still and thinking outside the box. Steve Jobs of Apple said "get up every morning with vigour and surround yourself with talented people" exactly the same in sport. don't moan about money, resources, players, produce your own, set new standards, don't follow other regions look at what the best in the world are doing and do it better. Unfortunately we have the current incumbent Beale and his ill matched team of coaches and support staff all looking over their shoulder to see who to blame, The Board, The DoR, The Coaches, The Players, The WRU, The Name, I could go on and on, read the postings it will follow the pattern laid out above. Quite simply guys, we have employed the wrong person who is not equipped to do the job. He in turn has appointed the wrong Team of coaches, medics etc, who invariably will set poor standards because that's all they know, which in turn promotes the wrong culture, hence the results. So in essence Beale is out of there tomorrow, and for the good of Gwent don't appoint an imbecile like Kingsley Jones, (look at Phil Davies a replica model, who will get the boot from Cardiff in the not to distant future) search for the right person irrespective of their rugby backgrounds, do they have the right characteristics, FTSE 100 experience, large budgets and Large P & L exposure, turnaround experience, relationship management for sponsorship and marketing, demonstrable record of selecting talented people and proof of delivering the required outcomes. I sincerely hope the Board of the Dragons or WRU read this for the good of the game in Gwent and ultimately Wales Laugh a minute

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